Where Donovan Mitchell stands entering 2024 | Cleveland Cavaliers podcast

Where Donovan Mitchell stands entering 2024 | Cleveland Cavaliers podcast

On today’s show Donovan Mitchell in 2024 what’s the deal man let’s talk about him are locked on Cavs your daily Cleveland Cavaliers podcast today’s episode is brought to you by priz piix the easiest and most exciting way to play daily fantasy sports go to prs.com backlock on NBA and use code all

Lowercase locked on NBA for a first deposit match up to $100 I’m Chris Manning that is Evan deal thanks again to Jake Stevens as always for his work on production Today’s Show is all about Donovan Mitchell we’re going to start by talking about the Mitchell specific Fallout of the Knicks Raptor trade we’re

Going to touch in segment two about what Mitchell is right now exactly in the prime of his career where he is among the leag hierarchy how you build with him as your best guy in segment three what the future with him looks like that is going to be and the speculation until

Something happens one way or the other we’ll talk about it we’ll make some predictions what the C war will do we’ll get to that in segment three but the start Evan let me ask you this first when you see the Knicks go make this OG and and noi trade

And trade quickly and trade Barrett and only trade one pick and and you know ultimately give up just two players in the one pick so Sil a cashier of picks and you just look at what they did where do you think this leads them as like being a team that can actually make

Cleveland if it comes to that and I don’t want to get too hard of like did that change your view at all about like where they could be as far as a team goes that could make a real offer for Mitchell at at some point in the future

I mean realistically speaking I think the Knicks are always going to be the in-house favor to acquire Donovan Mitchell if Mitchell makes it clear to um the Cavs that like hey I don’t intend on sticking around long term uh you can ride this out and maybe they can

Try and keep convincing him with the Cavs believe internally they may have the leg up on everybody else still um and sure like Donovan’s never going to like say it publicly like yo I want out of here or anything like that but the expectation coming out Utah last year

Was that he expected to end up with the Knicks and I do wonder if in his hard of Hearts he still expects end up there if it that does become like completely true um yeah you have to wonder how they navigate and I think the Knicks are the

Favorite no matter what um but I know Mark Stein reported this uh that like the Knicks have kind of cooled on the prospects of getting Mitchell and then Adrien wowski goes on um NBA today or whatever it’s called on ESPN it says like the Knicks are looking to kind of

Avoid entering that second luxury tax apron and certainly acquiring Mitchell could put them in that range and make things really muddy for them uh and they probably have to like maybe shift a lot of bodies around and maybe the juice isn’t worth the squeeze but I think

Until cuz like you said or you and I were talking about this before the show started rather um the conversations that are being shared publicly could not line up with what’s being shared internally because some teams you know everything’s fluid nothing’s really static um everything shifts on a day-to-day basis

But like yeah for now I would say the Nick or no matter what like interest or not like Mitchell could just make it abundantly clear like hey this is where I want to go and if the Cavs want to oblig him um and do right by him I think

They could and I wonder what Cleveland could kind of get back considering like I I think it’s not a hot take to say Donovan Mitchell is better than OG an anobi but like an anobi does provide like a premium commodity in basketball and the Knicks didn’t feel like they

Gave up a lot I know like it depends on how you feel about RJ Barett and Emanuel quickly but only one draft pick as you said um just to get ogi and of course um Malachi fing impress sucha too but canobi is the main Central focus of this

Trade for the new for New York work so I wonder like do the Cavs give more is it come something comparable is it slightly more than that like I I do wonder what the the package is just because like Mitchell does put together stronger Seasons but he’s had two playoff outings

In a row he completely Flames out and I wonder if that makes teams cool on him and a lot ofy teams probably aren’t high on a shorter guard who relies on his athleticism entering his 30s like that’s going to tap out eventually but yeah I wonder what the market holds and but he

Will be attractive ass it come this summer if the Cavs can’t come to terms on an agreement when Mitchell made it clear like that’s the earliest he’ll entertain a contract extension with the Cavs okay so we out there yeah I know I on it yeah so I there’s just a lot of

Different strands to to kind of pull out I I think here’s the exact wording on the Stein report initial indications are that the Knicks do not intend to me an all out pursuit of Donovan Mitchell the Cleveland Cavaliers for that matter signal to rival teams throughout December that they aren’t prepared to to

Entertain Mitchell overtures any we’ll come back to that last Point later because a lot of other people have reported that same thing what I where I come down on this is is is split because you could to me look at what the Knicks now have if it comes to that and

Say okay you traded a manual quickly who I really like and yes you have the pain but that that’s a guy that you could fit with and build with RJ is salary filler I would prefer versus the other options they still have quitting crimes they have a ton of

Picks you have Julius Randall might have to be the salary that’s not something that from Cleveland that entertains me that you have to find a third place for him probably and maybe a pick’s going there to satiate a team in that regard I think it is both possible that

They aren’t going to pursue something all out right now but I I and I think like in the short term this makes it like harder than it already was to see something happen with Mitchell like that in in the next month what I do wonder

And I still feel like the roster set up that way for the them to make some kind of star trade and that could be Mitchell you could pick other names that who someone else come available but I’m still I still feel like that is a possibility for them and it it if

They’re even if they’re saying there’s no allout Pursuit right now that doesn’t mean there’s like allout Pursuit means something to me different than like there there’s no Pursuit that that’s that’s if you want to parse the wording all means something very different than just like they being a simple Pursuit

Yeah and like an allout Pursuit is the Knicks are trying to trade for Donovan Mitchell tomorrow I think an allout Pursuit well and Trey during the reg season the last time the Knicks did one was when they went to go get Carmelo like that was an all out Pursuit they

Didn’t do it for Donovan Mitchell a year ago correct and I think like you had noted I think it’s the due diligence of any team I would imagine other rival organizations are keeping their finger on the pulse of the Mitchell situation didto for the C they’re keeping their

Fingers on the pulse just to see like hey is he happy here like he has stressed several times like I will stick where I think I have the best chance to win more than anything like I think he is going to consider the offc court

Stuff too that comes with it but like is Cleveland the best location for him to win because he can hop in PJ anytime he wants to go watch the Mets play he he has done that plenty of times even with the Cavs like during preseason when the

Mets were on the play in their playoff run but um it’s a little tricky I guess and like you said like I don’t think the teams are going to be rushing to trade Mitchell at the deadline neither is Cleveland like unless like this relationship suddenly becomes untenable between now and February 8th

Like the Cavs are more than comfortable like letting this ride until the off season and like I I feel like people saying that the Cavs are rushing to move him now or teams are looking to acquire him now like no they’re going to kind of play the long game and see where this

Goes just because like hey what if he does entertain a contract extension and then ultim end up signing something with Cleveland this summer like this conversation’s over or I think the market just really starts to open up at the Cavs like make him a legitimate contract extension offer and he politely

Declines it whether it’s financials or like he’s waiting to see what’s best for him I think that’s when you ultimately see like the the trade speculation for him really start to heat up we will see I think this is not done and I think I understand if people feel

A certain way about it this is just the we’ll get to this again in segment 3 in real detail but until Donovan Mitchell signs or does not sign an extension this is just kind of the gray area they live in and that’s unfortunate but it’s just I think part of the

Reality they are in with him right now and it’s it’s for for Cleveland I think if you’re looking at that next trade you’re absolutely thinking about that in some way all right coming up next what is Mitchell right now let’s talk about him what he is where he stands all of

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Those odds and more up on FanDuel all right we are back here on locked on Cavs let’s talk about what Mitchell is as a star player if he is your best guy what does that mean and how good is he really so I ask you kind of an open tic question with where

Cleveland is at right now he is definitely the team’s best player what it what to you is the ceiling on a team what is the the the height a team can reach if Donovan Mitchell is the best player in your basketball team he’s a top 15 to top 10

To 20 guys somewhere in that range I think is where I would I’d say he’s more top 15 to 20 right now just kind of giving the emerence to some younger players and we can into being generous being a little kind up to the the top 10

Perhaps but what is he is your best guy to you um I think he is a high level scorer that can get you buckets from anywhere whether it’s at the free throw line the three-point Arc or on the interior or in the mid-range where he really thrives at times especially for

Cleveland um as I had noted he is a smaller guard that is hyper athletic and just has that motor that runs hot and I think I was get discrediting him a little bit bit cuz he does rely on his athleticism for some insane plays and I think that will fade over time just

Because that just tends to happen when smaller guards hit 30 they start to kind of find a bit of a cliff but because he is such a good shooting threat like that that can age well and he that can carry him through the The Embers of his Prime

And into like the Twilight of his career but right now just because like sure he does try harder on defense for JB Baker staff there are Still Moments he still hasn’t been great this season or even last season when he wasn’t perfect um it’s hard because he doesn’t have

Like the passing vision of a Darius Garland or just any like elite point guard or just like playmaker so like yeah you can play him at point but like it’s only going to get you so far and he is very hel heliocentric to the offense as well or like the offense is very

Reliant on him hitting those shots or at least you know you have to sacrifice a lot of opportunities for him to find a groov and Rhythm and are you comfortable doing that like with a championship level team or just even a playoff caliber team which I think he instantly

Makes any team he joins as long as there’s existing Talent around him of course but um like right now like just looking at like where the Cavs are at like because of injuries they are fighting to avoid the play in but they could ultimately end up there I think if

They’re fully healthy they have a chance to get through it and maybe they go down swinging in the first round like right now like their floor to me is a second round exit and their ceiling is still like a Conference Final Contender where Mitchell isn’t the like in like the very

Best players the league offers but he’s in the Hall of very great which is obviously a step of above very good but he does have some downsides to his game that you really have to adjust adjust excuse me and adapt for whether it’s on offense or defense and I think that can

Give some teams pause considering like if you do think you’re more of a complete product and you’re maybe a star away if if he becomes your best player like can he adapt things or can your coaching staff and the existing team adapt things to make him fit because he

Probably are going to end up paying a bit of a premium commodity to acquire him if the Cav is to me like trade him or something but this isn’t I guess like the exact conversation but just as a follow-up you so you think their floor right now based

On what we’ve seen so far is still second like their their Baseline is SEC you said second run of the playoffs that’s their floor I think that’s their floor um if they avoid the play The Worst the worst they could do it would be the worst they could do is

They make it to the second round of the playoffs and they draw Boston or Milwaukee or even Philadelphia or any of the other teams that maybe upset one of the aformentioned teams like I could see Cleveland getting past some of the lower teams in the East that maybe sneak in

Like I think the best of seven against Indiana would be a throw up in the air but like Orlando that would be a a slugfest I think the Cavs could get through it because the magic have no playoff experience I think um the heat they’re just such a weird team like

Maybe that’s a team that beats Cleveland in the first round or the Cavs just handle and take care of business against Miami um but yeah I could see them at least just given what they’ve done in the off season like they have more depth in Talent available so instead of having

Like five and a half players that are viable the Caps can Trot out seven to eight viable players with some Choice situation dudes that could kind of Swing some momentum at moments for them in the playoffs well how do you feel I I don’t I I I don’t think their floor is second

Round I I don’t think there’s anything in I understand injuries but like if they’re Bas line like they didn’t even make the second round last year and they were a much better team last year so I don’t understand how that’s their floor I guess I guess is where I’m I think I

Look at him like statistically speaking yes they were a better team last year but I think in terms of your talent and like you said injuries do happen but like the gavs didn’t have Max Shu on the roster last year like I know George dang has his wordss but like he does provide

Shooting I think Sam Marl realistically does never plays for this team in the playoffs so this team is fully healthy be like he has showcased some stability where like you can give him some run especially if he’s able to provide you some shooting like the Cavs do and are

Finding options to modernize this team a little bit and the problem is it depends on who you draw in the first round like if it’s the Knicks and let’s say oan noobi slows down Donovan Mitchell or the mick Nicks scheme up their game plan to slow down Mitchell entirely and they

Forc the Cavs to lean on like Mo and Garland to create everything like New York kind of did last year that’s more of a first round exit but I I just I guess I look at this team I’m like they did address a lot of the clear needs

They needed had in terms of shooting and it’s still not a perfect finished product by any means and it’s hard to evaluate it because they’re not healthy but I I just I think I think at least given the talent and growth of some of the players internally and just

The guys they brought in like I think second round floor is a little more fair even if they didn’t even make the second or put up much of if any of a fight against New York in the first round last year I just don’t I don’t know how you

Get there I this team is fifth 18 and fifth on their eighth if the season ended today and it doesn’t they’d be playing in the 78 in the play in against the Knicks they would then if they let’s say win that they’re they’re they’re playing the Bucks in round one yeah

That’s a different story and like I said like if in the play if they avoid if theyo the play five yeah four or five they’re going to Happ in four or five if they’re fully healthy and things like turn around right at the right time and that’s ideally like Evan Mobley is back

And doesn’t have any issues with his knee and Darius Garland doesn’t isn’t as fragile as he has been in the past and is’s able to play the rest of the year like yeah four or five is like their ceiling in terms of just like Eastern Conference standings which is a

Disappointing of itself cuz you’re they’d make that leap to be in like the top three or maybe four depending on things like panned out for Philly and it’s panning out pretty great for Philly so top four now um but like they are in that four five talk and they will have a

Tough outing but I think they have the capability to win it if they’re either the four seed or like the five seed depending on who they face like that’s if that’s New York Orlando Indiana Miami or any of those other teams are kind of muddled with right now um not at the

Summit of the East yeah I we’re in different pages here here’s just what I’ll say about Mitchell is your best guy I think you do need to get another Creator they have that in Garland it’s maybe defensively creat some problems you need a lot of shooting I think

They’ve gone the one thing I do age with you on here is as far as the way they’ve gone about shooting they’ve added shooting to fit him I think with him as your best guy there’s there’s just very specific things I think you need to and I think ultimately if I’m building out

Like the best version of Mitchell I don’t necessarily know if he’s the like I think if true true title Contender A True True Team to compete to the top of the East I don’t really know if he’s the I don’t know if he’s the best guy on

Your team I think he can be like a 1A think he could be like if you put him in a situation where like the best and this is some of the promise of Moy and I think it just hasn’t happened obviously there’s a world where like he’s a really

Good like it’s similar to like the Dame Giannis Dynamic where like Dame is often closing those games offensively he’s doing all the creating he’s doing all the scoring he has the ball in his hands a lot but Giannis is the overall best guy and he’s the defensive tone Setter

If you get that kind of Star level with Mitchell which is obviously very hard to do you could do some stuff there but like that right but I’m but I’m but that’s kind of my point is I think like Mitchell as your best guy I think there

Are some big limitations and I think if you can either build the infrastructure around him or he’s with that kind of guy that’s kind of the best case for him where either he’s like a number two in that situation or everything else around him is just kind

Of key to him to make up for the things he’s not great at and like he’s not a great defender I think he was better last year than he’s been this year’s been fine I think creative wise he’s not up to the par of like a Devon Booker or

Some of the other shooting guards in the league I think he’s really good he’s a top 15 to 20 10 to 20 guy he’s having another really good offensive year but I think they he’s not he’s he’s not in that upper up r as good as he is and I think they you

See some of the limitations of like if that’s your lead lead guy I think some of the limitations you see with Cleveland are just when Mitchell is your league guy I think there are just some limitations there that’s again not to say that he’s not very good it’s just

The league is so competitive at the top and the margins are so thin that sometimes like you can have really good players in situations that don’t totally work he’s not the only player on a team right now that he’s this good and his team’s not that good

It’s just really hard to win NBA games in 2023 it just it just is I mean you look at Atlanta and like Trey Young’s like say that’s an aler guy that team is not particularly good you look at the Warriors right now they’re 15 and 17 the

Lakers are 510th in the west they have the best player in my opinion of all time the Suns have Kevin Durant Devin Booker and Bradley be who I know haven’t played a a lot but like they’re 18 and 15 like this is having great players does not 100% translate to the most most

Amount it wins it’s there’s a lot that goes into and I think with Mitchell there’s certain characters you have to build into it um I think maybe we should do another episode at some point about like where the season is going cuz you got my brain rolling about like their

Floor being in the second round cuz I just I am I I am not there and I am somewhat of a pessimist um prag I would say I’m pragmatic but there’s just nothing I’ve seen there’s just nothing I just haven’t you got to show you got to

Like you are what your record says you are to some degree and like and you’re your numbers and it’s just like that’s I I respect your optimism my friend I didn’t know you had that in all right coming up next Mitchell in the future yeah I really didn’t know that’s this is

Like that’s wild it blew my mind all right coming up next what the future with him looks like we’ll talk about some of the reporting what that means all of that up next today’s episode is brought to you by our friends at prize pick prize picks

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Prix.com backlock innba and use code locked innba for a first deposit match up to $100 PR picks daily fantasy sports Made Easy all right so well here’s just the the first the the big bit of reporting we have on Mitchell in the trade market as of right now Zack low Mark Stein Jake fiser and I believe Shams I might be wrong about that last one but at least those first

Three have all reported in one way or the other in different wording and different contexts that the Cavs have not taking Mitchell over to this point that they that they are not going to look to trade him this month and I mean here’s what I will say I think about that on its

Face the message that trading Donovan Mitchell right let’s just say February 1st the they are they’re similar record now he’s they’re getting an energy and he’s his Camp’s like ah we don’t really want to sign an extension and they decide that to trade him I understand like pragmatically where that

Could come to that in the summer or whatever I I get that that’s a reality you could be staring down but to do it in season the message that would send to the team I think the me that s to your fan base I don’t think that that’s like

A like from a purely PR perspective you can’t make decisions fully in in that way but boy that would be a really really uncomfortable um reality I think to put yourself in as far as having to sell that kind of trade in season and like for that reason alone don’t trade

Him before the deadline if you have to trade him in the future fine don’t do it in the next month yeah um I just don’t see a world where the Cavs trade him tomorrow or when this or the day after this episode drops or the day this episode drops so tomorrow after we

Record this um or even at the trade deadline because one the Optics are just muddled and I think the Cavs do have the luxury of time like yes um he has again made it public on several occasions now that he will not entertain a trade or a

Discussion of a trade or like really what his future plans are with this team um until till maybe this summer at the early is when we know if the Cavs make an offer and like you said the feel out process just still isn’t quite as clean as maybe Cleveland would hoped it would

Be um but yeah like they do have the luxury of time on this side like he does have two years left on his contract before like he ultimately has to make that decision and whether or not he just doesn’t pick up his option the Cavs let him walk for nothing and sure that’s

Likely the path that both sides go down if they don’t reach an agreement and the Cavs decide not to trade him this Summer but again they do have like the luxury of time on their side to kind of figure out like what are the next steps what

Else can we do with our limited assets we don’t enter the enter excuse me that’s second luxury tax um threshold and it really hamstrings Us in terms of just making moves and doing things financially um and then like what what can we do just to ensure that one we can

Keep this guy that we invested quite a bit in and are willing to kind of drag out this relationship as long as possible to kind of figure this out and um yeah like I I think we really again know when this heats up or opens up come

This summer and like the Cavs at least publicly can say like we haven’t had the opportunity to evaluate this team when healthy and I think that is a valid like you know thing just to say just on the grand scheme of it all but also just more

Importantly you have to kind of figure out like what team you want to be um when you get to that point and maybe there’s more wholesale questions outside of Don Mitch like maybe Jared Allen is in the right fit cuz EV Mo’s clearly a center and you look to Mo Allen to find

Like a stretcher your four next to put next to moy and like that provides again more shooting next to Mitchell which is always a good smart thing and you kind of make keep making these I don’t want to say lateral moves but like chest moves outside of Mitchell or Mo or

Garland who I view as the three like perceived Untouchables until at least Mitchell makes his future intentions clear and if that’s not with Cleveland he does not become Untouchable but yeah it’s just smart Optics like I feel like you’re just throwing the bath water the baby out before the bath water at that

Point and making a rash impulse move if it feels like he’s not going to you know recommit um and I think the Cavs can kind of stick to their guns and Mitchell can stick to his and it’s just more of a who blinks first at this

Point I I think you get to the summer and he is not signing the extension he’s effectively on a on a in a walk gear at that point because I think he’s going to decline CU he he go get more guaranteed money for a longer amount of time like you’d be full

Hardy not to do that it I it would be hard for me to be in a world where like that doesn’t happen but here’s here’s just the the I guess the only thing I would say about this D just maybe try to end this in in

In a world where he does say I think there still is a world where the market breaks in a certain way where he does sign an extension I don’t know what that I don’t know how likely that is I don’t really know where this is going to end I

Think where the season goes is going to tell us a lot but Donovan Mitchell even if there are some concerns aside and and all of that and even if like the trade stuff maybe picks up again in the future cuz it could that that’s just the reality of this

Business if you if he wants to sign the extension in the summer you’re going to offer the most amount of money you can and you do it and you don’t think about it and you figure it out as you go a little bit you keep a guy this good if

You can and if you have to go the other way we can revisit like what this era has been but I think I think there’s no question Evan that to if you look at this year and this is why I wanted through this episode Mitchell where this team goes

And what he wants and where he decides he want to be at the end of the year is going to be the biggest story of of the 2024 calendar year what Mitchell wants where he says does he sign or not is going to shape the Cavs franchise Beyond

2024 it’s it’s one of the more Monumental decisions in recent memory and we’re getting close to some point of clarity I don’t know exactly what that looks like at there’s still a lot to happen there a lot we don’t know but I we’re headed towards some point of

Clarity with him in in within 2024 it’s it’s it’s that that Clarity is inevitable it’s not going to happen right away and I know folks for that are maybe more anxious about this than others that doesn’t give you the instant gratification that maybe you’re hoping for but you know that’s just the nature

Of the Beast and again like it’s going to be a little bit of like blinks verse kind of thing and also um more importantly like who is able to uh wait this out longer and I think both sides do have the luxury of time and a decision doesn’t need to be made

Right away but like you said like an answer will come it won’t come in February unless like again things just go completely sideways between now and February 8th and like the Mitchell’s just like all right I’m done here I want to move on now but yeah the the we will

Have to revisit this in the summer and also like do like a kind of a deep dive if he does move on because you just it it would be a very bitter pill to swallow like I know Chris said he is top 10 to top 15 I said he’s

Maybe top 15 to top 20 but like top I said I said top 10 to top sorry my apologies but I said top 15 to top 20 but like you don’t let those players go willy-nilly like fight tooth and nail to try to keep them um I think we saw the

Cavs kind of play the game a little bit with LeBron when they thought LeBron maybe would stay and they wouldn’t trade the pick that became Colin ston and um they were trying to convince LeBron to stay and maybe they would have done if LeBron said yes but maybe the Cavs

Have grown up a little bit from that cuz that was Kobe alin’s first here running the Cavs actually so we’ll we’ll see where this goes but yeah you don’t let those guys walk unless and without putting up a fight and just kind of thrown up your hands at the first

Instance of like outside noise or like even internal discomfort on the fact that he may be on his way out let’s end there I’m Chris Manning that’s s damal thanks to Jake stens we’ll be back at you after Cavs Wizards have a great Wednesday talk to everyone soon

On a new episode of Locked on Cavs (Wednesday, Jan. 3, 2024) hosts Chris Manning (@cwmwrites, The Just Basketball Show, SB Nation’s Fear the Sword, Forbes Sports) and Evan Dammarell (@AmNotEvan, Right Down Euclid) discuss the Donovan Mitchell related fallout of the Knicks-Raptors trade, look at what Mitchell is the best player on your team and why 2024 is such a big year for Mitchell and the Cavs.

This episode was produced by Jake Stephens. The intro music is from our friends at Astral Radio.

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