Who makes more sense for Miami Heat: Dejounte Murray or Terry Rozier? | Five on the Floor

Who makes more sense for Miami Heat: Dejounte Murray or Terry Rozier? | Five on the Floor

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Seen the block stop with one hand and P trust it’s have the guts we here to bring the heat y’all can hang it up welcome to five on the floor a daily Insider show on the Miami Heat and the NBA featuring Ethan scholet Greg sander and Alex Toledo plus others from the

Five reason Sports Network all right welcome back to five on the floor here’s today’s floor plan I’m Ethan scholnick you can follow me at Ethan J skolnick and five re in sports I got Alex too you can follow me at Tropical blanket make sure you check out

The 48 minute episode we went the full 48 that Greg sander and I did on the Kyle Lowry situation and I can tell you an entire NBA game pretty much uh n 95% of what we discussed in there uh we stand by it it held up we have added to

The other five % I’ve done that on off the floor uh so I’ll just say this at the very top here before we get to the topic of today’s episode and today’s floor plan what happened with Kyle Lowry on Friday and again as we’re speaking here on Sunday because this is when

We’re recording the episode a few hours before the Heat play in Orlando we don’t know if Kyle’s gonna be in the starting lineup today I was told he could be but don’t count on it so as some of our friends say could go either way uh but

Basically what happened was and I got this confirmed by a high level source that Kyle didn’t make shoot around on Friday that he flew back separately from the team and from Toronto they knew about it so it’s not like they were unaware of the situation they also knew

That he was delayed but he didn’t make it to shoot around and that’s not the first time by the way that he hasn’t but also at times Jimmy hasn’t um the team I think uh I don’t want to say they’ve gotten more LAX about that policy but I

Just I know that it’s happened in other occasions and what how it affected this situation was Eric spuler was considering a starting lineup change because he wanted to keep niiko yovic the starting lineup which I think is newsworthy in itself against uh the Atlanta Hawks and at that point Trey

Young was not ruled out so if you’re GNA include yic in the starting lineup you needed to have somebody else in the starting lineup who could guard Trey without Jimmy having to do it and so his intention was to put Caleb Martin in the starting lineup but he planned to

Discuss it with Kyle but Kyle wasn’t there then a couple of hours passed and they got the news after shoot around that Trey would not not be playing that he was out for the game but spoler decided to keep it as he intended with Caleb Martin in the starting lineup so I

Think when I suggested on the previous podcast that it was disciplinary um which I know other reporters had the same information or use that word that might have been a bridge too far it wasn’t necessarily disciplinary but there were a a lot of events that led to Kyle

Not starting and then of course Kyle after the game uh Barry Jackson of The Herald and I approached Kyle in the locker room and after I guess Ira was the one who asked spoler about it and he said it wasn’t disciplinary Etc Kyle said SPO just wanted to look at

Something different but that he expected to remain the starter so that’s where things are so I think to characterize it as disciplinary which is something I said in the previous podcast might have been a little too far but I can tell you that the person who told me that said

That generally what we discussed in the podcast was all true and you know again 9 5% of it was dead on point so uh we stand by all of that and we’ll see where the situation goes but where one of the places the situation could go Alex this

Is why I brought you in for this one is they could go get a point guard because they don’t have a point guard on the roster that they want to start like that that that’s that’s the big takea away from this that you know the Kyle wasn’t supposed to be the

Starter this year at the very you know best case scenario they were hoping to bring him off the bench manage his minutes and have him do something you know effective for him towards the playoffs that was what they wanted to do it didn’t turn out that way because they

Didn’t have another point guard on the roster Jimmy was out early in the season they had to elevate Kyle’s minutes uh Beyond where they wanted them to be they’re now around 28 a game but for a while they were in the 30s and so he’s had a bigger role than they intended and

Let’s just be honest and I’ve gone through some of the numbers he’s not produced I mean not to the level of other starting point guards in the NBA and uh maybe you can say that’s not what his role is but I mean he in January he hasn’t had more

Than three field goals made in a game and at a certain point you got to get some production out of that position so there are two names that keep coming up more than any other you and I have discussed tyus Jones we’ve discussed Spencer dwit we’ve discussed Monte

Morris there are other point guards they could go get but the two Colin seon who we probably should talk about a little bit more right because he’s he’s been kind of playing at a really high level for Utah playing really well that’s why I don’t even know if he could be had and

His Danny a and all that correct right the Danny a factor but the two guys that that get brought up the most so the one who hit the game-winning shot against the Heat the other day deante Murray and the other one is Terry Rosier and and I

Can tell you that Greg and I have both heard from different sources that the one to focus on more for the heat is rosier um but it doesn’t mean that they couldn’t make a play for Murray so I’m just gonna go through their contractual situations and then I’m going to let you

Go through their basketball fit and what what you think might be worthwhile to move for them and again this is not a report that they’re going to get either of them or even that they’re going to go hard after either of them but their two names obviously that are out on the

Market at a position of need for the Miami Heat and I think they know it’s a position of need um which is why they’ve been tinkering with so many starting lineups and we don’t know again if those starting lineups are going to include Kyle uh into the near future so here’s

Here’s Terry rosier’s contract situation he uh this year he signed a contract before the 2223 season and it seemed kind of high at the time but he’s playing at a high level this year so this year he makes $23.2 million next year 24.9 he’s got a partial guarantee for

266 in the 2526 Seasons so two seasons from now and then he’s an unrestricted free agent so he’ll hit the market again when he’s 30 to by the way that’s the same time that dejon Murray could hit the market because Murray signed an extension he’s not playing under this extension right

Now but he signed an extension next year he’ll make 248 the year after 268 the year after 288 and then he has a player option at age 31 for 30.7 roughly 30.8 becomes an and if he if he exercises that player option to stay with it he’ll become a unrestricted

Free agent in the year 2028 uh you know at that point so a little bit a two years after Rosier would so I’ll just get to this your view on the value of their contracts um honestly I don’t really have a hot take when it comes to their

Contracts I feel like both of them uh if we’re talking about both of them here I think they’re both pretty fair I I think it’s it’s about where they’re at and where their production is at and it to me it’s just about like do the heat think it’s worth taking on um long-term

Money because I know that you and Leif have heard that you know throughout the past few months or whatever that that’s kind of one of their their big emphasis like I’m sure they would take on long-term money for the right guy do they consider a Rosia or a Murray to be

The guy to Worth to be worth taking on long-term money for it for for me that’s the question but I don’t feel too strongly about either contract to me it’s more about you know the stuff that I’m sure we’re going to get into as far

As their fit on the team and after that maybe you consider the contract because it’s like you got to talk about what their roles could project to be and whether or not you think their production goes up or down or can they be optimized and all those types of

Things because I think that’s after that sort of conversation is where I feel like the contracts can be analyzed because it’s like okay like they might be worth that right now will they be worth that price not to mention what they’ll have to give up um if you’re

Just slotting them onto the heat because in both situations you’re not moving on from any of your like best players so it’s not just as easy as slotting somebody in you have to you know figure out how how how it’s going to work out and I think that’s where it gets

Interesting but as far as like individually in a vacuum I feel those contracts are more or less pretty fair but the point you made is a good one um because when you’re talking about long-term money Terra AER is not long-term money Deonte Murray is now I think it’s reasonable long-term money

Right like that’s as um you know there are two two factors involved here one is you’ve got a cap and a tax line that’s going to continue to go up because of NBA Revenue so some contracts that don’t look so good now are going to look good

In a year or two I remember saying this when they signed Chris Bosch all the way back in 2014 everybody hated that contract right that would have been a lovely contract if Chris didn’t get sick okay because of the way that again the the capping piece it was it was

Exact but some at the time did not feel that way but some at the time did not feel that way they felt like they spent too much because again they were competing with Houston and they kind of created this sort of semi fake leverage with Houston but and a lot of Heat fans

Were like he not worth that uh and I was like no that that’s gonna look like a very good number just like to be honest Tyler herro’s number is gonna look just fine okay for what he produces um so I think I think it’s a re they’re both

Unreasonable contracts I I I absolutely for the current times they both but one of them can go out two more years than the other right if dejon was to opt in to the last year of his deal at 31 million and he may not at that point who

Knows where he is as a player but uh you’re talking about two more years potentially um and some teams look there are some teams that want the longer term contract because they’re in an unattractive market and they want this stability if you’re in an Indiana or an

OKC or a Utah and you can sign you can sign or acquire a player who is g to have you know numerous years with you and you don’t have to go replace that player that’s a benefit Miami is a little bit different particularly when you’re again you’re dealing with what

Are you gonna do with Jimmy at the end of his deal right you got another bam extension a Max Max excuse me coming down the road you still got Tyler’s money okay now Duncan’s money is going to come off the book soon but these are all things to

Consider so for Miami having the longer term deal I don’t think is necessarily more attractive I think that is a point for Rosier okay um but what we’re gonna get into on the other side of it is more where I want to bring you in on it so

Is who can help more now and who do you trust more going into the future to be part of a of a build and I think that’s that’s really where this is at and then again what you give up for them so we’re going to do that here in a second we do

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Like more as a fit for this Miami Heat group Rosier or Murray oh my God you love giving me the tough questions um my immediate this is the obvious question I know I know I didn’t have to game this podcast you know what I was gonna ask

For sure but man I don’t okay so my immediate instinct is to be like what are you think Ethan but no in reality what I’m gonna say is like I’ve been trying to I’ve been thinking about it right because this has obviously been um a subject uh on heat Twitter and

Especially on our Discord server my goodness it’s been every day for months talking about different point guards that may or may not be available so there’s been a lot of thought going into this and like I said before just to kind of sum things up as far as to where I

Stand um Kyle’s not not doing enough I don’t think he is the cause of all their problems I don’t think trading him will fix all their problems however they definitely should look into trading for an upgrade at point guard and just kind of more or less Shoring that position up

For the future I mean going forward this year and for the future and I think that’s what this comes down to because we all can see that they can use a little bit of offensive juice and also their defense hasn’t been maybe up to par every night this season but I think

For me I have more confidence that when it matters most their defense will be able to kind of get back to where it’s supposed to be as long as they can show throughout the regular season but um their offense to me is what is what needs a little bit more and um Murray

Gives you both right Murray gives you both and that’s why he’s worth the price that he’s kind of reported as being up for when it comes to you got to trade two first round picks for him um I don’t know if the he will end up thinking that

He is worth that price I think that’s what this all comes down to but for me Murray like he’s he’s a very very good player you saw it in the in the Hawks game the other night you’ve seen it before he’s killed the heat before whether as a first option or a second

Option he obviously wouldn’t be your first option here but he would take up a whole lot of on ball responsibility and so with Rosier but I guess if you’re just trying to compare the two um they’re both obviously most likely gonna be going for different prices where

Rosier might be available for I don’t know a pick and something else and Murray is it it might take two but Murray can get to the rim Rosier can get to the rim both are not great finishers I would say um just looking at the percentages Murray is the better one and

Has had better Seasons uh shooting at The Rim than Rosier has I would say Rosier is the better three-point shooter not that he’s like amazing but he’s had pretty good percentages throughout his career on pretty high volume um he’s also a good mid-range shooter just like

Dejonte is um I think dejonte settles a little bit more in the mid-range and in that kind of floater range sometimes and that’s where um he likes to take some shots when things kind of bogg down whereas Rosier I don’t know he he’s I don’t know he might take a shot from

Anywhere you know what I mean like he’s not as predictable um and I’m not that sounds like I’m talking bad about D jonte I’m not because I think D Jon is a better player I think it’s a more Dynamic fit because you can keep him on

There for defense and you can throw on you can throw in a bigger lineup like we’ve been talking about and you don’t sacrifice having a point guard out there and it’s a guy who’s been an All-Star before been an all defensive player before and some of the defense has

Dropped off a little bit in Atlanta I think the the hope would be that you know the heat would be able to get the best out of him and I think there is something to be said about the offensive side of the floor trimming out some of

The fat in his game and maybe taking you know one or two less midies and one or two more at The Rim or just because I really do think he is very good when he’s attacking and he is a good mid-range player too so I’m I’m not

Trying to trash it like those are bad shots I still want I would still want him to take those shots I just think it’s about like you know if you can get a couple more at The Rim I mean the heat need those points and just you know

Getting into the pain in general is a great thing um can help generate shots and I think the heat would very much benefit from an attacking dejonte Murray and look he’s having a career year um when it comes to shooting shooting 38% uh from three shooting 50% in the

Mid-range those are both career highs and you know he’s doing it on a career-high volume from three the the mid-range volume is a little bit down so he’s you’re already seeing some of that stuff that I’m talking about here when it comes to trimming out the fat where

Like he’s still very good in the mid-range but just taking a couple less brought the efficiency up and I think the it really comes down to whether you think the finishing is something that can be better because it uh with with both him and Rosier it’s like do you do you value how

Much do you value Rim pressure in in the sense that like you’re you’re get you’re gonna create Rim pressure with both of them they might not finish at a high rate and I think even with that I’m still very much intrigued and I think like the real difference between them is

The size and the defense right it’s like Murray is 65 66 with a 610 wingspan he been an all defensive player before Rosier is 61 62 has pretty long wingspan himself 68 and you know we’ve seen him compete in the playoffs before when he was playing for the Celtics and he’s

Been up and down but you know having that playoff experience I’m sure that he would like that so to me either one they’re pretty good but the biggest question and I know I’m rambling here but you asked me about both so I’m like trying to combine all my thoughts um the

Biggest question comes down to like I kind of hinted at before how do you slot this person in whether you know whichever one you’re talking about here if you’re gonna start them right you’re starting them next to Tyler um who the four is I don’t know because they really shifted so many

Times a season I don’t know who they would start I’m guessing it would be a high Smith or a Caleb who knows that they want to go back to yic I I don’t I don’t know where their head is at right now with the four position so I’m not

Even going to try to act like I know but I think it’s more about the offense and how much they can move the ball I think you would have you would have to be sure that they’re going to move the ball enough at a high enough level because

You’re already having some of those problems that we’ve been talking about where it’s like there’s some stagnation you know guys want to get their own shots and everybody wants to blame Tyler for that it’s not all Tyler like multiple guys have out there have have one-on-one game games and it’s like

You’re going to be incorporating another on ball guy who has big responsibility and Rosier has had that too by the way it’s not just Murray and I think you’d have to be confident that you’re going to get similar impact despite a smaller role and that they’re not going to do

Too much and I think if you’re confident that either one of them can do that for you then you make the trade whether it’s the first and the salary filler or first and the second or the two first I don’t know what what they want to do to me it

Sounds like to me based on everything you guys have heard that they’re trying to see if they can flip maybe like a Kyle in a second maybe one of their current contracts I don’t know that they want to spend those first I think those players in a vacuum are worth the first

If you’re confident that the fit will be good I think they’re they’re they’re pretty much worth it all right so let me let me start here um on all of it the first part is uh I I think you’ll have uh a different four based on which of the two of them you

Get so you you hit on it uh when you were talking about um dejon’s defense because I kind of feel like if they got Murray you could start yich um because you would have Murray to guard the point of attack consistently and you go that direction if you have Rosier maybe a

Little bit more of an open question uh I don’t know if Caleb would still be here but he’s he would be an option High Smith would be an option you could go that direction I mean haks could be an option um you know as as you go

Forward but to me the debate here it does in a lot of ways it comes down to contract and compensation right and by that I’m talking about player compensation so with Murray you’re making a longer term commitment to the player the player is better than the

Other player I mean I I the player offers you more possibility now Rosier is having a career year I give him credit for it you know what he is he’s a 61 guard and to me he’s not a foundation piece he’s like a really good ad to a

Build he’s not a found piece and then there is the question of him and Tyler when you talk about if Tyler’s going to be here the two of them together and balancing that shot diet between the two of them and the defense right well I think the shot diet thing applies to

Both back courts because they both take a lot of shots and both handle a lot but the defense between Rosier and Tyler I think would be the bigger issue well the but the thing is this on the other side we’ve seen dejon try to play with Trey

And you know I was I was following some fans yesterday who were like they’re better without the other like that has not worked so if if it hasn’t really worked with Dante and Tre and Trey is it going to work with Dante and Tyler but I

Do it’s not just Tyler it’s Jimmy and Bam too and then you have hakz over here who’s getting more you have Duncan who you’re trying to incorporate more how do you keep the ball movement up I think is the bigger question like with either one

Of these guys I think you have to like there has to be an emphasis on it almost because it’s you’re incorporating another big time usage guy like that’s not easy all right so the overall point here is if you’re making a play for Deonte you are planning on making a long-term

Commitment to him and you’re probably giving up more compensation so you have to be absolutely sure about fit and it does come into how he guards with Tyler but also we do think that I I think at least do jono get back to his defense and principles when he’s in a better

Defensive situation I I think a lot of this has had to do he we saw it in San Antonio when he was coached by pop that he can defend that was his calling card early on in his career so he’s capable of that but if you’re going to make that

Kind of commitment to him you got to be sure of it to me Rosier again I don’t want to call him a stop Gap option because he’s better than that but it’s a shorter term deal the contract have probably flipped again if you need to and so my lean on what they

Would ultimately do and again I can’t I can’t speak to whether they’ll ever actually do anything but my lean on what they would ultimately do is Rosier is the compromise option like he he’s the compromise op option to juice your offense right now and potentially become a tradable piece

And you kind of see how it works between him and Tyler and if it doesn’t work then you decide what you’re going to move on from if you’re going to get Dante I think you’re going to get Dante to be part of your core like that is

Your and so I I I’ll we got to finish here honestly because we’re already over where we’re gonna go but like I I guess that becomes the question is is to is Dante enough of a long-term upgrade over what you might otherwise get to be worth what their price will probably be which

Is you know multiple picks or uh a pick and yovic or something along those lines you got to make the money work so that’s not going to be enough on its own but that that becomes the question and I I think the lean right now is to kind of

Go halfway on this right like not give up all of the future assets uh that you have but get Jimmy somebody who gives him a better chance somebody who can give you 23 in a playoff game and has been in those situations before my lean for short term would be

Rosier for that reason because it gives you flexibility going forward if you’re going after deante deante is the guy like not that you can’t flip the contract in a year or two you probably could but it you you are getting him to be part of a core group with B and Jimmy

And um and and you’re a little bit more pot committed in that way because you you’ve given up more assets get it a fair way to look at this so you’re basically saying kind of like that Rosier is like the Hedge play where like you still might have another first left

Maybe you keep that second you keep yic I don’t know because we don’t know exactly what it would take and there could be a bidding war same thing with Murray so we don’t know the exact price I’m just spitballing I I get it I get

Why you say that and even though it it’s the shorter term contract um it’s like you said it’s kind of a stop Gap plus because you know that he can give you stuff I think there would be obviously more questions with him because of the you know having a small

Guard out there maybe that it would be the play where they start him throughout the season and they still get to bigger lineups in their rotations and then in the playoffs maybe he he comes off the bench just admit it because they’re not going to bench Tyler let’s just get out

Get that out of the way for as much as a lot of people want to do that right now I don’t think that’s going to happen I’d be shocked um and so I think that might be like a card that SPO could could pull where it’s like you you make everybody

Happy during your regular season Rosier and Tyler start you try to see what that pairing looks like you try to you know what I mean get a sample for um what they are together and as far as Rosier with the best players as well um and

Then after that you know you give him a decent amount of responsibility obviously not second option Hornet’s responsibility or even first when lamelo was out but um you see how it works and then in the playoffs um maybe you just use him as this spark plug Off the Bench

Who can give you buckets and and produce um and specifically probably when Tyler is off the floor just so you don’t have the two small guards out there the Murray thing it’s almost to me it’s because I completely understand your reasoning the Murray thing is like uh if

Rosier is worth the one I I’d be more than happy doing two for Murray because I think that’s a pretty good that’s pretty good value for a guy of his caliber and again it all comes down to more than just what they are in a vacuum

And if they’re worth that in a vacuum it’s how do you incorporate them and I do think it would be a challenge for SPO I don’t think it’s really easy I don’t think it would be like this seamless fit like people try to make it as because he

Plays defense and he seems like a he cultur type of player and the character and the competitiveness and all that and I like it I appreciate it he the attacking would help you know with both of them but it’s like with both of them

Like I keep saying it would be a lot to figure out on ball Tyler like the emphasis for him to get off ball would be would become bigger right I think bam you know like he’s been getting a steady diet of kind of these uh one-on-one

Plays out of the you know they they they might run the cross screen into the postup and then it just turns into bam one-on-one maybe some of those come down I’m sure Jimmy is fine letting other guys score during the regular season how do you handle that in the playoffs

Because Jimmy is your number one shot Creator in the playoffs so those are a lot of questions that I think are kind of you know luxurious problems to have if if you’re SPO but you absolutely have to consider these things when you’re trading for a guy so I would prefer just

Going all in and going I think two picks for a guy guy Murray’s caliber is good I think it’s pretty good value but I get where you’re coming from with the Rosier thing it would still kind of be long term it’s just not as long term you know

It’s a couple Seasons as opposed to like four or whatever it is with Murray’s extension so um you know I think it’s a good conversation and I think it’s you know we’re gonna be monitoring these guys I mean I think you characterize it right by saying it’s a hedge play to to

Me Rosier is a hedge play like there is and and I’ll close it here and thanks to our sponsors tub culture and better I think that doing nothing at this point with Kyle Lowry as your point guard is a choice that’s a choice like there there’s risk to that in a year that

You’re trying to help Jimmy Butler get over the top because he’s not contributing enough and there’s nobody who can argue he is in fact they won’t argue he is so if you w to show that you’re trying to make some kind of an improvement without giving up too much

Of the future so you still have flexibility as much as I like dejonte Murray better as a player than I do Terry Rosier I don’t know that I would give up Nia Yi’s future or another first round pick when you’ve got somebody like Adam Simon who’s been hitting on these

Picks for that player right now if they do it I won’t be against it but I think if the option is to make the Hedge play get yourself some offensive juice with a guy who you know can produ and yes there’s going to be fit issues because there’s going to be let’s just

Be honest there’s going to be fit issues with anybody with Tyler in the starting lineup along with Jimmy um because Duncan Robinson is the player that fits better in the starting lineup but we know that they’re not going to do that and not even advocating for that because

Of the other issues that are involved with that but I think at this point if you’re SPO you’d rather have the talent and try to figure it out than being tied with one hand behind your back at this point where you’re essentially starting a point guard who can’t create anymore

Uh can’t defend at the point of attack and won’t shoot like just just give us something and Terry Rosier will give you something I don’t think there’s any question and he’s become you mentioned he’s become a more efficient player over time like he has not been a you know the

So-called spray lutter in a riot he’s not been that this year his percentages for a team that has needed him to score and be a high volume player he’s produced at a very efficient level for that role so this is not just a chucker so to speak he has some chucking

Tendencies uh that they will have to mitigate on this roster but I would think he’d understand that he played on a team with Boston with a lot of talent and he found a way to fit and he Kyrie and Hayward and I know they were out during that playoff run when he was

Scary Terry and all that but there was still Tatum and brown on there I mean right and he was prodive he was productive in big moments and and other teams would have to worry about him as a threat and you know how I know that the

Heat worry about him is a threat when they face him ain’t nobody worrying about Kyle Lowry as a threat at this stage of his career so we’ll close with that all right thanks to our sponsors shop tuub culture.com again use the code five and better Edge five

RSN we did 32 minutes on this we didn’t even get into tyus Jones Spencer did wining we got a lot of transaction pods coming up all right have a good one everybody thank you for listening to the five on the floor on the five reason Sports Network after all someone needs

To listen to my dad

The Miami Heat need more production at point guard, and there are impactful players who appear to be on the trading block. Ethan Skolnick and Alex Toledo discuss two — Atlanta’s Dejounte Murray and Terry Rozier. With contracts and possible compensation considered, which should be the primary target?

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