Eastern Conference’s IMPORTANT stretch + Concerns For Kings & Thunder? | The Hoop Collective

Eastern Conference’s IMPORTANT stretch + Concerns For Kings & Thunder? | The Hoop Collective

Hello and welcome to the hoop Collective podcast we talk about the NBA which we’re doing on Tuesday afternoon joining us from Cleveland Ohio where he has moved on from the warmer climates um of Central America for tonight’s I should say Tuesday nights Celtics Cavaliers game is Tim

Bontemps I think it’ll be amused to know Brian that I had lunch with uh friend of the Pod Drew Carter today and as we got there it was 65 voice of the Celtics the boss of Celtics doing the game Tuesday night he was like man I’m really in on Cleveland really like

It 65 and sunny outside 45 minutes later we walk out of lunch it’s raining and dark he was like what happened I said Cleveland happened as I tell people during all those finals years I you know when it was June in Cleveland I go if you don’t like Cleveland now you’re

Never gonna like it this is this is the best we got right here joining us from Dallas Texas is B McMahon howdy Partners I would tell old Drew Carter best known as the former college roommate of Jackson that there’s a reason yoim Noah said nobody ever wants to vacation in

Cleveland like aren’t you old enough to at least remember that it wasn’t too long no the answer is no the answer is no he’s not old enough to remember that at all yeah that was about 200 N I think hey probably he in elementary school somewhere it was

2010 we would be 12 Jackson said they were 12 it was 2010 because um the uh the Cavs beat the Bulls 4-1 and people thought that LeBron might go to Chicago because the Bulls kind of looked really good and they were good they were number

One seed in East the next year but um didn’t get LeBron all right so we have Cav Celtics tonight we’re obviously not going to know how that game is going to play out as we do this pod the Cavs are in a bit of a rough spot right now not

Only have they lost five of their last nine and let me just say again before we know the results of Tuesday night’s game uh two of those victories were achieved in the final seconds one they won when Kobe white missed a shot in the final seconds and one they won when Max Shu

Hit a 60-footer so they’re four and five with two last second wins and two of the wins are over Washington and Detroit so the CER a rough way Donovan Mitchell is out the rest of this week after getting PRP in his knee the Cavs are seven and six this season when Donovan doesn’t

Play going into this game against the Celtics on Tuesday but there’s three Eastern Conference teams the teams that are one two3 as we do this pod in the Eastern Conference all of whom have very challenging demanding uh seven eight days of schedule here uh and I feel like

Uh by next Tuesday or at least by the end of next Tuesday I don’t know if it’s when we do this pod next Tuesday we’re gonna have a much better feeling about where those three teams are and their relative standing and their relative strength uh we talked about the the

Celtics a lot on Sunday when they dismantled the Warriors um by the way stats Williams uh said that so over the last 11 games the Celtics are plus 243 in this 11 game win streak 243 if they’re able to beat the Cavs tonight by 17 or more and that’s you

Know kind of insulting especially if for recording this be head of a Cav’s upset win but if they’re able to do that it would be the most lopsided 12 game stretch in the history of the league so that’s the kind of way the Celtics are playing we’ll talk more about them um

Later this week but just to give you an idea of what their schedule is they just had the Mavericks and warriors two teams which they uh slapped by a combined like 80 points I’m not even exaggerating they beat the South they beat the Mavericks by 30 and the so they beat the Mavericks

By let me be precise bit the the Mavericks by 28 and the Celtics by 52 so I believe that’s 80 I believe they won those team games by 80 so they’re in so they begin a um five game Road Trip um starting on Tuesday night in Cleveland

Thursday is the big one which bontemps I believe you’re intending to head out to Denver for I I will be there every time get a real game every time Bon goes to Denver a star sits who’s who Tatum gonna take the night off we’ll see every every time I’ve been to

Denver I think at ESPN it’s been a memorable game there was the game that the first year I was here ky riving punched the ball in the stands uh the last two years after getting in a back and forth with Jamal Murray when Denver beat them and uh the

Last two years I went there expected to see MVP showdowns and we didn’t see him so we’ll see what happens this year for the uh 76ers training camp I did I was there forain also James that’s right I mean he was there he was there I’ll give him credit for that he showed

Up he did show up the rest of anyway so the Celtics play the Cavs Tuesday the Nuggets Thursday then they go to Phoenix and play the Suns on Saturday that game has lost some luster because it looks like Devin Booker is going to be out all

This week and maybe much if not all next week with nasty sprained ankle that he suffered over the weekend um the the Suns just cannot get healthy it’s EX hard to evaluate them they um had this very strange game with Oklahoma City over the weekend where they were I think

They fell down by 20 then outscored the Suns over like the middle quarters by 30 and then ended up losing anyway so uh but anyway that game is on Saturday and then this the the Celtics closes the road trip at Portland and at Utah which you may say well who cares

About that those shaby wins but it’s a back toback and it’s three games and four nights so their odds regardless I don’t care if they I don’t care if it’s a a noon 7 PM double header for them I do um yeah the the jet the teeth of the

Jazz uh on the um on the second Iva back toback has lessen over the last month where they have kind of uh bro given up the ghost listen it went down the stretch last night I thought the lizards were going to earn their W back but they’re still the lizards still nothing

But lse start of February 14 I think it’s is it 15 now I think it’s 15 15 in a row you do know what uh 28 would be right yes in fact know yes that would be glorious anyway it just to remind be against the Pistons for people who don’t

Know yeah back to the top end of these standings McMahon or I mean bontemp she might get dispatched for that game oh baby prob would I probably would try to go see that game that would be certainly an interesting one nobody better to cover historical losers than the uswb

The soaked wet blanket just coming in stinking it up baby all right so the Cavs um who are you know struggling you know without Donovan Mitchell um he has missed three games since the All-Star break they have lost all three of those this is their schedule they played the

Knicks on Sunday uh Jaylen Brunson um suffered that knee injury less than a a minute into the game while we were recording the podcast and um did not return his he appears to have avoided major injury as the Knicks have listed him as questionable we’ll see about

Whether that whether that plays out but it seems like it’s good news I I thought it was funny sort of funny sad that after Jaylen got hurt uh tibs put in Duce McBride and then played him for the next 47 and a half minutes and never

Took him off the court and that came but the Knicks won it completely uh daddy balled the Cavs the entire way um to the point where uh Josh Hart who has pretty much owned the Cavs uh dating back to last year’s playoffs um after making a

Basket late in the fourth quarter as the Knicks were taking control of the game went over to the Cavs bench Midway through play and kind of grabbed Donovan Mitchell’s um diamond or gold necklace whatever was on that and like I don’t know sort of playfully like uh uh you

Know tassled it I don’t know what you want to say I tell you what the way he was bullying I’m surprised he didn’t just snatch that thing right off his neck like a and Michael Crabtree like Debo in in Friday that’s there you go that’s the way that the Knicks were

Treating the Cavs and you know Josh Hart isn’t that kind of a trash talker I don’t think but um he just was you know he had 19 rebounds in the game um and uh he was guarding Evan Moy down the stretch when I say guarding he was not

Guarding him he was just letting him go wherever he wanted and he was defending the paint and they were just totally shutting off Darius Garland in the paint but let’s see what happens to the Cavs tonight but the their difficult stretch after you they went 18- two but

They really really benefited from a from a soft schedule they had injury problems at that time but um the schedule’s turned on them now um then they play the Knicks even though ended up without three key players for that whole game basically because Julius Randle and oan

Anobi were out and Mitchell Robinson too Mitchell Robinson hasn’t played months so I guess you down him I mean aside from 80% of their starting lineup the Knicks are pretty healthy right um so yeah I didn’t I Mitchell’s been out for so long I didn’t even compute that but

Yes I guess without four starters uh so then they have the Celtics on Tuesday then back-to-back in Atlanta the Hawks did not cover themselves in glory with a loss of back-to-back games in uh Brooklyn which left the door open for the Nets to come get the 10 seed it was

That I think that the Hawks were up by four going into those two games and then they lost those two games that said it will be without Donovan Mitchell and it’ll be the second night of a back-to-back on the road um not no Donovan Mitchell no Trey young buy your tickets

Now right hey you can get uh jante Murray uh Jaylen Johnson those guys are good players um so then Friday the Cavs come back home and play the Timberwolves who um who who they beat on Monday night um or who they beat Portland hey what time’s that tip

Off somebody better tell Anthony Edwards maybe he can actually on the start 7:30 Eastern 6:30 Central you might want to they need to tell an IT tips off at 7:15 just to be sure uh yes ant um in an interesting development uh Ann Edwards um was at the arena and warmed up and

Ready to go and then just wasn’t on the court so he lost track of time wasn’t was there was no no potty problems or nothing like that just lost track of time the game started in no ant and uh the Wolves had four guys on the

Floor I would it would have been awesome if Chris Finch pulled the uh uh what was Jee Hackman’s character in hooers uh Norman Dale my team’s on the floor yes we’re just playing the Blazers my team’s on the floor exactly like dude no we’re trying to

Lose would you please get a fifth guy out here um um so then the Cavs next week have the Suns and Pelicans um and so hey those Pelicans just sitting right there holding firm at five in the west they are continuing to play well so the Cavs

Are in a stretch by next Tuesday they will have played the Suns uh and we’ll we’ll have an idea of where they’re at um I would before again before this game I would caution getting making an assumption about the Cavs because everybody thought they were cooked JB Bickerstaff the head coach was rumored

To be on the hot seat when Evan Mobley and Darius Garland went down in December and then they played some of the best basketball we’ve seen in the League this year I don’t think it’s quite the same missing their all-nba player um and by the way not going to be all-nba Donovan

Has already missed 133 games and is going to be right up against the 65 number so I would say he’s probably unlikely to re-qualify for all for um for all NBA let me just take a quick aside here um to talk about Donovan Mitchell real quick the reason that the that the uh

Supermax rule was put in was basically as uh as a as a reaction to Kevin Durant leaving the Thunder and to a lesser extent um LeBron James leaving the Cavs the idea was that if you had finished your first max contract the fun Max and you

Were headed to the stress Max the idea would be that you would take the stress out of it and you’d be able to pay the you know the player with seven years of experience the 35% of the Max and it was that’s not really why it was

Done the reason the reason the rule the reason the supermax was created was because when Kevin Durant was a free agent in 2016 the Thunder had no way to pay him really more than anybody else to a point where they could really find out whether he was going to stay there or

Not that’s and so is that what I just said well you said you said take the I mean that’s not I would say that what it was doing was setting up the choice so the team would know whether the guy would want to stay there or not well but

That’s like if Wendy says bontemps you’re a bozo and I say Bon you’re a doofus we’re saying the same thing well I just I think it’s I think it’s just worth laying out that that’s where it came from that the Thunder sat there didn’t know if the guy was going to stay

Or not and then he left and they got left with nothing so now the way this has been set up now nobody’s turned it down yet but it’s been set up so teams know ahead of time either the guy’s going to extend or he’s not and then

They have the option to decide to trade him or not right the the difference that the Warriors and the and the uh Thunder could pay Durant or any free agent over the first four years of that contract was negligible yeah percentage of raises it was a couple of percentage points I

Mean it was significant money but it wasn’t enough to be the difference now they could guarantee a fifth year but you know LeBron had sort of set the precedent that getting a fifth year wasn’t important because he took two contracts right in a row that were less than five years um so

Anyway uh the thing about it is is that that rule was put in to protect the Oklahoma cities and Clevelands of the world from a player wanting to go to a bigger Market but in the case of Donovan Mitchell he is not eligible for the supermax the Cavs are not given the

Protection of the Kevin Durant rule because he was traded during his fun Max he signed if you are traded after your rookie contract you cannot get the supermax so the all-nba thing while it’s a big deal for a number of players and um obviously for Tyrese halberton

Whether he is going to get um The Rose provision um an Edwards um uh it was a big this was a thing for Pascal cakam zakum wasn’t real crazy J Brown Jaylen Brown he got the supermax but Pascal seaka wasn’t real crazy about getting traded from the Raptors because if he

Did he’d become ineligible for the supermax if he made all NBA and it got to the point where it was kind of clear the Raptors weren’t going to give him the supermax anyway so he ended up getting traed also it’s pretty clear he wasn’t going

To be eligible for but yes yeah but you know what you didn’t know that because there’s a bunch of guys who are going to be ineligible and the what it takes to get the supermax you know like for example a guy in that situation this

Year is Bam out a bio now in years past you might say well B Metabo as good as he is probably going to make all NBA because you’ve got these centers who are all studs I mean you’re you’re penciling in yic in and EM beat on one and two you

Know teams one and two and you’re like you know how does he fit in there well and B isn’t going to be eligible plus there’s no there’s no positions on on the all NBA this year so all NBA is like it’s going to be it’s impossible to

Predict and so the point is Donovan Mitchell not getting all NBA isn’t going to affect the Cav’s ability to keep him like it would have with other with other players so um he’s headed for the same basically set of decisions that he has this summer when Cleveland offers the

Extension is is not um but he is almost certainly not going to get the 65 game threshold even though by all accounts he would be a no-brainer probably second team all-nba player at this point okay that brings us to the team we want to talk about which is the Bucks who won

Their sixth consecutive game on Monday night six and0 since the All-Star break and they leave um today Tuesday on a very demanding challenging um uh 4 game road trip and then I think they uh then have the 76ers and Sons at home after that um then they play the Celtics your

Trip is Golden State Wednesday Lakers Friday Clippers Sunday Kings Tuesday California trip come home and play the Sixers obviously without himem beid and teres Maxi is now not playing today with potential concussion after get hit in the head on Sunday in Dallas hopefully he’s all right um then they play Phoenix

At home on Sunday and then they play Wednesday the 20th in Boston against the Celtics that’s their next seven games so the bucks um six in a row like I said they had a they won without Giannis on Monday night um made had a comeback Victory um Dame still still no

Middleton either still no Middleton um had a middle uh Dame had 41 points uh uh beating the the Clippers who we just gave a a valentine to McMahon on Sunday and the Clippers lost that game blowing the lead and they were completely flat in the fourth quarter again absolutely flat it was a

Combination of Dame time the hoop Collective curse and the pat Bev boost baby the pat Bev midseason boost isch you got Pat Bev and Dame just hugging it out on the court after games I mean listen Pat Bev is the epitome of you hate his guts when you have to play

Them and when he’s on your team you appreciate the hell out of them usually there have been some exceptions of the latter but say what you want the pat Bev boost is in full effect right now well so they are one of the top five defensive teams in the leag by the way

The Clippers are five in six and they last 11 so um the Bucks uh after go starting three and seven uh with Doc Rivers the ner being the lost to Memphis with two guys on 10day contracts in the starting lineup he said and he said half

The half the Bucks uh in Cabo yeah Eve right uh I think another guy um was a two-way I think they started two-way in 210 day guys but something like that um I’m not sure the gries are really fully invested in trying to maximize the

Number of wins they have the rest of the way they won on Monday night buddy Canard put in 25 that tells you something about the state of the Nets Go On true um who just beat the Hawks twice uh anyway Giannis bonts Giannis is out with Achilles tendonitis was out with

That we’ll see where he’s out was not a greatl looking workout Monday night it’s out there looked like it was bothering him and left early not videos I mean obviously wasn’t there I was watching the videos of it the videos of it did not look great anytime you hear about

Achilles soreness or tendonitis or anything with anybody that’s a pretty significant cause for concern particularly somebody like Giannis with how exposive he’s playing all the time doc said that he’d been being bothered by it for two or three games um so something that was flaring up on them

We’ll see about this road trip there there there isn’t back-to-backs uh these games in California I think I don’t think there’s back Tob backs in any of my they don’t play a back toback until the the 21st of March okay little bit of California Sunshine no back Tob

Backs you know it’s a good recipe for healing so the Bucks uh as of now uh have reclaimed second place we the number two seed over the Cavs and have taken the edge in the tiebreaker in that as well um and so they you know they

Were four I think at the break they were four games back of the Cav in the Lost column that evaporated quickly um bontemps the Bucks are showing some potency I think we’ll know more about them pending Giannis after they go through this road trip and we’ll see how

The Celtics who are out west this same time look against some of these top West teams yeah I mean look the buck had a really nice win to open the All-Star break uh in Minnesota won won that game in Minnesota on national TV they have they played a bunch of not very good

Teams after that they got the Clippers Monday had a nice Comfort behind win Clippers on the second night of a back-to-back but you know that was also a weird game bucks are down you know like McMahon said no Middleton he’s been out for a while Giannis doesn’t play the

Clippers on the second night of of a back tobacker up 20 and kind of shut off like that was just a weird one all around but like you said over the next three weeks or two and a half weeks they go on this West Coast trip they get

Phoenix at home they go to Boston like at this point I’m I would say let’s check in with where the Bucks are at on March 21st the morning of after that game in Boston and if they’ve rolled through this stretch and they continue to have an elite defense and they still

Look really good then I think we could say they’ve made some meaningful steps forward given the way they were playing before the break like you said that loss in Memphis I mean they weren’t beating anybody it’s not like they weren’t they were playing a brutal schedule then I think it’s

Certainly encouraging the way they’re playing but I would say I’ll like you said I’ll feel a lot better about believing in where they’re at if they come out of these next seven games playing at the same level they have been after playing the Hornets multiple times playing a broken down Sixers team

Playing the Bulls like you know let’s see them go to you know go to Golden State who’s playing better and win and go to La and win and go to sack and win the Bulls by the way just went to sack and came from behind by 20 their third

Their third 20 point comeback victory of the Season sir listen Demar R rozan positioned himself as the early front runner for March coone Factor player of the month by outscoring the Kings by himself in the fourth quarter don’t you bad those don’t you badm those Bulls baby the the listen candidates I thought

We were GNA talk about them a little bit later if we end up talking about the Kings like we discussed but I do want to say since they came up Kobe white has been awesome for like two and a half months now and looks like he’s really

Ascended to another level as a player and looks like a you know I don’t know if I necessarily want to say potential All-Star caliber guy next year but he’s like made that a real conversation and has been awesome and he was awesome in the last few minutes of that game last

Night made a couple massive plays to to help them get that win in Sacramento so he I mean that’s I mean obviously we’ve talked a lot about depressing the bull season has been on many levels but Kobe’s development has been one of the really cool stories of the season over

The last couple months yeah back to the Bucks real quick oh real quick actually I’m gonna real quick here real quick I know that Tyrese Maxi has sort of been penciled in as the most improved player um Kobe white I’m not saying Tyrese won’t win and I’m not saying I wouldn’t vote for

Tyrese Kobe Kobe’s definitely gonna do Kobe’s definitely earned ballot consideration yeah that’s all sorry study study those numbers that’s that’s a fair point look the P like there was a lot of piling on Doc Rivers there was a lot the way he got the job the black of uh

Winds after he got the job he didn’t help himself by some of the stuff he said yeah some of the stuff he says I would say a lot of it a lot of it was just some of the insane things that doc was saying I love okay whatever for it

Was it became very cool and trendy to pile on Doc Rivers that’s my point what were docs what were the two main things that the doc was hired to do for the bucks defense has he improved the defense well hey small sample size or whatever but they are number one by a significant

Margin since the All-Star break that seems to be a pretty massive change from a team that was in the 20s when he was hired and then I would argue the the second biggest thing was to kind of get the Dame Giannis thing flowing not have them be too kind of independent

Uh independent contract ractor so to speak within the the starting lineup and it’s interesting to hear Damen Lillard talk uh about Doc and you know just basically saying like Doc comes in and he’s like wait you guys don’t have this in here man we used to hate guarding

That when you were important basically just doing because look Giannis is going to be Giannis right you’ve got to get Dame to feel like he’s himself you got he’s the guy who’s made this massive transition you know moving and new franchise new surroundings you know so on and so forth

And it’s not like it’s been some kind of linear thing with him um but there are certainly indications that he’s he can get the best out of D yeah so for example this is one of the basic things that doc has done and you know you’re never going to hear X’s and

O’s from me I I will get my circles run around me but one of the things that they did in Portland very effectively with a lot of times with Yousef nurkic was set a screen very very high well outside the three-point line and Dame would come into it at

Speed and the big man was pulled up and Dame could shoot from anywhere inside 30 feet and that he would come off the pick with speed and with with room to operate because it’s very very hard to bring extra bodies when you’re that far away from the basket you know you’re just

Inviting four on three play on the back of the play and that was something the Bucks weren’t doing and so just as basic as especially when Dame’s in the in the game by himself is moving that screener up to give Dane more of of a play that

He’s run several thousand times in NBA games has helped him maybe it’s helped him two possessions a game but that’s helped on the on the defensive end okay Doc is and Dave joerger who was hired to be his defensive you know uh coordinator they know that they got a problem with

Uh with their their perimeter Defenders they’re small they’re not particularly quick and you know they’re weak okay so what do they have they do have great interior Defenders with great size also what do they go out and get like they got Pat Bev that he does solve some

Perimeter defensive issues I mean I I don’t really agree but but well not you tell me Pat Bev’s not a defensive pest stop I I think he’s a pest a lot of respects but you know maybe helps a couple percentage points right um but one of the things that the Bucks have

Done is that they have gotten their big men specifically Giannis and Brook Lopez more involved and asking more of them and more a little bit more movement and a little bit more coverage and using their um you know help and Recovery abilities you know there was a a real

Key play in the fourth quarter of the Clippers game on um Monday night where this exact thing happened Brook Lopez had come out away from the basket to help a little bit on the pick and roll and because he is a superior Defender and has great length when kawh Leonard

Came around the pick and went to the basket Brooke recovered and blocked the shot at The Rim at a key point in the game where the Clippers were basically being taken to their knees and that is it was a big ass for him to cover the ground he had to get

Out beyond the I think in my memory at least beyond the foul line or at least close to it and then race kawhai back and he did he made the play and so um you know those are the kind of scheme things in addition to what I’ve been told which are just you

Know better attention to detail and better operations in film sessions shoot arounds organization I was just I was going to say all of this comes back to the Bucks are just much better organized none of these things are revolutionary right right and I’m not saying that to

Be critical of Doc who has done a nice job but like they are now being they are now just a much more organized group they don’t have a head coach learning on the job learning the roster but the guy has a ton of experience and they don’t

Have a roster full of guys who are looking at the head coach learning a job thinking this guy doesn’t really know what he’s doing does he so the players actually believe the stuff they’re being coached to do yeah it’s it’s it’s very it’s just it all comes down to that it’s

Just a much more organized group listen you give Giannis a few chances he’ll make a good head coach in [Laughter] higher oh what are you talking about that was made by the front office oh that’s right Yannis had no clue I think he heard about it when he walked in the gym one

Day um I don’t know if they can get to a point where they can beat the Celtics four out of seven but they don’t have to play them four out of seven it’s getting into a better position where they wouldn’t have to play at least not right now they don’t

Potentially have to play them four out of seven until the Conference Finals if they continue to hold on to the two let’s see if they do but the teams behind them are kind of battered um and the best player yes that was what I was gonna say they’re not as good as the

Celtics but their best player is is the best player in that series and if you walk in the series with the best player you got a shot not only that Celtics don’t really have a great option to guard him he’s the best player and he has Championship experience as do

Obviously some other guys on that roster also while doc look we can talk about some of the playoff failures the man has Championship experience and then Damon Lillard hasn’t you know been on a team that that’s broken through has never won a a conference Finals game much less

Gotten to the finals but um but like if the game’s close of the 10 guys on the floor who do you trust the most with the ball in in their hands at that situation bus or Celtics and again like we’re going to talk about this presumably after the

Game Thursday but that’s the question with the Celtics the Celtics have every other question answered the one they can’t answer is in the final five minutes of a close game how’s it going to go and if you’re playing the sou if you’re playing the Bucks you got Dame on

The other side you like your chances with him if you’re playing Denver you’ve got the yic Murray pick and roll you like your chances with that and that is the final thing that the Celtics are not going to be able to answer until we get to the playoffs but that’s the thing

That we’re gonna have to wait to see well and you know what they might not have to answer it in the playoffs blowing everybody out by 50 that’s right they might not but that’s the one if you’re looking for a hole in their team whereas the thing to poke at and say

This is where you have doubts about Boston that’s really the only thing now you can point to it’s like they go on those matchups they don’t have the best player because joic Giannis are better than Tatum and the clutch execution has not typically been great so if you’re

The Bucks you’re saying hey we got the best player we got Dame brought in to be a crunch time Guy this is this is what we think we could do now if you’re the Sou eight P bav that’s right eight- two Pat bav now but yeah we’ll we’ll see that

Game South in a couple weeks Bon Tim is just being petty hey we can respect our podcast competitors you don’t have to be all just nasty about this H all right guys what do you make of the fact that the Lakers are three and one against the Thunder after

Beating them on Monday night tempted not to react to a small sample size understand that the Thunder Onana back to back last night and concerned about the matchup of the Lakers size and physicality against the Thunder who their their biggest weakness in the non-experienced category is that they aren’t a big

Physical team they are one of the worst rebounding teams in the league and Anthony Davis has he’s feasted against the Thunder this year so you know there there is some concern there and if I’m the Thunder I hope the seeds don’t play out to to find out if that small sample size

Would continue ther and the wolves have been going back and forth in one um you know and I we’ll see uh here come the fighting Jokers yeah that’s true no for sure Denver is uh you know Denver is running hot too um it’s most likely that the Lakers are

Going to end up playing either the one or the two but the Thunder oh Wendy says the Lakers are definitely coming to have play in I said it’s most likely if they if they are make it to the playoffs it’s going to be versus the one or two that

Was a nice aggregation you just did on me there though well hold on what the hell else would it be means Notting up to six that’s what I’m saying I’m saying they’re most likely playing one or two if they’re if in the playoffs yeah I tell you what man the Lakers are look

They they have been playing well 110 in the last 14 one of those losses is when LeBron took the extra uh day after the All-Star Break um he was dealing with ankle soreness McMahon okay he took an extra day to deal with ankle soreness my god let’s not get defensive I’m not what

Are you back in the akan Beacon Journal gosh Lord have mercy tell I know the rubber ducks are honoring you but please man man you like come on you don’t have to you don’t have to get LeBron’s back at any perceived slight here um but I I think if you if you’re looking

At five down right now in the west the Lakers are playing the best of that Bunch um they’re nine right now and they are a threat to move up like you know the Mavericks have the Pacers tonight we’ll see if they can have a a a get

Well win that they that they need um if not the Lakers are breathing right down their necks um and they’ve got two superstars who have won a title together so fresh off of West finals the bronze broom sweep but still got to the West finals I think you’ve got to look at the

Lakers as a as a legitimate threat as far as Ninth Place teams go I’m glad we’re back to the play so we’re just saying that the Lakers are going to roll through the playoffs again I would say that they are um this is a very concerning thing for the thunder in my

Opinion this is the thing we have been concerned about with them all season for as good as they are they’re extraordinarily small by every standard um we’ve talked a lot about the Josh giddy thing it did not work again last night I I I don’t quite want to say it’s

It wasn’t good like they’re just not guarding him teams are just not guarding him at all and I I don’t want to quite say it’s unserious that he continues to start but it’s getting pretty close to that point this is a team that has a chance they’re doing a lot of winning so

But I I agree that in a in a possession game in the playoffs where matchups mean everything it’s not serious to think that he would be able to be out there well and to me they should be starting to prepare for making that kind of a run

Now and having him continue to be out there in these situations right now in a starting lineup when I think we all agree if they just run this way in the playoffs to just have him start every game it’s going to end shorter than it probably should okay but so what what’s

Your solution then because look we’re already talking about one of their big concerns is they are a small team he is actually the second tallest starter he’s 6 foot eight you know we looked at the Gordon Hayward thing as hey maybe that gives you an alternative or he has not

Been doing much for them fellas he had a milestone moment last night in his seventh game for the Thunder he attempted his first three-pointer he didn’t go in in 102 minutes he scored 17 points in a seven of 28 from the floor in 102 minutes he’s been he’s he’s been

A nothing I like Isaiah Joe I like Cas Wallace if you plug them in for giddy a small team’s getting significantly smaller I will say that he did have their best plus minus of their starters yesterday I know that’s why I said it wasn’t like by giddy games this wasn’t I

Didn’t think it was on the on the bats they made some plays as the cutter but still like it it doesn’t the the bigger picture fit problem is there um I don’t know like do you want to go a little bit bigger and more physical and put kenri Williams at the

Four you know I want someone out there that teams are going to guard because you’re playing four on five on offense and it’s just not sustainable in the playoffs it’s just not and I understand there’s a variety of reasons why they haven’t gone that way and that’s fine to

Me they should be spending this final quarter of the season a trying to get the one seed and B trying to figure out the best way they’re going to play in the playoffs just having Josh giddy be in the starting lineup for the next 20

Games when he’s then then not be in the starting lineup at some point during the playoffs I would certainly hope because it’s not going to be something that’s going to be sustainable at that point I just don’t think makes a lot of sense but we’re getting away from the bigger

Picture issue which is we’ have seen repeatedly when these guys play teams with size they struggle because they’re basically playing four guards to your point McMahon Josh giddy is their second biggest guy and he doesn’t really play that big I know he’s a rebounder but he’s a perimeter player the other

Options a guard a lot smaller exactly well I know but but the right and the point is whatever options they’re rolling out there they’ve got Chad holgren who’s on the small side for a center from a bulk standpoint yeah and then they’ve got a bunch of guards out

There with them and it’s going to be very difficult for them to go up against a team like the Lakers with all their size and the Lakers we saw this last year in the playoffs like the Lakers are not a very good team in the aggregate but they have very specific strengths

That if they get very specific matchups they can take advantage of they got that matchup against Memphis they got that matchup against Golden State I think Golden State’s been playing frankly significantly better lately than the Lakers have who mostly have had a puff schedule and they’ve played real teams

They’ve lost yeah give or take a 52 Point loss yes they they also had won I three in a row before that and I think five out of six before that like yes they got smoked by the Celtics but I I think the lake I think the Warriors in

The aggregate are a more dangerous and better team than the Lakers Akers but because of the Lakers size if they get a matchup where they can play a smaller team and beat them up and have LeBron get calls because LeBron is gonna get calls and have ad get calls because he’s

Gonna get calls and just Mash teams they can win a series but they need a very specific matchup to do that and like that’s why Oklahoma City sitting there in the one seed for a team that very likely is going to be in the 910 and

Have to fight to the eight to make the playoffs I’m not certain they’re going to be 910 but go on well all the models have them in the nine10 so I’ll stick with that all the models are sitting Courtside of crypto what are you talking

About that’s that’s true but but I but I I think this is the fact that game again I know I second have it back toback like you said but the fact that game went again the way it did for the Thunder I think it shows the real

Weaknesses they have for as high as we are in their overall ceiling and and it it shows once again that if the Lakers get the right matchups they can be a dangerous team in specific matchups in the playoffs side is tough for McMahon it’s crypto because there’s a lot of

Tall women with short men McMahon doesn’t like that listen I got my woman I ain’t worried about the rest of them principle shout out to the IT department um goes about five foot five um anyways you got me rattled now oh talking about the um the you know the

Just the the problems that Thunder have with physicality you mentioned the front end of that back toback was that crazy game against the Suns well how did the Suns get back into that game after being down so much while uh you know Devin Booker was out with an ankle well the

Primary reason is because 300 pound Bruiser Yousef nkit was just tossing everybody around and grabbed 31 freaking rebounds I believe Chad has a pretty nasty black eye as a result of that matchup nerk definitely was flailing those big old logs that he calls arms around and smacked him in the head on

One how that wasn’t a flagrant is a a mystery but point being it’s not just the Lakers as a threat like you know the suns are a potential playin or a team that could come out of the playin or be even a 36 if the Thunder of three seed

You know I just now the Thunder had like they went out and got bomo off the scrap heat just to kind of give them a a physical option at Center they went out and got Mike McCalla off the scrap Heap to kind of give them a a different

Option as a big man by the way this will shock you mccalla’s net rating with the Thunder last year before they moved him was plus 9.4 oh so he he’s a pretty easy like obviously he was there for a little bit they know him knows the system knows the

Team whatever again another another pick and pop big to play with Shay and space the floor and frankly play with giddy some too like that that’s what you need if you’re gonna have either one of them out there somebody spacing the floor for so they have made these you know minor

Buyout Market type of moves to try to address the the depth at Center and kind of give them some options but as far as really digging in and and fixing the biggest flaw on that team that’s a summer project yeah swap out Josh giddy for a bigger player that doesn’t compromise

Their the way their offense runs that that’s the final piece they need to find Chad’s never going to you know he’s not going to you know come in one one uh training camp and suddenly weigh 275 pounds and be throwing guys around but the way that guy approaches things

The way that he works he’s going to get progressively stronger uh over the next several years so some of this will will be addressed just with his growth and development and work in the weight room and those sort of things um but no they I mean they’ve clearly got one kind of

Glaring void on that roster and they’ve got a lot of potential Avenues to to address it we’ll see if they choose to take one this summer so speaking figure something out he’s a smart I’m sure they’re working on it speaking of schedule over the next week the Lakers

Have pivotal time here so we mentioned that they’re playing the Bucks uh on Friday at home they have two games with the kings in the next week um and also a game with the Timberwolves the kings are Kings Wednesday at home in La by the way yes and then the following Wednesday in

Sacramento um the kings are three games ahead of them in the Lost column in the eighth spot getting to eight would obviously be a huge thing because you only have to win one playing game instead of two um the kings are all over the place um

They win some games that you don’t think they’re going to win they lose games that you think they won’t lose um just in the last two games for example they they Darren Fox was out with a sore knee they went into Minnesota with a very impressive overtime Victory they come

Home and get up 20 on the Bulls as we mentioned earlier with Deen Fox back in the lineup and blow the lead they have now blown I think three 20-point leads this season um they have also I think had two or three 20o comeback wins which is sort of the d uh

The epitome of their season they’re all over the place bouncing back in forth um they are actually there’s a pretty remarkable record that is pretty close to Falling um deat sabonis has 43 consecutive double doubles the alltime record is 51 by Moses Malone I was going

To say it has to be a Moses Malone record yeah um it’s uh can be done the next couple of weeks and I know that’s a you know there’s stat inflation because of speed of game but if that record Falls like that would be pretty remarkable so that’s all gone on the

Guy’s been incredibly productive and and effective and a bunch of those are triple doubles damn near half of them yeah crazy um but they’re all over the place I they’re very hard team to predict they’re they’re really on Pace they won 48 games last year they were the three

Seed um they’re only they’re on Pace to like win 46 or 47 they’re not really worse off dramatically they were last year but now they’re playing trying to stay out of a n910 situation um they’re a I I don’t know what’s gonna happen to them they got a lot going for him they

Got a lot going against them I I don’t know where they’re going to end up and these two games with the Lakers um could be really important in this next week uh bontemps yeah I mean they’re they’re going to be massive you know because again you know like you said they’re

They’re not really on a much different path than they were on last year from an overall standpoint but you look at where the West is it’s much deeper overall this year and as a result they’re down here you know in this morass of teams fighting for a play in spot as opposed

To where they were last year sitting in second in the west um second or third I don’t remember where that series ended up I guess it was I guess it was third because golden state was Sixth and the Lakers were seventh um but yeah like if

You look at their you know if you look at their projections for the season as of right now um the kings are projected to win 40 just under basically 46 games and finished eth last year I think they won 48 games and finished third you know

And like that like right now they’re on Pace to play the Thunder in the first round assuming they make it out of the playin um you know or they might have to beat the one of the Lakers or Warriors to get out of the playin and and frankly

The other thing is look say say it the standings are the way they are right now are you picking the Kings to beat the Mavericks in a playing game I mean it’s hard to pick him to beat anybody and then are you picking if if they don’t are you picking they beat

Home but are you picking them to beat the Warriors or Lakers in a playing game no I mean I I would beat anybody seven in the West can easily be a ticket to to the beach yeah especially I think for the Kings I think the Kings honestly and

Like I respect what they’ve done especially since Mike Brown’s been there um I think they are the least threatening team from 5 to 10 in the Western Conference yeah they’re definitely the team anybody would pick and say if you’re you’re lining them up you would say I’d rather play them over anybody

Except for maybe New Orleans I think maybe maybe but and New Orleans as we say all that New Orleans is the one who’s in Fifth and you know right but I just but you look at those but you look at those two teams and like you’re not

Going up against Luca you’re not going up against Steph you’re not going up against LeBron you’re not going up against Katie and Devin Booker right like all those teams at least have guys where like man I’m really worried about that guy for as good as dearon Fox is

For as good as D sabonis is for as good as Zion is for as good as Brandon Ingram is you go into a series playing against those guys right it’s just not the same Fear Factor level and the Kings have deficiencies outside of that where New

Orleans is probably a little deeper so I would you know there it’s sort of a tossup I’d probably favorite New Orleans but yeah like everybody’s sort of eyeing it saying man we get Sacramento in the first round or if we get Sacramento on the play in that’s a much more palatable option than

Getting LeBron in a one-off or Steph in a one off or Luca in seven games or Katie in seven games or whatever I will say this about the Kings um they had an opportunity to improve their roster in the off season and they just kind of doubled down on what they

Had they made the the the draft night trade with the Mavericks um gave up the what was in that deal the 24th pick and then it was a salary dump by the Kings dump holes to to create cap space to to create okay flexibility and that was omx

Prosper thatx Prosper look we’ll see about him um he’s not a factor in the NBA right now he’s a develop he’s the guy they hope can develop so who knows what the Kings would have taken there and I’m not saying that they could have used that pick to get better but they

For they gave up their first round pick to dump salary to open cap space yes they used that cap space to renegotiate and extend dad sabonis he gave them no discount in doing so I um he Bas you know they gave the money to him he is a great

Player their team didn’t get better though um you know and you know the point of the renegotiations in extension excuse me is that um they they gave him money out out from their salary cap that incre ined his salary immediately this year they he had contracted money for this year they

Added money to it and then built off of it and look they got him locked in so that was good then they resigned Harrison Barnes and they said you know we’re wagering on Keegan Murray to really improve which he has shown signs of that but this was a you know in the

West which is an absolute arms race they had an opportunity to improve their roster but it was straight through the draft or was using that cap space in different ways they elected not to they brought their team back they have spun their wheel and now they’re way back in

The standings well and you hit it on Murray their bet their bet was hey we’ve got a chance to be significantly better because this number four overall pick who had a really good rookie season can take a significant step forward and be the third star that they need and I’m

Not gonna sit here and say that Murray hasn’t had a good season he has not taken a star leap he’s averaging 15 points a game a little less efficient higher volume uh than last year he is a very good young Defender at 6 foot eight he gets their toughest defensive

Matchups usually one through four um he’s a he’s a like he’s a outstanding young player but he’s a far far far away from being a star yeah I mean look I think he’s had a really good second year and I think he’s made meaningful improvements and I think there’s a lot

To be excited about there but at the end of the day it’s and and I even did didn’t mind getting off the ran Holmes money I mean again the course I don’t mind getting off that but what do you do with it well yes that to me is like I

Like trading the 24th pick to get off the ran Holmes money okay I don’t no I I agree totally I’m I’m doubling down on this bonus part like if you’re going to renegotiate and extend Dem monus sabonis now you got to be getting a discount on that to some degree to better balance

Out your roster going forward instead of just basically paying him a full Max this year and moving forward cu again like deam like this goes back to the whole Tyrese halberton trade discussion we’ve had for years now he’s a really really really good player borderline all-nba player All-Star caliber player

You know both he and fox were obviously deserving candidates to be an All-Star this year didn’t make it but if he’s one of your two best players you’re probably not winning a first- round playoff series why because he’s lost in the first round of the playoffs I think five

Times now well as the first second best player on the team I would say if he’s one of your two best players and then there’s a significant drop off to your third and again their Hope was Murray would make it a your three best player conversation and and it’s just he’s not

There I think he’s got a chance I think he’s got a chance to still do that but again it’s to Brian’s point you had you had the ability to add more pieces to this team right now and you didn’t do it yes they did they got javelle

McGee yes they got they got your boy JaVale but I just you know because it’s it’s this is the weird thing about sort of how things go in the NBA right because again they’ve had they’ve taken steps forward in some respects from last year they’re going to

Have about the same season as last year but on the heels of last year especially if they don’t make the playoffs or something like that it’s going to feel like this massive backslide right when in a lot of ways I don’t think it is at all it’s just this is the Natural

Evolution things and they have to try to figure out how to level back up again but I don’t think it’s some failure of a season on their part and and last year was them coming out of the freaking Sahara desert right we talked about the playoff drought that was old enough to

Have a driver’s license right but you break that as a third seed and then you know you look around you say okay got a couple All-Star type guys got this number four overall get though they very upsettingly didn’t get they were Allstar type guys but they weren allar Allstar caliber player

Well guess what they didn’t get them because they were sort of I don’t remember exactly where they were at the time but last year they were like clearly at the top of the conference and this year they were sort of in the middle somewhere yeah but there’s and

They For The First Time in Forever The King’s entered a season with expectations and that tells you know that speaks to the progress that’s been made that they could win 46 47 games and this season could be considered somewhat of a disappointment um but they’re no longer

The the the kangs the k n g e z right well maybe they’ll be the Lakers both these games and we’ll have a different opinion of them and maybe they will lose because maybe they more likely they will probably split they’ll probably win the game in LA and probably

Lose the game at home one of those three things will happen they’ll either win them both lose them both or split them we’ll find out is that is that an official prediction from sometimes you win sometimes you lose sometimes it rains all right thank you for listening

To Ho Collective podcast and watching it if you watch on YouTube thank you to Jackson our producer thank you to Bon Temps who’s traing around North America this week and thank you to McMahon who is still licking his wounds from his championship game L but come back better

Hey I do want to make one thing clear I’ve got no problem with the short Fells getting beautiful tall women just officiating NBA games is the only thing just just just not having jobs no just officiating NBA games that’s the only place I’m trying to hold the C that’s

All gotta say all I will tell you is that in the last week several people longtime MBA type people have come forward much to my surprise Bon Temps to support McMahon’s position listen b squirrs find a nut every now and then has got some got some got some

Allies on something for change these gentlemen were all significantly taller than me but I was I was like I couldn’t believe this just out of nowhere just like by the way I’m with McMahon just a silent wink and Nod thumbs up I was like all right do

Not encourage him but to all those Anonymous important people I appreciate the support and adios amigos

Brian Windhorst is joined by Tim Bontemps and Tim MacMahon to talk an upcoming stretch of challenging games for the top teams in the Eastern Conference, including the Cavs, Celtics and Bucks. Plus, can Milwaukee beat Boston in a best of 7 series? Should the Thunder be concerned about their lack of size against the Lakers and why the Kings have been a rollercoaster at times.

0:00 Intro
1:56 Big Week For The Top Of The Eastern Conference
12:40 Donovan Mitchell’s Future
17:11 Are The Bucks Turning Things Around?
33:45 Size Concerns For Thunder With The Lakers?
45:40 Sacramento’s Up And Down Season

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