Why Nikola Jokic & Denver CAN’T BE STOPPED, Nuggets-Heat, Bulls-Pacers + NBA Mailbag | Hoops Tonight

Why Nikola Jokic & Denver CAN’T BE STOPPED, Nuggets-Heat, Bulls-Pacers + NBA Mailbag | Hoops Tonight

All right welcome to Hoops tonight here at the volume happy Thursday everybody hope all of you guys are having an incredible week got a fun show for you today we got another NBA Finals rematch last night between the Denver Nuggets and the Miami Heat we’re going to break

That game down from the perspective of both teams after that a super entertaining overtime game between the Chicago Bulls and the Indiana Pacers demard de R rozan goes crazy bulls get a big win we’re going to break that game down from the perspective of both teams then I got four or five mailbag

Questions for the end of the show you guys know the drill before we get started subscribe to our brand new YouTube channel mean a lot to me if you guys would take a second to scroll down and hit that subscribe button don’t forget about our podcast feed wherever

You get your podcast under Hoops tonight it’s also super helpful if you leave a rating and a review on that front follow me on on Twitter _ jlt so you guys don’t miss show announcements as well as the film threads that I do from time to time

And last but not least keep dropping mailbag questions so that we can keep hitting them throughout the rest of the regular season all right let’s talk some basketball so just like every other seemingly every other Denver Miami matchup Aaron Gordon dominated the game early by just bullying some of the Heat

Players and you know Miami for whatever reason is kind of content to let uh Aaron operate in single coverage a lot to start these games uh to see if they can handle it and each time they kind of get bullied there was a double team of

Jic in the post where Aaron Gordon just had a quick duck in on Jimmy Butler that’s how he got the scoring started then he just blew right through Duncan Robinson in kind of like a Semi-translucent then he uh came up the right wi and just took nicovic uh to task just in straight ISO just dropped his shoulder beat him to the spot and Drew a foul got to the free throw line hit a pull-up Jumper in that stretch as well Aaron Gordon is moving really

Confidently offensively right now at least in his aggression and then kyp early on was playing the passing Lanes he had two pick sixes and the Nuggets were defending well Jimmy Butler was missing his jumper Denver takes an early lead and then Miami you know how it is

With them they never kind of relent in terms of their effort and focus and energy and so they just kind of work their way back into the game especially in that stretch when joic was off the floor Eric spoler knows how Denver likes to play when joic is off it’s a lot of

Jamal Murray it’s a lot of him just dribbling around looking for his own shot he’s usually going to Target whoever he thinks is the worst individual Defender and go after him in this case it’s Patty Mills in these Miami lineups and they were just uh they had Caleb Martin on Jamal Caleb was

Doing a really nice job they were hedging and recovering with Patty rotating out of it well and then whenever Jamal did go to work in ISO they were just sending late double teams and so they like in a lot of these possessions specifically in that first

Half stretch the ball was ending up in Justin holiday’s hands and he was missing his jump shot at that F phase in the game now Jamal made a couple of shots you know like it’s he he has these like zero pass possessions they kind of remind me of Kyrie Irving back when he

Was with the uh Cleveland Cavaliers with LeBron where it was like where it’s like there’s just these possessions where Kyrie would get the inbound pass on the Bas Baseline and dribble up the floor and just you know maybe call for a ball screen maybe pick on a guy in a switch

But it’s just like a few dozen dribbles and then he’s going into a pullup two-point shot there was a possession I clocked where uh he had Caleb Martin on him and he called a screen to try to get Patty Mills into it to they he hedged

And recovered out of it that he called Thomas Bryant into the screen he hedged and recovered out of it he ended up taking 21 dribbles on The Possession without a pass and hit a pullback to a really nice little kind of half spin pullback dribble against Caleb Martin

Knocked down a two-point shot hit a step back three on Jimmy Butler in ISO as well so he hit a couple of shots but Miami kind of worked their way back into the game and then something to kind of put a pin in for the end of the game

After Jamal Murray goes out what what the Nuggets typically do is they’ll let Jamal Murray run that unit and then they’ll bring all the starters in and pull Jamal Murray out and put Reggie Jackson and in that middle of the second middle of the fourth quarter they’ll run

Reggie Jackson with the starters and Reggie in that second quarter stretch had a a kickout pass to Michael Porter Jr for a three and then he had a nice little elbow jumper in a ball screen so just put a pin in that because that’s going to be a big element in this game

When we get into the second half so we go into the third quarter Mii starts the third quarter on a run just really intense defense uh defense ball pressure and in rotation just classic you know Miami just being a pain in the ass right Terry roier is chasing Jamal around

Doing a really nice job bam a bio he I’ve talked about this on the show before for but he’s one of the best guys in the league at fronting the post against Nicole jic he’s just really quick and has great footwork to kind of whip around and get in front and then he

Squats down low and he can kind of stay in front but he also has the length to get over the top and what ends up happening a lot to Denver when Miami does that is they’ll find themselves in a late clock situation like they’ll run

An action try to get the ball into yic and the post and they can’t because he’s getting fronted and next thing you know there’s six or seven seconds left on the shot clock and it’s Michael Porter Jun or it’s casy p or it’s Jamal Murray just

Kind of having to throw up a shot right and so they were doing a good job kind of sending them into the worst parts of their offense Denver was missing some shots Miami goes on a little bit of a run their largest lead was with one minute left in the third quarter Duncan

Robinson ran a dribble handoff with Thomas Bryant on the right wing joic showed High Jamal Murray chased over the top Thomas Bryant slipped uh the the the Nuggets were not set up in their backside defense in the low man position and so uh Thomas Bryant got an easy

Little floater in the lane and Miami leads 71 to 67 that was the lead with one minute left Denver from there wed a went on a 33- 15 run to put the game away they had the lead in command within a couple of minutes 7167 with about a

Minute left in the third started with the postup double team of joic on the other end that got Aaron Gordon a right corner three remember Aaron Gordon’s not a good three-point shooter but he is out of the right corner he makes like half of them over there hadit a big one got

It to one then Miami ran that exact same dribble handoff that they typically run uh the one that I just talked about where Thomas Bryant got the slip for the layup except for this time Aaron Gordon was loaded up as the low Man the action

Got shut down they had to run it reverse going back the other way jic got a really good contest on uh on Duncan Robinson this time he missed it they go down um uh they go down to the other end of the floor Jamal Murray hits like a

Driving layup on the Baseline so they go into the fourth quarter with the lead they literally went from 7167 with a minute left in the third now they’re up 7271 and then Christian Brown uh Brown Excuse me quickly extends the lead hits a transition three in the right corner

Had a close out play where Caleb Martin was kind of digging down to the elbow and he drove out of the left wing or excuse me the right wing and like bumped uh uh Kaleb with his shoulder and just hit a little floater over the top then

You know one of the things that Denver is really good at is just identifying when they have a matchup advantage and just quickly wearing it out in this early uh fourth quarter stretch there was a play where he had Patty Mills on him and uh so he just brought Aaron

Gordon up in a ball screen as Thomas Bryant was guarding Aaron Gordon and he just got right downhill Thomas Bryant was really bad in his pick and roll defense was like way out of any position to be able to help on the drive and so Christian Brown just went all the way to

The basket made a little left-handed layup and so pretty quickly it went from again in a matter of a couple of minutes from Denver being down four for to Denver being up four now Miami fought back Duncan Robinson hit a three coming off of a screen Jimmy Butler had a put

Back dunk off of a bam Miss layup bam also had like a short roll possession where he hit haime HZ right under the basket but then Reggie Jackson comes in and this is that same stretch I was talking about from the middle of the second quarter where it’s basically

Reggie with the starters and they just start spamming jokic’s pick and roll and he just hits pull-up jumper after pullup jumper after pull-up jumper starts with like a really nasty left to right crossover to get Terry roier a position Terry rier just dies on the screen as a

Result of the nice move gets downhill hits a jumper at the right elbow next possession same exact thing except for going to the left elbow hits a pull-up jumper Miami adjusts by putting Jimmy Butler on uh uh uh on Reggie just to put some extra length on him they run

Another one this time Jimmy Butler though they set the screen further out from the basket and Jimmy just gets caught on the screen anyway and he walks into a pull up three and knocks it down just like that it’s a 10-point game and the game is basically over at that point

And it was kind of an ugly game for Denver but like to me I’ve always been more impressed by ugly wins than by pretty wins when things aren’t going well right like they threw the kitchen sink at joic like they always do and and so you know joic kind of had to play

Facilitator all night Jamal Murray was only five for 14 from the field but he hit key shots he had five assists with zero turnovers he did what he needed to do in a poor shooting night Michael Porter Jr scored 25 hit two big shots late in the game and a pull-up jump shot

To put them up by seven in the early fourth and then he hit the dagger on a skip pass and a play where they were uh uh pressuring out High to try to just basically get the ball out of Jamal Murray’s hands I think it might have

Been a a yic double team right around the top of the key but rifle skip pass to Michael Porter Jr in the left corner basically hit the dagger at that point that put him up 11 uh but they went with their defense Aaron Gordon and kavus C

Po were great as always uh kcp again always playing passing Lanes getting out in transition and getting those easy baskets that kind of just invigorate the team allow them to reset their defense big thing I wanted to call attention do too is and this is something that really

Stood out to me in the Boston Celtics game too Denver is just really good at closing out on Shooters and this is something that I think is highly underrated because like a lot of times we just look at like nearest Defender and uh this is one of the problems with

Analytics is they’ll just take like tracking data and just how close a Defender is and and basically equate that to a contest whereas there is a difference between like a a like running up on a shooter and offering a token late handup versus a real contest of a

Three-point shot and like you can see Denver like is actually trying to bother these shooters from the top down too like joic when he’s showing on these screens like he’s got length he’s getting his hands up there and he’s getting good contests Denver allows just 11.3 made three-point shots per game

That is not a coincidence that is a top- down habit that they have of offering good contests on three-point Shooters on the Miami front same consistent themes that we’ve been talking about all season another bad Jimmy Butler game against Denver he was 7 for 17 back in February

He was 6 for6 last night just one for six on pull-up jump shots and this has been a season long issue last year a Jimmy Butler pull-up jump shot was worth 0.94 points per possession that’s in the 55th percentile so slightly above average for his volume this year

0.82 points per Jimmy Butler pullup jump shot that’s in the 30th percentile so like well below average at that point big difference and again A lot of times especially against Denver those are the shots that their coverages are giving up that’s why they can sometimes struggle against Phoenix cuz they have guys that

Can hit those shots consistently uh bam once again missed seven shots in and around the paint that’s been an issue all season and then no reliable secondary scoring Terry Rosier just 14 points on 13 shots he’s had just two 20 plus point games in Miami in 18 tries in

30 games with Charlotte he had 21 20 plus point games now I know obviously that’s a different situation in Charlotte but even accounting for that they’re they more out of him than what they’ve been getting that’s four straight losses for the Heat and they’re just 26th in offense over that span you

Know I feel the same way about Miami that I did last year they they have the personnel and the collective basketball IQ from the coaching staff down the roster to upset any of the 27 other teams in the league that are not Boston and Denver they can beat any of those

Teams in a series that means yes I think they could beat Milwaukee yes they could uh obviously those are the only teams in the east that you’re really looking at right like Milwaukee and Boston but yes I think they can beat Milwaukee yes I think I I’d be inclined to pick them

Against just about anybody else in the East if they got out of the East and they went in the NBA finals and there was a Clippers there if there was a Suns there like I think they could win uh but they could also just as easily just as

Easily lose to any of those teams because of their lack of Firepower and if they did run into Boston or Denver they will lose just simply because they do not have the Firepower even compared to last year’s Boston team this year’s Boston team has just so much more

Firepower and that’s just an even bigger Gap that exists there that nearly cost them in the series last year and very well might have if it wasn’t for Jimmy or excuse me for Jason Tatum spraining his ankle so again like Miami is always somebody that’s got to be taken

Seriously but like more often than not it’s their personnel limitations that come to the surface and at a certain point like I just kind of want to see what this looks like when they have some real significant Talent advantages uh like most of the good teams in the

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Draftking Sportsbook with code Hoops that’s h o o PS the crown is yours all right moving on to Bulls Pacers so the Bulls win it overtime now before we even get into any sort of like why are we talking about the Bulls thing since November 30th the Bulls are 27 and 20

That’s the 11th best record in the NBA they’ve been a really good team for most of the season they have a ton of perimeter speed a lot of guards who can defend multiple positions as well dear de rozan is who in his last 16 games he’s averaging 275 and five on 50% from

The field 35% from three 90% from the line kobby white Nia vich over that same span are both also averaging 20 IO dummu is given them some really good three and D play from the guard position he’s also got like a lot more off the dribble pop

Than you think as well they’re hooping this is a real a real team right and obviously the Pacers are as well I want to kind of focus on crunch time in this game uh the going into the clutch period whether we were where we inside of five minutes inside of five points Pacers

Were up 104 to 103 uh cruso had been hitting threes all night long and so they end up getting a dunk for nicoa vich on a play where n Smith on the weak side did not want to tag vich on the roll just because he had already made so

Many threes vich gets a dunk the blls go up 105 104 yeah both teams had specific actions that they were targeting on both ends of the floor so like for the Pacers they knew that the pick and pop for Miles Turner was going to be wide open

All night Miles Turner hit a bunch of threes at the top of the key also some threes off of doubles but hit a bunch of Threes at the top of the key in the in that pick and pop situation also there was a stretch at the end of the fourth

Quarter where the uh Bulls took Tory Craig out Tory Craig had been guarding Pascal sakam they took him out and put AA dunu on sakam and then they started just attacking uh with cakam on aod dumo in the post and he was just drawing double teams and kicking out actually

Miles Turner hit a three to tie the game at 112 that came off of a double team of Pascal back him in the post and then on the other end of the floor it was kind of similar stuff like the uh demard D roen picking on Miles Turner in screens

Obviously like the uh Kobe white Nia vich pick and roll was a big one we talked about the play where they didn’t tag the roller vich gets a dunk there’s another one where they do tag the roller it gets kicked out to Caruso on the left

Wing extra pass to the corner to uh uh Tory Craig and he ends up knocking down a three so like they both teams were kind of just going to their pet actions again and again and again and then it just turned into absolute chaos at the

End of the game we had uh uh so the Pacers go down to cakam in the post against tunu again the blls double team and it’s a kickout pass to Andrew nard at the top of the key by the way at this point um at this point the uh I want to

Say the Bulls were up 115 or the Pacers were up 115 to 114 so the Pacers they they go to seak in the post against tunu there’s a double team it’s get gets kicked out there Andrew neard he misses the three and on the play uh Demar D

Rozan try is engaging a rebound with Aaron n Smith I think and it ends up getting knocked out of bounds they review it stays with uh stays with Indiana they run the exact they run a halberton Turner two-man game which was one of the actions they had been running

So much at the uh end of the game the uh uh on ball guy falls over so we end up with vich switched onto halberton again they double team that was a big thing that was happening is like when they run those ball screens vich was essentially

Having to switch out on halberton and then halberton would start ing up and then the the Bulls would have no choice but to come with a late double team but one of the things that was happening with Indiana is their spacing wasn’t super sharp and Andrew neard was spacing

Out pretty far away uh from the basket like 25 26 feet so these double teams were turning into like long three-point shots for Andrew nard he missed another one Miles Turner goes up and Taps the ball out but on the Tapout everyone kind of goes to the basketball and Kobe white

Gets it all of a sudden he’s got a head of Team going the other way and only Andrew hards in his way Andrew nard Sprints and gets back into the pl forces him to change his shot but zakum comes flying in from behind and comes uh comes

In and blocks it nearly goes out of bounds and nart saves it right to ER n Smith he gets fouled to go to the line to make both free throws it’s 117 114 Indiana intentionally fouls demard de rozan makes the first free throw misses the second Obi toppen fails to secure

The rebound T Taps it out of bounds and then Demar D rozan just hits a ridiculous right shoulder fade uh to send it to overtime there’s a cool quote from DeMar D rozan after the game talking about how clutch situations kind of become like survival mode and that’s

Literally what it is and it’s something that I’ve always loved about the game of basketball is like when you get into those situations where it’s all on the line and everyone’s playing super hard it almost becomes about survival in the sense that it’s very improvisational

It’s a lot of like like he even talked about he was like uh in the time out they had called for him they kind of had set up a screening action in the key for him to come up toward WS the top of the key and they were basically top locking

It preparing to switch so dear dorsen did a really smart counter he ran up like he was going to go off that screen and then he kind of just gave a little push and then cut back towards the basketball along the Baseline got just enough separation and then we’re talking

About arguably the best Fade Away jump shooter of this era uh depending on who you ask he’s definitely like this is a guy who’s made his entire living in the NBA off of right shoulder and left shoulder fades in that mid-range area hits that right shoulder fade over the

Uh uh um uh hits the the right shoulder fate along the Baseline sends the game to OT when we go into overtime really became about DeMar rosen picking on Miles Turner and switches setting ball screens getting Turner on switches and he was just hitting those classic

Crossover moves to just get a little bit of Separation to elevate knock down mid-range jump shots then as a result of that um uh uh the the Pacers had to start doubling which is something we’ll come back to in a second on the other end of the floor Pacers hit a couple of

Pick and pop threes for Miles Turner it was the one action that they just could not figure out Albert’s coming off usovich is having to show and many times switch and and then the only way they could avoid that Kickback P to Turner was to switch which would then end up in

A double team anyway so they were in a real predicament on that specific front just guarding and dealing with Tyrus Halbert and pick and roll but the couple of Turner threes keep the Pacers in front and then Demar de R rozan just hits a nasty hesitation pullup three

Over Pascal sakam to put the Bulls up then the Pacers start face guarding to rzan because he’s got 45 points at this point so they need someone else to get a bucket vvi just takes Turner to task and ISO hits a right shoulder fade then IOD

Dunu drove right by tyres Alberton in an ISO just dusted him off the dribble and got a layup and then again on the other end of the floor whenever uh they went back to switching that pick and roll to stop Turner from getting those pick and

Pop Threes And when they did that once again it just kept ending up at Andrew nar’s hands too far away from the basket so the Pacers need to a little bit of work on how to deal with just late double teams on isos when Hal Burton’s

Picking on the big man just like maybe having nard instead of sitting out that far from the three-point line having somebody flash cut to an opening that’s closer to the ball so that maybe they can get something that’s a little bit more going towards the rim uh SE yakum

Did hit a move on Craig on a baseline out of bounds to get it to two with 42 seconds left one of the things that kind of sucked in this game is on that crazy SE yakum block at the end of regulation he landed on top of Kobe white looked

Like he tweaked his knee I couldn’t find any information on what uh the injury update was with Kobe white so hopefully he’s okay but toy Craig came back into the game um with uh uh with uh in overtime and uh seak hit a bucket on him

To put it back to two Demar D rozan dribbling at the top kind of out by half court they throw late double team Adam kuso slips the uh the ball screen D rozan hits Caruso it’s the textbook four on three situation I would assum you just kind of sneaks along the Baseline

And finds a little opening on the left side of the basket gets a layup and the game is over uh a couple things hopefully cop white is okay like we talked about earlier I wanted to focus before we get move on from this game I want to talk about uh just something

That Rick Carlile talked about after the game the idea of like minor mistakes and you know he mentioned after the game we were one rebound away from winning and he’s right if they if Obby toppin instead of tapping out that free throw rebound if he just grabs it and gets

Fouled the Pacers win this game that was how well they played and you know you know when we look at games like in particular games that are just super back and forth and both teams have multiple leads late it’s it’s kind of harder to focus on big picture things

Because like you know either team could have won this game again like Pacers do a basic thing like grabbing a free throw rebound they just win and then it’s an entirely different vibe coming out of this game and so what I like to focus on

When we when we look at games like this is why attention to detail is so important on the little things because yes you’re right in these kinds of games there’s a lot of like maybe maybe demaro rosan makes the crazy right shoulder fade maybe Miles Turner is making the

Pick and pop three there’s a lot of like make and Miss type of stuff going on that’s a little bit outside of your control obviously it’s inside of your control to work for the best possible shots it’s inside of your control defensively to make as many things as

Difficult as possible but there are also some things in that element that are out of your control in terms of makes and misses as far as the details go though that’s where if you are sharp on the little things you buy eles the margin for error for maybe for someone to make

A big shot for the other team or maybe for you to miss a big shot for your team for example the free throw rebound that’s a uh we don’t need to get any further into it just sticking to your fundamentals having someone box out the shooter pinching on the best uh uh um

Pinching on the the best bigger you know kind of forward that they have on the Block bringing a guy in crashing from behind the free throw shoot or whatever you got to do you got to secure your rebound there right also a Mis rotation on the double team when double team dear

Demar R rozan out top it was a two-point game they get a stop there they have a chance to go down they all eyes are on the ball though no one’s tracking the other off ball Defenders and duno sneaks along the Baseline and like the one

Thing you can’t give up in a fouron three is a layup you got to make someone make a jump shot in that situation even on the Bulls front like that lineup decision Tory Craig I actually thought was doing a solid job on Pascal seaka and at the very least you could leave

Him in single coverage he had actually stonewalled seak a couple of times there down the stretch and right regulation they take him out of the game and go in with dunu put him at the four and one of the biggest possessions of the game was when it was 112 109 and cakam just

Because dunu is at the four has to has a huge mismatch in size on dunu just takes him down to the block and draws a double team and the ball gets worked around a Miles Turner for three on the left wing so even on the coaching side of things

Like a little decision here a little decision there goes a long way in these kinds of games and that’s why when you see me harp on on on team like Denver and their execution that’s why because like a lot of playoff games look like that a lot of playoff series look like

That they are determined by the slightest of margins and so you know it the execution piece the the like attention to detail piece those sorts of things tend to be difference makers in in when you get to the latest levels of the playoffs and that’s why I focus on

Those things so well they’re really fun game like just like classic NBA uh regular season gem there from the Pacers and the Bulls really enjoyed watching that game this morning all right let’s move on to our mailbag and then we’re gonna get out of here for the day hey

Jason love your show have you noticed that almost all of the best teams in both conferences have most or all of their core players in their Prime 25 to 32 Denver Boston Cleveland Minnesota Phoenix Dallas New York Etc OKC and the Clippers are the exceptions but Shay is

Clearly in his prime as well as the Clippers role players looking at Golden State and the Lakers it’s no coincidence that they’ve struggled so much since the dubs only have Wiggins in his prime and the Lakers just ELO and reefs ad is clearly on the decline since 2020 it

Seems that constructing a roster with all the core players on the same timeline is the biggest factor to winning which means Oklahoma City Orlando and Indiana could dominate in the late 2020s curious about your thoughts on this um yeah so a couple things first of all I and this is a big

Thing that kind of stood out to me just watching Pacers Bulls as the way the game has changed the sheer amount of perimeter talent and speed has made it so that older teams I think struggle just to keep up defensively now in a way that they didn’t used to like you really

Got to get up for these games defensively against some of these quicker teams on the perimeter so many teams around the league now are running five out offense I I I won’t get into it right now because we did a little bit we did like two summers ago I think we did

A breakdown on five out offense but like the the gist of it is the in a five out offense you’re leaving the paint unoccupied and you’re getting into the paint on rolls and drives what that means is is like your big man whoever you’re vertical spacer is he’s operating

Out on the perimeter running dribble handoffs and ball screens and then rolling into the paint rather than waiting in the paint and then coming up to set a ball screen or waiting in the paint you know to sit in the dunker spot and then there’s tons of different

Actions and entries like you can get into five out from pistol you can get into five out from horns you can do that kind of thing but the gist of it is all five players are in the perimeter and the paint is left open so that guys can

Roll into it and guys can drive into it and then from there it’s everyone’s involved they’re interchangeable spots you know all of your perimeter players are are able to run a dribble handoff or to run a ball screen whereas like a 4 out offense is much more like think

About like what uh um like what Dallas runs it’s much more of like a Brute Force like our primary ball handler and our secondary ball handler the two guys in the corner they do nothing but shoot and we’re going to come set up a we’re

Going to come and set a ball screen and we’re uh from the guy starting under the basket to come set the screen it’s just Brute Force basketball and usually there’s only four perimeter spots occupied it’s not equal opportunity the guys in the corners are just in the

Corners the guys up top are the guys running the action and so that’s kind of the difference and as most of the league has gone into five out style of play or at least it’s trending in that direction you had five out basketball with a ton

Of quick guards and a ton of speed and skill all of a sudden the dudes that are in their 30s that their legs don’t get as warm as they used to on a nightly basis they struggle to guard now that is something to keep in mind as well though

When we get to the postseason because when we get into the postseason the effort Gap shrinks and then those veteran teams do have manages and experience and skill so I don’t think it’s I don’t think it’s smart to write off all those veteran teams but I do

Think it’s something to keep in mind when we’re talking about regular season basketball older slower teams are going to really start to struggle in the NBA regular season I truly believe that um next question hi Jason I’m curious to know how you assess off Ball 3 and D cutting players for example archetypes

Like ball dominant shot creators or Rim Runners shot blockers is easier to see how they affect the game and there’s always the usual metrics that are used to measure their efficiency and usage for the offb archetype right those usual metrics and it tests don’t always work

Just because you come off of these curl screens and back doors doesn’t mean you always receive the pass or the passes and screens aren’t great plus your team context matters if your team is a heavy ISO or postup Centric team your Effectiveness likely won’t be as good or

As a similarly graded off-ball player whose team is say drive and kick Centric every championship team has prioritized offb threats so quality players that fit this mold are super valuable I just feel that often the archetype is undervalued in the draft and perhaps a reason why

It’s not clear how to measure this this style compared to other archetypes thanks again for all the content so I think like when it comes to the way I look at it we talked about five out offense a second ago so let’s take two offenses for example let’s say Golden

State five out offense and let’s take Dallas more of a Brute Force four out one in offense right in the role players you need in both systems are very different okay so five out basketball is primarily read and react what that means is there’s a ton of like improvisational

Back uh basketball going on I’m going to back door cut here when he’s over playing me right like I’m this is a Twan action coming off of the screen if I see this I slip if I don’t see this I go over the top like if I see this maybe I

Turn and pin down for the other guy to run off and then I slip or whatever it is like there’s a lot of read and react basketball taking place same thing goes for the on through the uh big guy on the ball right like if he sees if he sees

His Defender sagging back and he has an opportunity to set a good screen you want want to throw the dribble pitch if you see your Defender showing High and the guy chasing you want to fake the dribble hand off and then turn and go to the basket that’s a read that Draymond

Green’s really good at for instance right so everything in the five out is read and react in the four out one in it’s way less about readed and react and way more about play finishing what that means is like the only guy really making reads is the Luca or the Kyrie in that

Situation right he’s got the ball he’s dribbling up at the left wing he’s calling Derrick Lively to come up and set the screen all of the other guys have the exact job left corner if it’s Josh Green he’s spotting up right corner if it’s PJ Washington he’s spotting up

Tyrie Irving second side Creator he’s in the right wing he’s spotting up Derek ly is going to come set a ball screen as soon as he sets a screen he’s rolling hard to the basket okay if the action gets shut down maybe Luca will swing to

Kyrie Luca will run back out to the left wing two guys will stay in the corner Derek Livy will run up and set the the next screen it’s the exact same damn thing right like that’s it’s very Brute Force right so the only thing Derk I has

To do is screen and roll hard and have the vertical spacing element the only thing Josh Green needs to do is hit a corner three or attack a close out the only thing PJ Washington needs to do is attack a hit a three or attack a close

Out Kyrie Irving hit a three attack a close out or if the ball gets swung to you run the next ball screen so it’s super simplified so what matters so much more in that four out one in system is those guys that are spacing can they knock down threes and attack Closeouts

Much more simplified for the screen and roll guy does he have the ability to set good screens and roll hard to the rim and provide vertical spacing with good hands in verticality right like does he have those abilities so like when I’m evaluating a role player for that system

I’m really going to be looking at things like you know spot up points per possession just like a simple thing that just evaluates how good this guy is at converting spot-up opportunities a guy who’s a great spot-up player is not necessarily a great read and react player those are two potentially

Different things I’m going to be leaning on metrics a lot more there for readed and react it’s so much more about the eye test in my opinion it’s so much about watching a player play in his system seeing whether or not he’s good at interpreting what’s happening on the

Floor quickly and then if you’re looking at him in free agency and you’re a five out offense maybe that’s the kind of guy that you want to Target but again read and react everybody’s got to be able to do so many different things versus Brute Force I’ve got play starters and play

Finishers and that’s pretty much it hopefully that’s a an explanation that um kind of hits set what you were getting at in that question have you noticed a change in NBA players shot making in the last two years seems like there’s been a breakthrough in sports psychology and

These players can enter and stay in a flow State allowing the offense and shooting efficiency to explode hope you can ask an NBA player if you ever get the chance I will if we ever get an NBA player on the show um as far as shot

Making goes I talked about this a little bit yesterday you know every single bit of shot making is actually just fundamental basketball attached in Chains what that means is like let’s say for instance I hit a uh James Harden style you know like in and out crossover aggressive step forward step

Back to my left pull up jump shot right like that’s an advanced piece of shot making put together by James Harden right but if you really break it down it’s a hard In-N-Out dribble that’s a fundamental thing it’s a crossover dribble that’s a fundamental thing it’s an advanced dribble with a hard right

Foot step to step back I’m looking at it from James Harden he’s a lefty I’m looking at it for me as a righty but that hard right step forward and that step back and then there’s a footwork element to getting my base set so that I

Can go straight up and down on the move and if I make the move properly I will go straight up and down and if I took a video of just the end of that shot it’s going to look just like a catch and shoot jumper at least that’s the way it

Is for me so like that is a bunch of fundamentals attached together there are certain things in basketball that have existed forever and what’s happening is NBA players are finding new ways to kind of daisy chain those things together and make uh new ways to score the basketball

It’s like even like just the idea of like hitting three-point shots in ball screens which is a thing that used to just basically not be a thing in the NBA 15 years ago and now it’s a like a must for any sort of primary ball handler to

Be able to punish teams that die on screens or go under screens right really it’s the same exact thing you’re high hesitation which is a fundamental thing and then oh the defender got caught or oh I have maybe a little bit of space if I if the defender got caught I can just

Elevate from there if I need to advance to get a little further up so that he can’t back pressure it’s a wonder dribble pull-up it’s just a one Tri a pull-up these are all fundamental things that people have attached together but over time everyone’s got the existing

Manual from the last group of players so like you know the like the new generation learned from LeBron’s generation LeBron’s generation learned from Kobe’s generation Kobe’s generation learned from MJ’s generation MJ’s generation learned from bird and magic and so on and so forth and so they’re

All just building on each other and it’s stacking and it’s stacking and that’s how basketball players are getting better uh two more and then we’re out of here hey Jason can you explain how D’s dribbling is legal to me as a relatively unexperienced fan it seems like every

Few dribbles he holds the ball remember he’s not supposed to do that and then he lets it Go and it drops back to the floor I hope you can picture what I mean in my head I see it clearly thanks for these mailbag sessions I know you can’t

Get to everything but I wish you uh but I wish you could since I have a ton more questions keep asking them like again I’m not going to get to every single question but we’re going to keep doing them throughout the season and so I will

Try to eventually get to as many as I can over time uh every NBA player carries like it’s it if you really slow down the ball handling for literally any like some guys are worse than others like K KD is another guy who like really

Kind of holds it under his hand when he does his high hesitation but the thing is is like it’s it it’s legal by interpretation meaning like the refs just allow it around the league and so like again like I don’t get upset about anybody around the league doing it

Because it’s literally something that every single team has two or three guys that do if that makes sense last question after their 22 Championship you praised the Warriors for roster or you praise the Warriors roster building and patience and you said that you appreciated that good process from owners front office

And coaching staff and even players that led to success do you feel like the Warriors are still abiding by that process or do you feel like they’ve been winging it since things have gone South after the punch especially after Bob Myers who you praised in that June 22

Video left if you do trust that they’re still abiding by that process JK has been balling Moody’s been good drafting Brandon psky and Trace Jackson Davis how much of a chance compared to back in 2022 do you give them to reach their ultimate goal again this year or

Next year or however long step Dre and Clay may still play couple of things so first of all you know I was critical of the Warriors after the during the 22 run just because I’m a big Pusher chips into the middle of the table guy I’m a big

Believer that like winning an NBA championship is super hard and the last thing you want to do is lose in a series where you didn’t have enough Firepower and you had trade assets available that you held on to and here’s the thing like the winner gets to tell the story

There’s a version of that where they lose to Boston and you’re like we play Jonathan Kingo we didn’t play James wisman we didn’t play Moses moody this was this was a waste we didn’t get anything out of this right like there’s a version of that where that’s what

Happened that’s not what happened though Steph Curry was amazing in game four they they won the series and so now you get the trophy and you get all of the assets that come from it from there it’s been tricky because they have not had enough Firepower in the 2023 and 2024

Season now for the first year and a half of that stretch I was a big advocate of making a trade because I thought Steph you know think Steph is still at the top of that you know kind of seven or eight players in the NBA and you got to give

That dude a chance to win a championship because he’s one of the rare players who’s capable of doing it but what happened was is in the middle of this season Jonathan kaminga took a leap and once Jonathan kaminga took a leap a real leap a leap that makes you believe

Legitimately he can be probably the second best player on a championship team one day at some point in his career once you see that that changes the calculus and now all of a sudden it’s like uh like whatever minuscule Improvement we get through making some sort of trade it actually makes more

Sense to kind of hang on to these guys and see what they how it develops and so again like there might have been a point before Jonathan kinga’s you know seven straight 20 plus point games or whatever there might have been a point during that phase where it made sense to to

Move him to try to bring in more Firepower but you know at the end of the day new information came into the equation and and now the Warriors are kind of in a situation where like here’s the deal focusing on this season do I think they have much of a chance no

They’re they’re they don’t have a legitimate secondary like a reliable secondary option at this point in terms of a guy that you can count on for four playoff rounds to give you reliable scoring which that was kind of Andrew Wiggins and Jordan P combined in the 2022 playoff run Jordan P’s not here

Anymore and Klay Thompson is not the same player that he used to be Andrew Wiggins is not the same player that he used to be and so they just don’t have the same amount of Firepower that they had then even like little things like a guy like a Porter Jr who was super

Valuable in that particular season right like they just aren’t as as deep with like reliable playoff guys that said I still think it’s a really encouraging time to be a Warriors fan because Jonathan kaminga is so good because Steph Curry still has years left right because Trace Jackson Davis has been a

Revelation because Moses Moody is a guy that can defend on the perimeter and and has some off the dribble pop and can knock down spot of Threes like they’ve got a lot of encouraging stuff it’s more of a big picture uh move at this point where you’re kind of hoping that you can

Overlap some of these young guys getting into their Prime with the tail end of Steph’s Prime and maybe find a year in there where you can sneak to the top all right guys that is all I have for today as always we sincerely appreciate you for supporting the show one more uh we

Have two more shows this week we’re going tomorrow morning breaking down Celtic Suns and then on Saturday night Lakers Warriors Live on YouTube after the final buzzer I will see you guys tomorrow Morning

Jason Timpf reacts to Nikola Jokic and the Denver Nuggets beating Jimmy Butler and the Miami Heat 100-88 as Denver continues to look unstoppable while in pursuit of winning back-to-back NBA championships. Jason recaps the Chicago Bulls beating the Indiana Pacers, and answers fan mailbag questions on the hottest topics from around the NBA.

Timeline:
00:00 – Nuggets-Heat reaction
09:20 – Denver wins with defense
10:20 – Jimmy Butler disappoints
13:37 – Bulls stay hot vs. Pacers
24:57 – NBA Mailbag

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