NBA Draft 2024: Matas Buzelis, Ron Holland, Atlanta Hawks No. 1 pick with four weeks to go (Pt. 2)

NBA Draft 2024: Matas Buzelis, Ron Holland, Atlanta Hawks No. 1 pick with four weeks to go (Pt. 2)

on today’s show we’re back with part two with myself and Bryce Hendricks talking all things NBA Draft Atlanta Hawks we’ll get into all that right now you are locked on Hawks your daily Atlanta Hawks podcast part of the locked on podcast Network your team every day Hello friends welcome to episode 1726 of L and Hawks podcast I your host Brad Roland coming to on a Tuesday into Wednesday here in late May and today’s podcast is WR by the folks at the game time app download the game time app right now create an account and use promo code loton NBA for $20 off your first purchase with game time terms apply also want to encourage you at the top of the podcast to make us your first listen each and every day check us out and subscribe to this podcast lock on Hawks anywhere you find your podcasts Spotify Apple YouTube overcast we are all of those places and many more places so I appreciate everybody listening to the show as always this is part two so if you missed part one of this conversation it is definitely better to start at the beginning with myself and Bryce Hendricks that’s episode 1725 it’s part one should be available in your St podcast if you’re listening to this podcast in but this is part two just more on the NBA draft all fun things talking to uh talking R all kinds of NBA draft stuff so top of the draft his sleepers Etc and we’re going with more of that right now with part two I do want to get to Modis because he’s the guy that you have high who is generally seen as a top what eight guy in the class for most people yeah who obviously I think could I’m not saying he’s G play for the Hawks number one but he’s at least conceivable I think we could acknowledge the Hawks are not going to take tow bitcher CER they’re not they’re not doing that Modis I’m not I haven’t crossed Modis off my list I don’t think that I’ve heard the Hawks are in on him but it wouldn’t like I wouldn’t fall on the floor if they were like we love him so let’s go to him now you’re obviously high on him if you would if you had him in your top four so um for people that didn’t see the G League this year uh a lot because I think that’s most probably most listeners to this and most people in the world didn’t ton of g g night tape this year um I like him a lot too but what is the same sort of thing what is the what is the elevator pitch on Modis and why he would be as high as he is for you um you know I I think it’s it’s probably very different than uh you know what I what I a lot of people thought it would be coming into the year again I to be honest I haven’t really paid too much attention to like consensus or what a lot of people have been saying but for me it’s you’re probably better off I I kind of have to do that for other reasons but I think it’s sometimes better just watch the tape and make your own decisions so yeah I’m jealous with uh W with buellis you know I think he’s a really good backside rim protector I think that’s something we found is really valuable uh turns out he’s not as long as I kind of thought he was he only has a 610 wingspan but he plays really long uh really quick vertical um you know I he can um do just enough with the ball to not be um he can do just enough with the ball to not be like uh you know a mess on that end like he can he can he can dribble more than someone like Reas I I don’t think he’s like a you know I for some like I I swear he was comped to like Lamar odm at some point that’s not who he is but like he there were some Wild Ones especially coming in I know you remember this I’m sure about like he was number one on some mainstream boards like last summer like actually it was he and Holland were all up there a lot the eventual teammates in in the G league and I saw some pretty aggressive comparisons that if you hadn’t if if all you saw was that and you watched him play this year you would be like was that the same player that you were talking about a year ago so I’m I’m with you on that like you kind of need if you have a cop in your head from 20123 I would probably throw it out yeah yeah no but you know like uh to me I guess elevator you asked for elevator pitch and I’m I’m rambling but that’s fine for me it’s absolutely I I think he’s a Swiss army knife defensively who’s potentially a really good backside rim protector which is to Me Maybe the most valuable type of fourman Defender you can have um I I think there’s a good chance he makes shots but even if he doesn’t I think he’s so um athletic and versatily athletic at The Rim that it doesn’t it doesn’t matter a ton he can do some dunker spot stuff I think he could probably even be just like a screen and roll guy um he he can get up off one or two uh high points ball as well and he can just op like like he can just operate and do more stuff than than you know a lot of guys who I think have similar skill sets you know I actually think to me Matas is a very similar cell to why I still believed in jayen McDaniels when he you know everyone kind of got out on him yeah and they’re like oh like you know this was supposed to be like a you know like a big K he he got the KD comps and everything and I’m like that that’s not who he is like like you know Matas isn’t Lamar Odum but he is what he is is a really versatile defensive player who if you can just consistently get to make shots is is athletic enough to exist on the floor even if he’s not uh you know an elite shooter and and um to me I I I just think that’s a valuable archetype it’s the type of player who you know again is not a a typical number one but to me is a really typical Lottery player I consistently have guys like Matas you know fairly high in the lottery and I think we’ve seen it play out consistently that it’s a valuable uh that’s a valuable uh playoff player you know I like the highend for Matas as we were talking about comps is someone like an Aaron Gordon I think that’s a really really valuable player ESP especially in the case of Gordon who like it took him to a second team who realized that he wasn’t a non-ball guy um and then he’s like by the way he’s a top 50 player in the league something like that just doing what he does like just uh so no I I’ve always liked Modis I did this uh the last mock draft that I was participating in before the Hawks won the lottery I got modest at 10 and I was like jubilant I was like that’s the guy I would want in a dream world at 10 realistically um and then at number one like canly I I wouldn’t I wouldn’t take him there I think he is and he’s in my top five six seven range but I wouldn’t take him number one I do think and look this is not an area that I’m I’ve explored a ton on the podcast but like there’s a world still where the Hawks trade down I think it’s unlikely to happen but it’s possible in this draft if they really think that there’s not a huge gap I think philosophically you can do that if you get if you get enough of a reason to move down and if they go let’s just say they go to four something is that was the Spurs are four they go to four like then m is firmly in play in my opinion at one I think it’s probably not going to happen based on what I’ve heard I say probably not definitely keep that in mind uh but uh yeah no I I like he’s he’s my kind of guy honestly if you’re listening to the podcast you probably expect that like the defense is particularly interesting he knows he seems to know how to play which I I like he and look I make the same case for gron Holland in a different way but I it’s so hard to remove these guys from that terrible terrible situation there in and we’ve all said it I think it’s I think every podcast you’re contractually obligated to mention how bad it was but it really was so bad it makes I mean I know about you it made it hard for me to evaluate them this year it really did both 100% Tower Smith too I mean it’s same thing like it’s it’s hard to evaluate anybody that was in that system so um no I like I like mod he’s not quite as I think you talk touch on this as dependent as re is on the jumper I do think that that’s a swing skill for him offensively if the shot is not averager better he’s going to have some trouble on offense I feel like not not not not unplayable but not a guy who’s he’s G be more of like a you’re okay we kind of have to guard you guy versus if he can shoot high 30s from three then you really have an intriguing kind of Jack of all trades guy yeah you know I talked with uh with some guys about the shot and the tough thing is uh I have a tough time determining if it’s if it’s one issue that can be fixed or if it’s if it’s two separate issues that will require the jumper to be rebuilt um he has this uh he gets a ton of forearm pronation so like his he holds the ball like this and then twists his arm out and that pushes the ball towards the right and then to compensate for that he twists his hips so it makes the window of like what it’s like a double it’s it’s in golf it’s it’s like a double miss you know you’re like you’re going yeah yeah so you know I I don’t know if that’s what like like can you just get him to move the ball straight up and then you know his hips will stay more stagnant naturally or is it something that’s going to uh take time but you know I I think there’s some okay touch there again like um you know compared to someone like uh like Holland who’s jumper touch I don’t buy as much I think Montas has some natural outside touch and um you know and again like you said it best but I I I also don’t think he’s riant on the jumper to be an NBA player um agreed versus some other guys you know even even sawar in some ways like to be a really valuable NBA player I think is kind of relied on the jumper because I don’t buy the pick and roll Stu as much like I think m would be a better like true pick and roll five on both ends if if we were just talking about filling that roll he’s a lower upside and you know I’m with you where I even though I have him in the same tier I probably wouldn’t take Matas over over sawar um you know it would have to be a really really specific fit like you know if if if the Rockets ended up with the number one pick I I probably would have pushed for Matas over SAR but like basically anyone else you know star is the better is the better fit but um I do like Ms and in this draft like if someone falls in love with SAR and and you’re not in love with him like that I I would absolutely look to trade back and see if I could get him because I think he’s another guy who could make you a potentially really devastating defense playing next to Jaylen Johnson if one or both of them could just make shots at a consistent enough level to you know free the space for the other one Today’s Show is brought to you by the game time app game time is an authorized tiet Marketplace in the NBA makes play off tickets even faster and easier than it was before that’s the case for the NBA finals which coming up really very soon and I know i’ love to be there 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also getting the lowest possible price guarantee with the folks at game time take all the guest work out of buying tickets with the folks at the game time app download the game time app create an account use promo code locked on MBA for $20 off your first purchase terms apply again create that account redem that promo code locked on be $20 off that first purchase download the game time app today last minute tickets lowest price guaranteed one more modest thing um I always hear the Denny of D comp and it’s probably just because they’re both white guys but uh there’s some similarities the it’s how they play and I always look at like Denny’s first couple years he wasn’t shooting but not even making he wasn’t making shots either but he was he just wasn’t shooting and he wasn’t being guarded he was kind of being ignored and then it’s not a coincidence this year in his fourth season he made this really notable jump on a bad team that nobody really watched but he made he was really good this year he shot it well and he shot it more and it was like I don’t want to make that one to one but it’s kind of and Denny by the way was a totally functional NBA player and Modis I think has different skills and better skills in some areas than dny did but Denny was a guy who you could play he was a rotation player despite shooting like I think it was like 29% three for two or three years and then suddenly he became willing and able to shoot and he was suddenly a starter and was good so that’s too simple but I I just don’t want to for a close on it man you could say this for everybody you know Steph Castle’s the same way Ron Holland’s the same way in different ways but like man it’s like can you shoot or not and I would just love to know the answer to all these guys yeah no for sure but I I think I I think that’s a great point and uh I you know we talk about the draft and you know I I get clowned all the time for past opinions and the truth is so much of it comes down to did you guess right that this guy was going to make shots I that’s a lot of it I mean the Ron Holland thing so I want to ask about Ron Holland while we’re here you know there is he might have the biggest split of anybody like I people that I think are smart have Ron Halland number one John Hollinger has Ron Halland number one on his board and I get it I understand why but also if he if he if he can’t shoot if he shoots the way he did this year for instance in the G league if that’s going to be his shooting long term he would not be that high obviously so like it comes he’s maybe the protyp example in this class of someone who it’s going to be really hard to figure it out and you’ll look stupid either way but if we just kind of put that on the table as Like You can disagree with me if you want to in a second that’s put that aside almost what about the rest of Ron Holland like do you like Ron Holland as a prospect beyond that because I think we all kind of build the shooting questions in what else man you know I I really wanted to love Ron Holland I I came into this year like this is the guy I’m probably going to have number one you know played at Duncanville I for whatever reason I I enjoy watching Duncanville uh and you know I was really high on on him there um you know there’s obviously some stuff right like the motor is great uh it’s rare that you see a guy as highly touted as him that plays that hard I think that’s something that him and REE aay have in common where it’s like man like when was the last time you saw a guy who was you know really this this well renowned also plays with this type of intensity um you know that’s great I think uh the the left foot burst in and athleticism is great um I think my my biggest issue is that I just don’t actually think he’s that good at defense like I I really think the he’s he’s sold so often as this you know highlevel Defender if he shoots guy and I actually think he’s much closer to like you know he gets really he creates really easy advantages going towards right hand off his left leg um he he has really bad imbalance in his in his legs I don’t want to I don’t want to get too deep into it but like he has no juice off his right leg and a ton of juice off his left leg um it’s pretty you know it’s pretty Stark if you slow down and you watch when he hits crossovers you’ll see that every single time he has to reset his feet so that he can explode off his left leg he is never hitting a move and exploding off that right leg it allows NBA defense Defenders are going to have a much easier time guarding that especially if he’s not making shots um but uh I I digress again that’s too much but I I I think on the ball defensively he’s just really bad like some of it’s the size the skinniness that he can get pushed through but I just think he he stands upright too much um he’s so focused on um either uh he’s trying to give a gap too much and his footwork is really bad and he’s always drop stepping um and Defenders are getting hips really easily or he presses up too much and then he stands too upright and and he just again just gives up his hips too easily he gets blown by quite a bit he does a lot of popping and I I’m not sure it’s all just like oh footwork stff that’ll get cleaned up in the NBA I think there’s again partially because of the the athleticism and balance um partially because he’s so he wants to contest from behind every time he’s one of those guys where it’s like I want chase down blocks and that that’s stff just that type of Defense just doesn’t work in the NBA that’s why I’m much more comfortable uh projecting rashay as an on ball Defender because he does he’s not like that he is trying to flatten guys out and make their drives harder um in a way that holl just isn’t you know I do think Holland is a really good like nail kind of steals Defender guy but that’s just a less valuable type of Defense than what Matas brings or even what maybe Ras brings if Ras is truly like a lock down guy like when I think the most valuable types of Defense I think okay are are you big enough strong enough to guard the Kevin Durant the LeBron James the you know those types of players of the world or are you uh a good enough rim protector that you can teams need to find a way to keep you in the paint you know especially like we’ve seen how teams their go-to way of guarding like embiid and yic now is to put someone else on embiid and yic and then keep another guy at The Rim can you be that guy that keep at The Rim Holland is in either of those he because again he can’t really get up off two feet Holland is a is a pretty bad like low man guy I think he has to really Sprint in to help on those blocks he can’t get vertical the way Matas can um you know he’s an energy guy he’ll probably find a spot in the league just because he’s so athletic and there is some star Equity there like it easy to see that first step and and how easily he creates advantages and how good he’s a really good finisher too and he’s devastating transition player okay like there there’s potential for him to be like a 20 you know plus Point per game scorer but I also just think with him there’s uh you know there there’s a lot of stuff that that really worries me and and I’d still draft him in the first round but I think it would be pretty ill advised to take him here at one especially considering you know again the Jaylen Johnson thing I think he’s super it with Johnson um and and it’s uh it would be um you know probably a mistake in my opinion but there’s stuff there I don’t want to seem like a like I like I I want him to succeed but there I te up that way like the range is so big because I I think you just had all of it like and you came around to at the end like there is a pathway for him to be the 67 23 point a game hyper athletic Wing that every team in the league wants I mean there’s a comparison out there that I’ve seen that’s not insane to to the Jaylen Brown path like Jaylen Brown had a really rough year at Cal he was not efficient he wasn’t a shooter then he was not a proven shooter by any means and look he’s made huge strides his shooting’s come so far he still can’t do certain things like dribble his left hand all these kind of things but Jaylen Brown became a star and granted he went number three in the class it was there was that was divisive when it happened I mean I was it was a long time ago now but that was devisive when it happened and because it was like you kind of had to watch him in high school to take him there versus what the way what put on film at Cal and you could certainly make the argument for Ron Holland like he had this rough year in the G league but it was a weird context and all that stuff so I’m not saying it’s become J Brown don’t get me wrong but that’s an outcome that I can see happening I can see him becoming a a top 25 player in the league if it all if it works so if you’re a ceiling drafter like philosophically if your whole thing is I want to take the guy with the highest ceiling and you think that’s Ron Holland I don’t think you’re crazy I really don’t it’s just that for me I’m a little bit more median a little bit more not necessar floor but and I I definitely like him more than you do based on what this conversation this conversation we just had I like him more than you do but I wouldn’t take him one I think that I would have him on my board if you Trad it down similarly to what we talked about before but it’s he’s fascinating to me and he has him this whole time like if if the Hawks had gotten him that had been fourth on the board instead of first there was that minute where there could have been one two three or four if they had been four I would have done a lot of RW Holland talk for a month right now it’s not he’s kind of pushes the side because I think he’s not realistic he’s like he’s not gonna go number one I don’t think but uh I just find him really interesting because of all what we just said that this the the split there is just it’s wi for everybody man his his outcomes have a huge you know what’s funny is you’re definitely higher on him than me it sounds like but also I completely agree that there’s a world he can be like a Jaylen Brown caliber player yeah now now that’s undeniably outlier development on Brown’s part but it’s it’s also like a path you can outl like um jimy one that I’ve heard for Ron Holland like you know and Jimmy speaking of outlier growth Jimmy went from a the 30th pick in the draft atam Marquette who was not who was a defense only guy and became an offensive star like that’s not you can’t project that path it’s just that it it’s one of those things where you’re trying to find again I just stand a pair of six seven physically gifted Wings who developed their offensive game and it’s not you can’t again does it mean you can Bank on that it’s just that if you’re again if you’re if you’re optimistic about the tools you see the six seven super athletic physical play super hard like you said guy and then if you get the out ler development of a of one of those guys or you know the other one I’ve always heard is you know kawai’s development offensively was not something you could have projected and it happened so but those are three examples out of how many examples you know what I mean yeah but and something I’ll say you know in your favor is that I I’m I’m not here I’m not going to sit here and pretend like I’m the most connected guy in the world but you know I talk to people I know I know a few Scouts and stuff and all I’ve heard is that yeah he’s I mean is a hard work he’s he’s about the right things and uh I even even some more you know towards like that yeah he’s even like on like the Zack LaVine Colin seon like uh basketball psycho as as some like to refer to it and I I do struggle to bet against those guys especially if they’re six7 and as athletic as H right like I think there’s a spot in the league for him I just um I I I just worry like like a lot of those guys you mentioned I think were much better Defenders than Holland like I I I think maybe my biggest disc connect is just I don’t buy the defense well that’s why and honestly that makes sense like everything everything you said about that if if you don’t think the defense is as good as people some people do then yeah you couldn’t possibly be that high on them that is a that’s a divide that makes total sense I’m not saying you’re right or wrong I just if you if that’s your valuation you can’t have him as a top five Prospect in this class I don’t think based on what everything else that he has all the questions about his offense if you don’t buy the defense like all right what what are we doing here it’s then it becomes more of a like bet on the tools and upside bet but those guys come in to play later the draft not necessarily that high in the draft so anyway um ion I won’t make you keep doing that uh the rest of the show I want to get to guys that you like so we’ve talked we’ve we’ve done the high and low on guys but I’m trying to have people on that I can give them rope to talk about guys that they like so we could talk positively about some prospects even if they’re not Hawks guys you know um for instance you mentioned having Isaiah ker in your top four that is not an outlier opinion but it’s not a consensus opinion for instance there’s I feel like the internet’s higher on CER than the leag right now does that seem like it’s fair um so that’s one I’m not I’m not tell you who to talk about but I did I did warn you about this who are some guys that you like in this class maybe more than everybody else does and uh well if if there’s a chance for me to bring it back to the Hawks I will but that’s that’s not a requirement yeah so you know I think Coler is a great place to start because I I think for me that’s one of those where you talk about sealing Drafting and I think Coler are just a really high sealing player um he was in a pretty bad context at USC he was hurt for a lot of the year um I think he’s the best Advantage Creator in this class uh I I don’t think there’s anyone who W uh with or without screens creates advantages better than him I think he’s fairly smart I think he’s a good passer um I think he projects to me as a pretty good Defender he he is falling victim to the um I I I haven’t come come up with a great name for it but whenever these there’s these highly ranked rsci guards they’re they’re expected to be perfect in their freshman year and if they’re not perfect they’re it feels like they’re almost completely dismissed sometimes we’ve seen that I mean Kentucky guards are the most famous and and that’s why we have the Kentucky guard syndrome but I think it’s even more so than that it’s it’s guards in general who you know for whatever reason underperform their rsci rankings um but you know continue to develop and make a name for themselves in the league and I think Collier is uh he’s someone who just he’s he’s strong you know I think strength is a real separator for for guards I think he’s probably I I I didn’t see the combine measure but he’s probably a real 62 63 like like real point guard size and he just gets hip super easy as a driver and he makes good decisions when he gets into the lane like he’s a good finisher I think he has good touch uh he’s he’s one where I think a lot of people freak out about the jump shot I understand that I think I I I buy it to be good enough um but uh you know I I I’ve been burned by betting on guards like this before I had you know I I think I had sharief Cooper probably like 17 or something and that that was lower than some people right but um there go but uh you know I I I just I really like Collier and and I think he gets underrated just because he’s a you know he he’s a guard who played on a team that wasn’t very good and sometimes that’s all it takes is he played on a team that wasn’t very good but uh you know I’ve been watching him now for like three years and every take every time I’ve seen him my takeaway has been yeah this the best guard in this class pretty comfortably you know there were always question oh is it him or DJ Wagner I was like it’s Coler coler’s a better player and obviously Wagner was not good this year and is not even in the draft at all but um you know I think I I think Coler if you’re if you want a ceiling it’s something similar to like like a Tyrese Maxi but but you know probably less of a shooter more of a passer type like like but he’s he’s GNA get talked about you know because I I’ll bet you he’ll fall to out of the lottery it’ll be the max again and people are going to say oh maybe he could beat tyres Maxi and while he’s not that as a player I think he could potentially reach that caliber you know like like you know there’s even a ceiling where it’s he is the type of guy who could just drive efficient offense for a really good defensive team like that’s what I see for him is hey surrounded with really good defensive talent and say hey we’re going to give you a ton of usage and just you know play with that I just I think there’s there’s uh uh the the NBA has come back to positionality again it went away from it a little bit and it was like oh man we just wings um and and you know we wanted everyone to be 64 to 6 68 and and to be able to switch and do all that and I love that version of basketball too but uh we’ve seen this this strong Return of the of the guard and the big as potential build around pieces and I think more than anyone in this class call if if you were going to tell me hey someone in this class is going to break out and be the best player on a team that makes the finals or something my money would be call on call year for that no I can totally see it and I you know I was doing more stuff a few months ago I was consistently higher on him than the like the sort of Intel boards were because I think the leag every once a while this happened to Maxi that’s the most recent example but there’s like every once a while there’s guy the internet’s like why why is this guy fallowing so far and it doesn’t mean it always works but um he did get punished for USC a little bit too much it wasn’t his fault I don’t think um the jump shots a question he it didn’t really go in that well this year but he was a good two-point finisher he’s really strong you mentioned the um the height uh he measured at 62 and a half without shoes so that’s 63 and a half 6’4 good size for a point guard he’s physically gifted um no I see it I definitely think he has a path to be at least a starting point guard and that’s if you get a starting point guard at the end of the lottery or you know God forbid beyond the lottery like that’s a really good outcome if’s even if he’s not gonna hit the ceiling that um that you lay out like that’s a strong outcome if you become starter so um no I like him too I think less than you do but that’s okay I like him more than I’m between the consensus and you on as somewhere so that’s fair um who else do we uh you know what who’s your next guy I’m not even gonna tee you up who else who who else on Bryce’s gu list that you love the other guy and I I feel like I have a lot less to say here than I could but but the other guy who was just in my top four was Reed Shepard oh yeah um I I just think like I think he’s somehow under discussed is like one of the best shooting prospects everever like he shot like he is a very from three this year like I I think I was going through his Synergy Clips today actually I think like 97 of them were pull-ups and he’s in the he was in the 99th percentile of Pull-Up scoring like um you know that’s sometimes if a guy just has a special skill I don’t really care about a ton of the other stuff sometimes like I think he’s a sound Defender um not great he’s best off the ball you know he’s not Derek white but like he can do some good nail St you know he kind of reminds me of like um um a little bit of like he’s not as Stout but a little bit of like Andrew neard defensively just in that like he does a lot of good stuff at the nail he’s obviously really smart hopefully hope he’d be better on jayen Brunson than yeah well see see and that’s who you know he’s probably gonna struggle on the Brunson no I’m kidding but you know I agree with you he’s I I do like I think people are gonna especially people that didn’t watch college are gonna see Reed Shepard and they’re gonna see short white guy and be like he can’t play defense and I don’t think he’s great defensively I think the steel rate the steel rate in particular in the block right over index what he actually is going to be defensively because if you look like I think it was I can’t remember which which stat model but it was like one of the stat models it’s off the charts for Reed Shepard yeah and part of that’s the shooting too but part of it’s the steel block rates because those those us really good indicators and he’s he’s really got him but I think that he kind of how would I say this not that he was forced to but I think he kind of knows what he can’t do he’s got great he’s got great hands and he lets those hands make up for some what he can’t do does that make sense 100 100% I think he’s going to be probably pretty bad on the ball early in his career I think he can develop into it okay but you know you bring up Brunson something else I think he has similarly is that I don’t know that he’s someone who can be guarded by smaller guys like at his at his higher end outcomes because he rises up so high and so quickly that like the reason nard couldn’t guard Brunson is because even though they’re like you know nart is like two inches taller than Brunson Brunson just Rose over them every time and like the contestant of bother him at all I think Shepard has some of that um you know his his biggest issue as a player is that he comes to wide off of screens and pick and roll I I think that’s something that’s fairly teachable I I don’t see like I don’t I don’t really see like Superstar with Shephard unless the shooting is just like to that level but you have to be ridiculous which is it’s it’s not it’s not insane I won’t use the step comp don’t no one should use step comp no one ever but like that’s the only way the way that I’ve heard people try to say here’s how he gets to Star is something like that and I’m not yeah I I would just never think that’s possible again I’m sure someone maybe do it in the in my lifetime someone will shoot like Steph and it will happen I don’t know if it’s Sheard but even then I think Steph’s not Steph’s on ball game was better than people remember that remember it being um even when he was younger anyway so I I I’m with you and also I think people know this the reason I’ve done less read on this podcast is because like I don’t think the Hawks can take Reed Shepard I just don’t yeah yeah based on none of I mean I don’t have I wouldn’t have him in played number one overall anyway but for any team but the Hawks make it even more no more of a cross off for me especially because I’m I’m in the camp of that the Hawks should keep try young and Trey young reer don’t they just don’t work see I’d actually maybe push back like I I think there’s a world where in the regular season you can get away with it oh no I agree with you on that I I just think that and look this is a this is the end of an hour podcast it’s fine uh Trey’s defense is not as bad as people think that it is anymore um but I still think if you’re using a top not number one a top five pick Let’s just say in this scenario you would want to draft a guy in theory that doesn’t have to not be on the court with your best player in a playoff game and I think that they would have some trouble even with deante I mean okay let’s just use Dante like dejonte has better physical gifts defensively than Reed sheer he’s taller he’s longer Etc his rep defensively is above where it actually is and they haven’t been able to play with those two guys together on defense and I think Reed is even small he’s in fact I know he’s I know he’s smaller uh so all those actually it might work pretty well in fact but uh yeah I just I can’t I can’t see it but hey doesn’t mean he’s a bad player it’d be like having like like another Kevin hder esque player next to him and we’ve seen how that works right well Kevin it worked it worked enough to go to the Conference Finals but no honestly this is not a piston spot I I really want to see I don’t think it’s gonna happen I would like to see Reed Sheard to Detroit see I think we’re like I I I I think Detroit would be great I for like I’d kill in Orlando like somewhere he could play next to someone who’s who’s a big guard next to him Orlando doesn’t even have like Orlando has the it’s more like Paulo and France versus guards and Detroit would be Kate of course like someone who could play next where where Reed’s the smallest guy on the court but isn’t playing only point guard you know what I mean um that’s kind of the theory of I I mentioned Detroit because they’re picking what are they are they they’re fifth um that would be the highest spot where I would be like all right I totally get it there you know Houston and world where they didn’t have would be interesting um I don’t know they have I like GRE Shephard again probably Les probably less than you do but I like him I like him quite a bit he’s he’s in my top 10 firmly so I’m a fan you know for me I I I with a lot of teams not with the Hawks probably but I would consider him at one just because like I I do think he has the best skill in the draft and I also think um I just there there’s something there with just his um potential to play on and off the ball that I think is is worthwhile but it’s I I’m with you where it’s it’s it’s tough and you know part of what led me to putting Reed at one or two wherever I’m going to end up with him is I was thinking about this draft and I’m like I had cassan Wallace at four last year and I was like would I draft cassan Wallace first overall in this draft this year and I I think I probably would have and which is yeah I mean I’m not sure Reed is that much of a worse I think I I preferred cassan a little bit to re Sheard but like you know I think it’s somewhere in in the range and um I you know I was higher I was higher on cassan than than most I think but I just yeah something like that uh quickly one other guy I I know I know we’re going long but no it’s fine I’ll keep someone who I think is potentially really worthwhile I I again I haven’t paid too much uh attention to consensus but I’ve seen him as low as like the 50s if the Hawks could find a way to get Dron Holmes they should I am I’m a fan also of him it does it does see I know you’re not paying attention to consens stuff it seems like he’s been rising okay in the in the more n you know the ESPN’s I think I think Sam actually had him pretty high the whole time but I think he’s come up in the ESPN I don’t know about blue report I think he went pretty he’s pretty low there but anyway I 100% with you I’ve had him his first round pick all year long I like Don on hommes yeah no I just you know I just think there’s a lot there you know the biggest issue was he’s a great he’s a great passer who played in an offense that didn’t utilize his passing at all that’s um so you know like I I don’t really know like like that really hurt him I think he can shoot like I’m pretty confident projecting him as someone who can make shots like he doesn’t have a huge track record of it but I think it looks good and the improvements he’s made year-over-year on it are are really good the only issue is that when he gets tired he’ll lean his shoulders forward or back and that tends to throw off like like you can always tell if it’s going to miss short it’s because he threw his shoulders back if he’s gonna miss long it’s because he threw his shoulders forward um but you know I think that’s a fairly simple fix I think he’s gotten better every year I just think he’s a great passer I think he’s a versatile Defender I think he can legitimately switch I don’t know he’d be a great switch big but like he can do it sometimes um he can operate your dho stuff he’s a really good post scorer like like I I would consider him like top top 20 easily um and like I you know I’ve seen him like I said super low I I hope he I hope he continues to Rise um I I don’t know exactly where he’s going to go but but to me he’s one of the guys in this class who I’m most confident saying yeah that’s a player who you know even at lower level outcomes can tribute to a playoff rotation there’s only so many guys that I’m confident saying that with and I think Holmes is one of them he’s just the type of big who matters matters the most in the playoffs and I don’t see that changing um anytime soon I’m definitely on your side I just looked while you were talking uh vini’s got him 26th which is kind of where I am probably in the TW somewhere in the 20 but a first- round pick for me whereas I believe ESPN is like like you said like around 50 which is that’s too low just it’s just too low for me um and he’s he’s not even old like I know feel it feels like he was at Dayton forever but he’s not old I think he’s s he’s still 21 he’s still 21 like he’s not that’s not super old so no I’m I’m in on him as well um and at some point this is this is a tease I’m planning to do a show that’s like exclusively second round focused even though the Hawks don’t have a second round pick because it’s pretty easy to get one if like last year for instance they got to get to get your guy moay to bring It full circle to get your guy moay they traded to get that pick they went they went proactively got that pick in the moment to make sure they got moay and it’s doable basically any team short of like having uh maybe Phoenix does not have any scratch to get anybody anymore they have no they have no picks to offer but the Hawks can get back in if they want to so if there’s somebody in the top four that falls too far like a drawn Holmes we’ll see uh in fact I’ll be I’ll be kind of surprised if the Hawks make one pick draft night just kind of not shocked but like a little bit surprised they I feel like they’re team with the track even like when they got got Skyler Mays they moved they moved back into the draft they often move yeah they and you know and look they’ve Al They they’ve also had very little success in the second round it’s a pet peeve of mine they haven’t really hit on a second round pick in like a decade like Mike mcalla was the last one they hit on and that was he’s still he’s still in the league but it’s that’s been 10 10 11 years now maybe moay will change that maybe seia will change that those guys were drafted last year before that you could argue scol May might been their best pick for a while and he didn’t go like 50 he’s still in the league too a few a few years later but anyway uh we will see yeah Bryce thank you for the time we’ve gone long that’s that’s my fault and not yours hopefully I didn’t derill your evening um working folks fun all of your work I will do my best to plug it before I bring you into at the top of this podcast as well but uh work with folks be finding all of your drafts up because it’s it’s great and by the way you guys don’t care about time at all on your podcast you guys forever we go like if anything my fiance will be happy that she’ll be like oh you were only recording you’re done yeah no uh yeah you can we I really the only thing publicly I do anymore is website swings to be a draft podcast which is you know everywhere you can you can find podcasts Bry H4 on Twitter but you know for the most part I’ve stopped writing uh um most of the basketball work I do now is uh behind the scenes I guess you could say but uh you know you’re coaching you’re you’re a basketball coach yeah I coach I coach at a jco in in Washington state so you know staying stay staying close to home and and you know contining to work and and grow and uh you know just happy that I still get to do some of this stuff sometimes because I I know I told the story last time and we’re later into it but like for whatever reason one day randomly I started listening to your like to lock on Hawks like I’m I’m not a Hawks fan I care very little for for anything Atlanta I’ve never I’ve actually never been to the state of Georgia in my life but I started listening to to Loon Hawks and um you were the first guy to convince me that Matt Mitchell was a really good basketball player and that I like Matt Mitchell still I still believe in Matt Mitchell all these years later someday someday no I appreciate that and yeah I mean there’s uh when especially when when the Hawks were rebuilding I think I did more draft content than most shows would have done but it’s just I like the draft and even now like it’s this is a little bit easier and also harder as you and I were talking about before we started recording it’s like it’s almost better for me that there is a number one pick that’s consensus last year would have been like I talked to Matt tinan who Co who uh who covers the Spurs and I was like what did you do between the lottery and the draft last year like we all knew it was gonna happen he was like we just started doing Wy talk already I’m like aren’t you gonna wear yourself out I guess I guess not but anyway there’s more the Hawks and we got into some of those on this podcast and I appreciate it so thanks again Bryce I do appreciate it uh I will try to find a third Bryce for the next show we a row here I’m not sure if I know know to Bryce so maybe not but uh thank you for being here my friend absolutely thank you so much as everybody else please subscribe to the podcast to check out upside swings I recommend it at the highest level and we’ll see you guys next time

Brad Rowland (@BTRowland) hosts episode No. 1726 of the Locked on Hawks podcast, and he is joined by Bryce Hendricks (Upside Swings) for Part 2 of a 2-part discussion. The show focuses on the 2024 NBA Draft, with conversation about Alex Sarr, Zaccharie Risacher, Ron Holland, Matas Buzelis, Bryce’s favorite players in the class, and much more.

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