The Zach Edey Pod

The Zach Edey Pod

welcome to down to dunk I’m your host Andrew schor part of the athletic podcast network with me as always on Mondays it’s my good friend Mel Barra mckel what’s up well I mean I’m diving into college basketball into watching some prospects so it’s uh the good old days where in late April we had nothing to do but that this year it’s early June slash late May so it’s um quite an achievement yeah there are a lot of interesting prospects at 12 that I am I’m I’m excited honestly I’m excited to see what direction the Thunder go in because I think that there’s a lot of different ways to go and especially kind of looking at the Boston Celtics and the way that they’ve kind of organized their team it’s not crazy dissimilar to the way the Thunder kind of want to do theirs and excuse me the amount of like on ball Defenders that they have is just is really important and the Thunder have some of those guys already but you just wonder after watching this playoffs I think like having like point of attack defense just all the time is so so important yeah to your team and having like dorton KAS is great and even JB to to you know extent you know is a good point of attack Defender but I think like if that’s the the kind of players that you go after in the draft I think it’s a pretty good strategy I think it’s like a really good way to go and like Devin Carter is the guy that I think about in this next class that’s like 63 really long arms pretty good score like decent passer kind of combo guard but like just a great defender and a guy that can really help you there even Isaiah Collier who’s like definitely not my favorite Prospect definitely has a score but as a guy that like is athletic enough that you could kind of teach to be that kind of guy um I just wonder about that that archetype of player even Jared McCain who’s not necessarily like the I’m speechless that you brought up a Collier I I am really not for not particularly for the Thunder I actually really like it for really like him for Utah just as like hey can we just try out a point guard yeah but Devin Carter is like this like comboy guard that’s like similar to kase in a lot of ways you need to go get more guys like that I really do believe the Thunder need a big defend like a bigger guy like Saloon is like the kind of guy I think the Thunder would go after and the kind of guy the Thunder kind of need is a a guy like him and he’s finished the season really well um for chile but um yeah it’s it’s interesting and we’ll dive more into the draft as we go but I was kind of wanting to to look back uh a little bit um on the season that Thunder had just because you know one we have a ton of time to fill yeah you know as we go but I think it’s just good to kind of reflect on you know where where they were what they did this season and then perhaps like where where did we go from here because I think a lot of people just jump right to like oh my gosh and I don’t know I I can’t like scroll through social media without like being targeted with thunder stuff just because like the algorithm knows that I like the Thunder or that I have the thunder in my feet all the time but like you just see it’s just all about like the rumors and stuff right now and there’s people put putting things out there that aren’t even really rumors they’re just like thought exercises disguised as rumors like the Kyle kosma thing that cuz like floating around I don’t even remember who tweeted it but it somehow hit my feed and I’m like okay I I actually don’t hate the idea of Ky kosma in Oklahoma City as just like a like a theory like this like big you know shooter Defender like sure what happened with you where where is Andrew like first Isaiah klier then Kyle kosma who’s next I don’t know I’m juston Davies coming from the I don’t know retirement hey that would be cool um but like honestly just like really use your brain about cous like really really really really use your brain think about it kusma hasn’t been the fourth or fifth best player on on a team in a long time in a really long time if ever honestly like who was on that that Lakers championship team um that KZ was on where they won the title like he was a starter for them and a really nice player for them I mean he had he was a role player for that team yeah he was a role player he was and that’s the kind that’s what you would want him to F but also think about like who was on that team you know who was on that team kind of guiding things for them um the guys who played the most minut in the playoffs on that particular team Anthony Davis LeBron kcp Danny Green kuso Kyle kosma was six in total minutes yeah and like listen if you have LeBron and Anthony Davis yeah that’s great but KZ has been in Washington the past three seasons he took 18.8 shots per game last season he’s been at he was at 17 shots per game the year before now he’s 25 26 and four I mean you’re gonna ask him say hey that’s great you’re gonna have to go back to the kusma of 1920 like nine shots per game where it was um 11 shots per game he only shot and this is the thing where it just all kind of falls apart he’s a career 33% from three yeah he was 31% from three that year when he played with LeBron and AD and won the title let’s see what he did in the playoffs in the 1920 season he was only 31% from three yeah that’s you know I me that’s not going to cut it yeah and that’s and that’s that’s the deal it’s like you want if you get a big forward like that one you need him to be a really good defensive player and kma’s been that in spots mhm he can do that but you also have to have a floor spacer you just have to I would much rather have John Collins and I don’t like John Collins uh yeah yeah sure yeah I mean you just ask me who has shot better in their career in the playoffs from three Josh giddy or Kyle kosma and the answer is Josh giddy by a large by a large margin 35% from three is what he shot in the playoffs it’s by a large margin so yeah and and it’s and it’s something where I think we should start from uh evaluating the playoffs um I know that with the ifs with the maybe with the yes but uh kind of argument you you don’t go far uh in life in general um but if we go back and analyze the first round of the of Dallas for example M and how Derek Jones Jr and and PJ shot the ball compared to gidy yeah if you flipflop what they had probably OKC wins anyway against the the Pelicans maybe not not four and0 and they definitely win with Dallas if gidy has the series that he had from three against the Mavs um and and it’s not like why I’m saying that it’s because the the Timberwolves tried to play Dallas Square fair and square Without Really doubling too much and they got demolished just steamrolled uh it was not even a game because they couldn’t keep up with um with LCA and Kyrie oky made a different choice they tried to to see if uh those two had it and they had it same as same is the PS um and so I really think that sometimes it’s it’s a little bit of variance and and odds now you as a team you don’t want to leave that to odds you don’t want to leave that just to variants you can allow some variant you can allow your variance being Isaiah Joe shooting one game better than the other you can allow probably uh that varience in in in dub and and Chad who didn’t have the best playoffs but if you if your offense is predicated on gidy making shots in order to win against Dallas then you need to do a little bit more but but yeah I mean we need to realize how how that was close and how that was hey if Josh has two quarters that are better okay see may win the series so it’s it’s when we when I hear the I I was listening to the great part that you had with Alex last week um and I’m and I’m sorry that that my thoughts were seen as hey you want to run it back no I I I I really don’t I I think that you don’t want to demolish what you created I don’t think that the difference against Dallas was egregious I think it was fair and square like almost even I don’t I don’t think that that is enough I don’t think that anybody in the in the OKC Stratosphere would say looking at this team hey we have enough let’s not move anything let’s don’t do anything perfect the way they are like no I don’t think anybody thinks that I think that they they are going to grow and get better naturally C and that’s going to happen but also once you have the information you have to you have to do something with it I mean just just as an illustration of how good the Thunder were defensively against Dallas LCA donic in the six games was 24 points 10 boards eight assists I mean it’s great 44% from the field 39% from three really good against the Minnesota Timberwolves who had the best defense in the league by far 32 n and eight shoot shot 47% from the field three percentage points better against the Timberwolves and 43% from three then KY better if you look at the effective field goal or true shooting it’s it’s a different different game yeah Kyrie Irving against the Thunder 15 points two boards six assists against the Minnesota timber roles 27 points per game 27 points per game I mean that’s crazy three and four and the and it’s funny I was listening to to Josh Eustace and to Jay King and Zack Harper on the basket Bud show today and they’re like describing this game plan that is like the exact Thunder game plan for like how you defend the Mavericks yeah and like the thing that really killed the thunder in that series was that you had PJ Washington and derck Jones Jr who both shot 47% from the field and then PJ was 46% from three in that Series yeah he was 25% from three in the series against the Minnesota Timberwolves 25% if you got that version similar quality the quality is not that different yeah if you got it’s a bit different if you got this PJ though like the Thunder are in the the Thunder beat the maps you know it’s just some of that is in experience from the Thunder some of that is just shot variance there are a lot of factors there’s not just one factor that leads to losing a series it’s multi it’s multifactors and a lot of it is too like the Thunder offensively were not very good yeah and they can be they can be better and I’m so intrigued to see how Boston does because the the there’s a lot of similarities between Boston and OKC but the biggest difference between the two of them is the way they defend Boston gives up six Corner threes per game on average they don’t let teams shoot from the corners and they they gave up a pretty high percentage at the r R probably as a result of that and so I’m really really intrigued to see how what that strategy does if they do take away those Corners well then what and can they have guys like Derek white and Drew holiday and Jaylen Brown for that matter stick to Kyrie Irving and Luca and really disrupt them because if they can do that like this could actually be a pretty quick series if they can take away corners and use they’re like great you know Defenders to lock those guys up as much as you can because it can be done and it’s it’s just funny I I was listening to zacko and Kevin Pelton talking about it and they like completely glossed over the fact that like Lou Dort did a masterful job on Luca yeah they completely like completely missed it um aome yeah oh he was so good and that’s why and that’s why I kind of like point back to man I just don’t know that you can have too many that archetype of player where it’s like really good Defender you know good Team Defender good individual Defender and a guy that can help you just be a little bit more versatile in the offensive end and that’s I just don’t think you can have too many of those guys in this league and you know Boston’s got a lot of those guys I think the Thunder are collecting those those kinds of players and a lot of it too is like the mentality of these guys where like do they fit your culture do they fit your team and like if those if the answer is yes and that’s part of like why I Love Stefan Castle you know like feel like that he could be like a really good point of attack Defender he’s he’s got a long way to go as an offensive player um especially as a shooter but if he figured it out it’d be amazing I like Jared McCain a lot I think he’s a competitor and a great shooter I think he could be really helpful and then Devin Carter like those are the guys that I would like Circle as like hey Holland he’s pretty good defensively I’m not kidding I know I Ro I just have issues with him the way that he the way that he plays on offense I just have a lot of issues I just have a lot of issues there just because I and this I mean the stats are overwhelmingly good but he was also like the guy for the G League ignite before he got hurt um yeah I mean obviously that body type and that kind of Defender yeah like give me that if you can have that guy I mean boy I mean the Thunder already had I mean they had an out an outstanding season they had an outstanding season you know they were second in net rating in the league at 6.4 second in defense in the league and then they were eighth in offense like if you add a Defender like Ron Holland and like also I just don’t know that he can play right away but if he could theoretically theoretically play right away like that’s yeah that’s the kind of Defender but then when you talk about offensively I think it’s so so important for Thunder fans to realize this like the less pattern more Rhythm thing that prey said I think maybe it was two years ago like that rings so true to today to how the Thunder want to operate their offense and their defense for that matter but mostly their offense which is why guys like Holland are very difficult to slide in it’s tough it’s tough and I and like people point you like what about Lou Dort yeah the thing about Lou Dort is that he was given the gift of time that the players that they that they bring on to the team now don’t have he was given the gift of Hey listen whatever happens happens man Gabby deck come on down you know you can do whatever that is still the weirdest to me I I want to do like a a little mini docu series on The Gabby deck Saga in OK yeah why the heck that happened I got I got some of the weirdest phone calls during the The Gabby deck I do remember that the Gabby deck time um I I just think that whenever we think about players and Alex and I are gonna I’m I’m forming a a list and Alex and I are gonna go through some players on on Wednesday that might make sense for the Thunder I think thinking about the less pattern more Rhythm thing is so so important MH and also why it’s really hard for them to incorporate a uh a big that is only like a vertical lob threat where like that is like a patterned way to play in a lot of ways and I just don’t know I think that they really want to flow and now that guy would maybe would have to be a great passer or something I just don’t think like they’re going to incorporate a guy who doesn’t space the floor in some kind of way um but they can they need also to do something there I think well not need um necessarily but the numbers were Stark in the playoffs the non chat home gun minutes were terrible just flat out terrible and I was under the impression and I said I think out loud that hartenstein or a guy like that is not the the difference between the Thunder going to the finals I may have been wrong um I don’t know if that is the difference between them winning the title or not I I don’t know about that uh there are a lot of things that um still have had to happen in order for for that to be a thing but when you see the drop off between hom gun in and home gun out it’s easy to point and say okay that thing that thing really did not work mhm uh and and we need to address that somehow um I had a tweet from from James Anderson that is in the chat about uh those numbers and it was by far the center who had the the best onoff splits I think that Derek Lively is right there uh for what is worth yeah but but the point is I don’t know what kind of player you can slide in and make it work I am not totally against the idea of having a r running Center there I’m not totally against that now there are some cautions to be had like I would not spend a lot um because I don’t think that having um like a pricey like Jared Allen kind of player there does make any sense fory mainly because you don’t you cannot play him as much time as that contract would command yeah and create other issues but if you can find a guy that is a rim running bag and you you think somehow that can play five to six minutes with that guy then it it it may be different um I don’t think that having a vertical spacer necessarily kills your Rhythm I mean I think that the L City Clippers had a lot of Rhythm even with the dunks um but you have to you have to be mindful about how you incorporate that into your way of playing yeah they’ve got to be I think you got to be like in in similar to Lively like be a really good short roll passer where you can play more rhythmically and like the guys that are going to make a lot of money like Nick Clon and Isaiah hartstein I just do not see them using you know paying a guy 20 million you know that’s going to be the backup like I just don’t think you could do that and so then you have to you you almost have to find like the next hartenstein because he was not a guy that made a ton of money yeah know it’s like you have to find who like who’s the next guy that’s going to be more of like a bargain that you could bring in and use in that way like I don’t know like how much does precious auua make you know like how much does come on I mean I think people would have said oh come on to hartenstein you know I’m I mean like yeah probably in years past where he wasn’t a guy that was making a lot of money I think that you just but it’s really it’s just really tough oh my gosh like B bismack bibo is the is on this list oh my gosh yeah it’s just not there’s just not a lot of guys in free agency and so then it comes down to like do you want to just draft a guy like flip to come in to be that guy do you want to make a trade for somebody you know I mean that that’s man that’s that’s where you have to go with Jericho Sims is he expiring I have no idea but I’m sure that that will do for the Dream Team show uh a full podcast and Zak said James Anderson is Happy finally happy that we are talking about zakti yeah I’ll let you do that I know I know that you let me do that I’ll I’ll do it by myself no no worries I mean it’s I understand why after you watch this series you can say okay what happens if I have a guy like that in the middle and I the the the first answer is I get cooked every single time in play in pick and roll coverage and that is probably the truth if I can find someone who who I can drop and that can space the floor from three I’m good but then I and then then you see okay when Brook Lopez came into the league it was not that different it was a strictly back to the basket good Freo shooting big man with with the ability to to swat shots now the curve it took him to get to that level to the shooting three ball kind of big man was kind of steep and hard but if you believe that in two three years that can be the the Avenue for a guy like like Ki and you are paying basically nothing to get him why not trying I’m not saying saying that he will solve the issue tomorrow where are you picking him though I would trade back yeah 22 23 yeah I know that it disgusts you I I really know that we we spoke at length about this but it’s also a good way to say Okay I I I really do have an excessive pick if um if I have my guy at 12 then okay I don’t know who that guy is if it’s Scotty Williams great I would not probably pick that uh before I will probably pick that before Ed but if he if somehow you can’t get the your hands then like why not why not trying this out maybe you can collect like two picks in the 20s and you can get two guys it’s um it’s a way of not allocating a lot of money into this trial that you’re making um and see how it goes yeah I don’t I know that you hate it I I know I just I just don’t want to to draft another 63 point guard or guard or in general if it’s a reed sheer is a completely different concept and I’m not against it but if it’s another kasl Dort I mean I I think that you in this playoffs you already had a hard time maximizing the time of KAS Wallace like there were moments where yeah but he’s a rookie I know I know but like we have four guard wings and I think that we have already issues in finding the minutes yeah whereas you are struggling in the minutes that you can give to 68 69 61 7 five kind of guys oh yeah well I mean I I just don’t I just cannot foresee a world where Zack G was playing in the playoffs against the Mavericks I think he no not this year probably not would gotten eaten alive they wouldn’t have played him I I don’t know I probably agree with you but it also depends on what kind of Defense are you trying to to play like if it’s a I mean if you think that Brook Lopez can really play like the prototyp of player is not different Brook Lopez is such a good player though he’s such a good player I know he was a I mean he was a no-brainer like top 10 pick in the draft I do think that that is a a question of times I don’t think that BR Lopez will be any different in today’s draft I think that those back to the basket kind of guys not going to be drafted in the top 15 which is creating I think which which is typically correct I think the NBA has evolved in a way where those they have realized that those guys are not valuable unless they are your go-to guy like yonas valunas is probably more of the a direct comp and if Zack Ed became yonas round Shas it would be like a top tier you know outcome for him like that’s more more of a imp protect than Yas though he’s gigantic ginormous I know he’s gigantic ginormous he’s I mean have you seen the block rate I mean why are we discounting the block rate I mean I I watched him play I I did it was to where where where am I missing he he is low yes Brook Lopez is not fast vience soon is not fast yeah we’re talking about investing three and a half Millions probably in a pick of course in finding out if he if he is terrible or not in a position where if you strike if you strike gold I just haven’t one I haven’t seen the Thunder draft a traditional Center so far and he is like not traditional huh he’s not traditional you don’t like the potential of the of the hands of the touch of the shooting you don’t think e is a traditional Center I do think that he has traits that are very interesting man I don’t even know what to say I do think that whenever you take a prototype of player and you erase it from he is kind of player that that the teams are wanting to get mhm you are creating um an inefficiency drafting wise you just you just take out I mean I I’m not drafting that prototype of player because I I don’t think that that that is valuable so what happens is you start um decreasing artificially the value of that player nobody drafts that player and so you have guys like hardenstein who 10 years ago they would not be able to play in the NBA because the level of the the level of traditional centers was so high that that guy yeah that guy doesn’t play now he can play and not only he can play he’s valuable Gafford Gafford is a player that in the Sha area that guy can’t really play basketball in the league because he too short not able to defend in the post but now where you have a second sing guy like um like Jaylen Williams you can play Gafford because he’s as tall more athletic and and he’s is jumping higher so say okay now I know I really know and I’m not I’m not I just I just said that I want to to watch him a little bit more because I saw one game one full game again uh I’m probably talking too much with James uh that is the issue of my uh draft draft coverage um but I watched a game and said huh I thought it was slower I had Vivid memories of him playing with Team Canada it was horrible I said oh no this is a way faster version of the guy that I had in my mind and it was unplayable in so if you increase the quickness you you see the touch and you see the shooting motion and say huh what if that guy takes threes like Rook Lopez does how many college threes did he take in four years same as Brook Lopez 138 138 games how many did he take uh four I think took two I know I know this is I mean this is the same I I spoke at length with a guy about domas yeah asking him why in the world domas took 27 threes and made he made probably 50% of those in college Brooke took 21 in two years by the way okay um and this guy tells me hey he’s shooting 72% at The Rim there is nobody who’s getting 1.4 points per possession on three-pointers MH so it would be maddening to see him out there Ed is even more so this is I mean I I don’t want that guy to to take trees but if you look at the motion and you look at the tree I mean he has a better shooting motion than like many many guys that we are discussing as first round picks he has a better motion than flip for example flip du more yes I think it’s by Design the the the theoretical shooting big I’m just I you see it too many times in the league where where reporters or people see these guys shooting Corner threes we we did I’m not talking about I’m not talking about r Express coverage I’m talking about me watching free throws after free 71% good enough for you 72% it’s good for a for a for a big man okay I think so uh now 71 I mean what 71 71 okay I I I look at it this morning don’t don’t I mean it it was several hours ago um but anyhow I’m not I’m not convinced that this is a bad allocation of resources to just see and try to do something different like the space out thing is something that is really dear to me I’m not saying that like leaving this for just why don’t they just sign moama to the minimum instead and just do that do do that experiment without having to give up a pick are you really posing that question yeah do I have to answer we’re doing exper if we’re just doing experiments like we might as well just just bring in moamba oh boy um no moamba it’s a proven non-nba rotation guy yeah I mean if you want to say hey like if Orlando Orlando calls you say hey we need to get rid of Wendel Carter Jr because we really don’t have is for him in the future yeah let’s try that it’s not the ideal player because he’s short than shorter than what I had have in mind but unless something that like that happens it the I mean you don’t have many Avenues to say okay I’m getting someone where there is potentially in what I’m doing yeah also also Carter just needs to he’s I mean he’s a he’s a guy that’s like a minutes eater too yeah the thing about is the thing about it is like this the Thunder Center is Chad and are we G are we gonna tell Wendell Carter or somebody like that hey great welcome to the Thunder you’re getting 12 minutes a night no no that’s why that’s why if but you can tell Wendell hey you have a team that really wants to push you out because you’re used to nothing so I mean but it’s not ideal whereas a guy like HEI I I don’t think that he has this timina to stay on the court for more than 15 minutes yeah I just don’t know I just don’t know that I would use a first round pick on somebody that’s not going to play that doesn’t have the potential to play more than like 10 minutes a night okay it was a nice discussion we can move on I just think that it’s tough and I just haven’t seen the Thunder draft a big like that yet I just want to state that he’s not luk Garza are you sure I think that he’s talked yes yes the production is quite different and he he almost wanton put you a title by playing this way luk Gara it’s not like that it’s very different like this guy Garza’s got some eyebrows though you’ll have to admit that but he’s not Canadian is he Canadian no he’s American no he’s American yeah no he’s from DC ah yeah uh I mean Garza 25 8-2 almost little over one and a half blocks per game at Iowa pretty good not the same I I I know that he’s perceived like lukaa and and and made 44 of 100 threes his senior year but he has like whole ready makes bricks on his foot instead of shoes it’s really not mobile come on you need to watch like five seconds of e you will see that he’s more I watched him I’ve watched him a lot okay I’m just not a fan not a fan for him on the Thunder or in general yeah I mean who go 19 to the Raptors and go play with all the other Canadians like it’s just just pretty pretty simple you know so you don’t want to under any circumstances finding like moving away from a five out second unit I I would rather not move I would rather stick to five out I would rather find somebody that’s I’d rather if we’re talking about experiments I’d rather draft a high upside 6 foot n player like Saloon I don’t know I don’t know I think that the um if you either you find very good players to play that that style or you find players that can add by changing the equation a little bit and I I’m convinced that the biggest change uh for next season will be how OKC will utilize chat on offense um I think that this is something that is um I know that I know that I am pushing this narrative a little bit but I do think that for for the most part we had just glimpses of what he can do offensively we saw this weird finishing at The Rim stuns great shots from three yes I do think the Chad will be allowed to cook way more um yeah he’s gonna be better he’s gonna be way better and I do think that it’s not impossible that playing him with another big man can unlock even him as a passer a little bit more allowing him to to do weird things with the basketball so I I really think that whatever we saw offensively from Chad was um was firsttime playoffs and also the theme not really constructing anything substantial substantial and and constant for him which will happen in the future yeah and the thing is like he in the future I believe that he’s going to be like a legitimate floor spacer and the Mavericks made him prove it like they were like okay great we know you can shoot threes you’re gonna be out there great prove that you can make them and he didn’t make enough yeah you know and in the future I think he’s just going to be better like I think he’s just going to be better I just I have a hard time believing with Ed that the Thunder are just going to stop their offense to throw Ed post-ups like um a how many of his shots were post-ups at Purdue and it oh the majority I think 70% and it made sense for them to do that because yeah he’s the seven foot five guy that you can just throw the ball to when you’re playing against Grambling State or whoever like the dude can just like eat even even against Yukon and War yeah no he he did great he did great kingan kind of warmed down a little bit as the game went on but like sure I just don’t I just don’t think and just think just look at the Pelicans like the Pelicans don’t hardly ever post up JV like it just doesn’t happen you know like maybe they give him two or three a game like I just don’t know how Zach EDI would function in the offense whenever like if when you do go watch him it’s just like post up after post up after post up he can set a good screen he is a good Rim Defender also when you’re in college you can just park yourself you can just park yourself there and the offenses are just way more predictable you know there’s just there’s just a lot of reasons why I just don’t think it would work especially offensively like he would have to completely you feel that in my brain this works as Ed post-ups I don’t know I’m I’m just I’m just making commentary on Zach Edy for some reason this has turned into the Zach Edy pod you don’t like it kind of like it post steps no Ed in general um he’s definitely I mean to me he’s just he’s like young boban or something I don’t know and like boban’s really oh no no I I do think that he is used as a postup like I mean domas was used 60% of the time in post-up situation it’s not like that he was not doing hand off hand off hand off hand off now he is doing that more because he he’s a very smart player the thing that you know the thing that I like the most about Ed is the fact that he really knows how to leverage his body and he really plays to his advantage in every single possession I mean he he post UPS um doesn’t have a good angle bumps the guy turns find the other angle move around it’s not like hey hey I’m here no it’s okay um am I get double boom open Corry it’s it’s it’s a good processor of the game the way the fact that he uses using post steps a lot it’s because he’s playing against minions a lot like guys that are really shorter than him I do think that he can quickly peot uh to a different role uh if he if he’s given the chance like he can be a guy who who goes into the pick and roll plays a little bit on more on the short rle and yes if you switch he will kill you he will just kill you um can he make the transition immediately to be also an outside guy I have no idea I have no idea probably not but I I think he can hold as hardenstein for 10 12 15 minutes playing a slightly different brand of basketball and I wonder if you play that guy with giddy what is the result if you play giddy that guy and three de ey Shooters where gidy can manipulate the defense and finding seams into the defense because he’s like boxing out making uh like the tough big man you just have to throw the ball to him he’s very tall he will get it I I wonder if that is a way to maximizing whatever you have because Hey whenever you don’t have Chad Shay and dub on the court you can play a different brand of basketball you need kind of instead of like trying to always play in the same brand of brand of basketball without the real engine what if you change what if you change a little bit which is sort of what Dallas did with Luca and Kyrie it’s it’s it’s similar but it’s not the same with Gafford and Lively yes it’s similar not exactly the same you can do different thing with those so I wonder I just wonder if and it doesn’t have to be Edy it can be clinging it can be like a trade for a guy who you think I mean what I want to say it’s he’s not zag it’s not um Luca Gara and it’s not Clint capella where you know that he will never pass the ball to a high level he is not really a quick processor of the game so this is what kind of the way in which he plays makes me think okay maybe it was really a little bit overweight and now that he like being a little bit more fit Maybe you can get a better version and a version that helps in the league because I again I don’t see anybody I mean we we can talk about like other guys later but I don’t I don’t know who can start for OKC in this draft well I don’t think they’re looking for a starter in the draft he there though a starter someone will say okay he will start at 4 4C tomorrow that’s in the draft m nobody nobody that’s the point nobody I mean if yeah I don’t know nobody I mean it would have to take a pretty big leap for Reay to be ready or from B like that I mean like it would be one of those guys probably um but I don’t know like the answer is just no I mean like the Thunder had the chance like they literally owned the pick that the Mavs used to draft d Lively like they owned it you know I and they decided to trade up to get a guy like Cas Wallace I think that makes sense they I mean they they picked at 11 the year before and chose Usman Jang over a guy like Jaylen dur or Mark Williams you know both not ideal game processing Minds offensively I mean Mark Mark Williams is is decent I mean I I know Jaylen Duran’s not like I get that and I still want to try a guy like durran by the way just for fun just to see how athletic and and disrupting that guy can be they also literally own the pick that became alurn shenen who is a good processor of the game and is like a postup type of player yeah but Alie Alie is a guy alpie is a guy that plays a brand of basketball that is hey I don’t play defense mhm I’m not tall enough I’m not strong enough to be a real Center in the NBA and it’s all about me now I don’t know about the latter for for Ed but I do think that the first three things are very different I I don’t think that Ed feels that like like you draft Ed and you have to make him the star of your team with Alp I mean you removed him the team just started to play a different way I don’t think that Ed will ever come to a say oh oh no it’s it’s my post up yeah I I understand I’m I’m not saying that like he gets in the league and like whoever picks him is just going to post him up over and over again they’re not that’s but that’s like kind of my point is like okay well then what then you will screen art he will protect the rim and if you dare not to guard him down low with one big man that is worth that name you will die because this is something that it’s really interesting to me like Dallas was okay putting someone else on our Center and let the guy roam free to swat shots if you have to put your body onto this beefy ginormous guy it’s not that you can really do whatever you want you cannot go out and and and and just try to swat the floter because if you do that’s a dunk and it’s the same concept that Dallas used yeah I just think like if if that’s the the play Dallas is G be like please post him up please please please please please it’s not posting him up it’s dunker spot it’s ceiling down low it’s it’s it’s not just posted up yeah I’m I I I I’m we are talking too much about Zak but I I think that I was looking into I I rewatched part of the game and say oh look at how they are using um um Lively they’re trying to make him they they fake a seal then then Chad comes out to to to block Luca and immediately when he makes a step towards him it’s a law do that with chat you can if you try that with Jay will you can’t yeah I know I’m not and I just think that I would just be surprised if there was a departure from the way that they want to play that’s all like I I would just be surprised and if there was a departure and I and I don’t know everything I’m just telling you that like my sense of the situation yeah like and that and that could be wrong you know I’ve been wrong so many times about a lot of different things and I just I would just be really surprised if like that’s the direction they went if they did I’d be be very intrigued to see what they were going to do you know I’m not I I just would be very very very surprised if that’s the way that they went just like like they could have acquired Gafford at the trade deadline you know like if that’s what they wanted to do you know it’s not the same doesn’t doesn’t move me like it’s different I I don’t know how I I can’t get my I mean for uh Ono kongu not the guy yeah I like kongu me too but it’s not the guy doesn’t allow you to really change the way in which defenses are guarding you yeah you know I I no I I hear you I also just wonder if you’re the Thunder if just like yeah that what we did worked really really well in the regular season yeah um and I think that we can just we can be better at what we did like we can be a lot better and a part of that is like getting experience and like just being I mean the starting lineup That Thunder had this past year in the regular season a plus 10 and almost I think you need to play that more in almost 800 800 minutes yeah I mean it’s they they were really good and then you you go smaller and you slide Isaiah Joe in there for Josh giddy which was their second most played lineup they slide up to a plus 16 the the defense gets better and the offense gets better yeah I do think that whatever has chat in it it’s fine yeah it’s not likely that you can get out of chat I would much rather have let’s just put this uh on on like in writing I think that having a guy like Jabar Smith Jr as your Center is much much better okay this I believe uh not necessarily him but a guy who is 610 just the shooter is much much better than having like a lanky 75 I don’t think that that type of guy is there if you can find that guy ready to play with controllable contract all in like if you can if you can find a guy like that who is like a slightly better version of Maxi GBA like a guy like that yeah those guys are hard to find I are extremely hard to find and you have the best one well one of the best ones um yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah so if you don’t have that what is the other thing that you can do you can try to go having a 68 bulky guy Wing they try that we can Rich you need something better also that version of a player is extremely hard to find so the next question is what do you do and and it’s not clear to me yeah what is down yeah and this isn’t me just saying like I don’t think they should get another big or need another big like yeah yeah I think that they do I think that they need I mean it came down to it like they just played two bigs in the playoffs you know they really didn’t never really play kenri at that spot which tell like is a tell yeah you know that they didn’t try to at least go to that you know multiple times during the playoffs that’s a tell on what they think about that soas at least yeah and that’s what I mean I do think that they need another big man and I think Jay will I like Jay will a lot I do think that he is a player that can get better but I think you need another option yeah and if it’s Zack Edy I I will be shocked but I think it would be really fun I think it’d be very fun you know fun to see I would be really surprised by it um but I do I do think they need to find some way whether that’s via trade free agency the draft to try to find somebody that can play and I ideally you play you find somebody that can play with chat too that’s at least like mobile enough to play with chat as well so you can have these like two big lineups that are maybe a little bit more devastating than the one with he and Jay will like I do think like there there is a world where they will need to go to that as like like here’s like option A is obviously chat five you know five out basically is the number one option and you find I still think they need to find a 68 is Wing that can shoot it you know out there I still think that that to me is like way more of a need than the backup center but I do think like finding a big that can play next to Chad that makes sense within the Thunder offense makes makes a lot of sense you know Joseph me in the chat says what about Maxi CBA you know yeah like that kind of player would be nice but like that’s that’s the kind of I think like you that you would want and I don’t think Dallas is going to just give him up but I do think I do think like having a a different look at the big position does make sense I would just be surprised if it was like more of a traditional guy like that’s that’s that’s all and I’m not against adding a big I know the Thunder need to add more size like everybody knows that you know but I do think that you have to it needs to be a particular kind of player that you add with size and they’re not exactly easy to find like Kelly o Len we talked about him at nauseum at the trade deadline like he would have been great for OKC and perhaps he could be available via trade over the summer like how attached are the are the Raptors to him you know they gave him an extension but like if you’re the Raptors like I’m not really attached to much on that roster outside of the young guys and so so like he would still be a great option for them like that’s a guy you could play next to Chad that’s a guy that can shoot it that’s a guy that can pass that’s a guy that plays very rhythmically and he’s Canadian just add add to the can I’m worried a little bit about the defense yeah I mean sure yeah I mean if if he was like some great defender he’d be a starting level Center and would be amazing you know what I mean yeah um like the guys and this is the thing with everybody that we’re talking about the thunder acquiring it’s like everybody that they could acquire that’s going to not is is one is not going to be one of their top three guys and two they’re GNA be imperfect and they’re gonna have like major flaws like Aaron Gordon everybody talks about the Aaron Gordon how do we find the Aaron Gordon where do we get Aaron Gordon how do we get an Aaron Gordon kind of player he has trem he has a lot of flaws Aaron Gordon like he’s not some perfect player he’s he was a very good player that really helped fill that role for them very well but he’s not a good shooter no he’s a terrible shooter and has really hurt and has hurt them in spots because of his lack of shooting and so there’s those guys even like the Aaron Gordon that everybody talks about like the like he’s like some treasure like he has flaws that have hurt the nuggets and like the guy whoever the Thunder acquire is g to be flawed they’re not going to be exactly they they may not be exactly a thunder player um I just think in the draft you have the benefit of being able to choose from lots of different guys and being able to really pinpoint like qualities that you really really want yeah and with that you you will lose out on some Talent like on some serious talent because you want those guys to fit a particular way and a particular style like you it and it’s not just stylander it’s it’s about and the more the more I do um in a in my company the more it’s clear to me that yeah Talent enough Talent is important you don’t go anywhere without Talent um in every role that you have in a company in a group in a an environment but um the rest of it the establishing a certain culture having leaders that can really move with their example with their words uh with the way in which they go at their job it’s it’s almost as important if not as important because you I mean it’s so easy to disrupt whatever you’re trying to do uh I mean you can be rattled by losses you can be rattled by the fact that you’re hitting a rough patch the path that maybe lasts for 15 games and if you don’t have the the culture around you if you don’t have the right leaders around you it’s it’s very hard that you that you arrive at your goal did you see why you’re doing certain things like there are great managers that can tell you how to do a pick and roll like you you need to set the screen take two dbes to the left then take a really uh like energetic dribble and then you can either raise up or pass the ball I mean great then you need to you need to see how using that and not just doing ISO every single time allows you to really move towards the goal as a team that unlocking the potential of your teammates is as important as unlock yours so all these Concepts that are I mean uh known you have to put it them in place and you have to pick the right person you have to pick the right guys and I I do think that in the choices that we see pressy make we we we cannot judge that part but I feel like it’s there and I feel that in prey’s words it’s it’s there um the they really want to to pick persons um he said that in that Gideon man draft yeah um and it’s and it’s almost like yeah he’s drafting people yes he is drafting people and and we can see the fruit now you can see the way in which this team talk you see a player that had a horrible SE saying I should I would have benched myself MH like in the in the summer before your main contract extension the the contract extension that will probably decide your earnings for the rest of your career you what you say is hey I should have benched myself instead of saying hey I need to get out because they are not playing the way in which I should play and not only like was I not great I also was happy for Isaiah Joe yeah you know like to to say like it took maturity and I do think that like you said the culture that was set before him that’s been modeled by so many PE I mean it’s not just like the coaching staff and like Shay and those guys who model that like I I’ve seen it in the the equipment manager I’ve seen it in the team doc I’ve seen it in a lot of people throughout the organization it’s like an organizational mindset yeah that exists like the positivity down to I mean Nick Gallow is somebody who possesses like that same kind of positivity you know Paris law and Roy like all those people have like very similar qualities and it really does kind of permeate throughout the organization and it it really is um it’s really cool to see and I do think like you have to you have to be careful that’s why like go going back to the beginning the show like a Kyle adding a Kyle kozma to this list it’s like boy are we sure that we want to introduce that kind of player to our culture it would really test the culture yeah of the Thunder you know and at some point you’re going to have to do something to test your culture I just think like now is not the time to do that especially not for C if you want to test your culture just do it I do it it’s huge test but it’s also High reward it’s almost like drafting Ed High reward so if you want to test something out do that but uh make it worth oh man yeah I mean the th the Thunder have things that they need to fix they absolutely have things they need to fix they also have to keep in mind that we want Shay jdub and Chad to be here for for as long as possible and the happiness of those three players is extremely extremely important and bringing in somebody that’s going to take away touches from those guys I’m not like like Zack Edy I’m just kidding um it it you better be sure you better be sure it’s not g to rock the boat with those guys because the the long-term happiness of those guys is by far the most important thing yeah and and we saw it fall apart in Era one with James Harden and like there are so many layers and Tentacles from the the James Harden story of him leaving Oklahoma City but a lot of it was like he wanted more he wanted more than what Oklahoma City could offer as far as basketball goes and he was right he ended up being right only basketball yeah but yeah but you also you want to make sure that Shay jdub and Chad feel like they have the opportunity not only to grow as basketball players here but to have like some like true ownership in what they’re doing here and if you bring in big-time Talent that’s going to demand touches and shots and all of that you better be sure that it’s not going to rock the boat for the future of those guys because this is not just 2K this is not just like forming whatever team I want let’s just make this great I mean even look at Dallas like Dallas is like the team that every’s look how did they build their team how did this go there are as many touches as you know as you know Luca and Kyrie could ever want there and they just put around tons of complimentary guys you know like that’s what the rest of the roster is just tons of complimentary guys and I think the Thunder what they need to be doing is looking for the complimentary guys yeah that’s what they need is like how do we surround those guys with as many good complimentary low usage players as possible that one defend two can like pass and be in a part of this Rhythm yeah that’s what you need like that’s what this team needs moving forward because the and in what pressy was saying about like Josh you know with like he’s not going to have to play with that team anymore it’s because the team is going to evolve and change so much between now the next year this is when players change the most a lot of times it’s between year two and three which I know chat was only a rookie but he’s been in the Le he’s been like around the NBA for two seasons yeah and is gonna jump into year three of being around the NBA you see Jay dub who already made a big leap but boy he could make another giant leap he could make a giant leap between year two and three and if you made all these moves and you get to the fall and you’re like holy smokes have you guys seen jdub have you seen like what he’s added have you seen how much better he is and seven creas per game yeah and then it’s like well then why are we wait we just added like this is why you have to be really really careful yeah and you have to like let this you have to let this work itself out a little bit and I know that fans don’t want to hear that I know people don’t want to hear that I know people roll their eyes a lot at me right now because I’m I’m still Mr patience in a lot of ways and I know that a lot of people don’t like that people want change they want it now they want it they wanted it yesterday they want whatever they want they see know potential movement they hear rumors about this team they hear rumors about that team I want my team to be in the rumors I want to be this I want this you know I get it but I still think like the biggest changes that are going to happen between the postseason and the start of the next season is going to be the progress of jayd duub and Chad and Shay yeah like that is going to be the biggest change that happens and it’s going to be extremely helpful to the Thunder because like the the way that those guys operate and the way that those guys you know tick it’s like there could be giant giant changes coming for those guys where it’s like if Chad and JB come back and they are near All-Star level players or if like I I I think I mean next at the beginning of next season I’m going to predict that one of them is going to make the allstar team yeah one being sh gun but yeah and you know I don’t I don’t know who it is yet I don’t know who I’m going to choose yet um but like some one of their Thunder are gonna have more than one Allstar yeah you know like that’s a huge change like you know Chad and JB really weren’t on snub list honestly this past year things are going to change for the Thunder they are um okay well thank you so much for listening to the Zack Ed pod hope you guys enjoyed it um of course they did it was delightful listen I I don’t hate Zack Ed as a player I I would just be really surprised if the Thunder chose him that’s my official statement on Zach e all right thanks so much for listening we’ll be back Wednesday with another show we should be back on our normal schedule this week so Wednesday with Alex and then back on the fry pod um so yeah uh thanks again to Ryland styles for joining the show on Friday I thought that was on Thursday excuse me uh that was really fun having Ryland on and if you if you enjoyed Ryland uh and me on a show you should go uh subscribe to the OKC Dream Team um which Ryland is a part of now and is contributing on a regular basis and he um and mckel and I are going going to be doing some draft shows together which will be really fun and we will do I mean if you love The Zack Ed pod man we’re gonna have so much Zach talk over there on the patreon page so patreon.com Dream Team you can hear us talk more draft over there um but for real yeah it’s great uh okay thanks so much for listening and we will talk to you guys again on Wednesday

Andrew Schlecht and Michele Berra dig through the numbers to discuss the Thunder’s season