Zach LaVine to the Utah Jazz for Jordan Clarkson and John Collins? | CHGO Bulls Podcast

Zach LaVine to the Utah Jazz for Jordan Clarkson and John Collins? | CHGO Bulls Podcast

[Music] what’s going on Bulls Nation welcome in the CH Bulls podcast coming to you live on Friday afternoon I am peek Bulls corek joined by big day bow bawl Sports our guy behind the controls is the one and only Joyce BS at Joyce baos goats off today jeda down to Cabo for a wedding Big Dave where’s the coolest place you’ve ever gone for a wedding oh that’s a great question uh coolest place I’ve ever gone for a wedding uh I don’t know probably the one I was in but it was in St Charles though St Charles like the suburb Illinois yeah yeah yeah like the suburb yeah it was cool out there it was cool as hell I had a great weekend uh some stuff I won’t elaborate on but it was it was a great it was a great weekend though uh shout out to my guy Ivan U shout out to Nicole um I was in the wedding it was it was great it was a beautiful hotel that they they got married in uh they got married outside the weather was perfect uh just had a blast it was it was probably most fun time I’ve had at a wedding I’ve been to weddings in no no I went to one in Minnesota and I kind of crashed it but nobody said anything and it was all love and I went to one in Texas I wasn’t invited but I was dating a girl who was friends with the actual bride so I I went with them and had a blast there I I told you though I love weddings like I’ll go anywhere for a wedding and just have a great time so how about you uh did a Cancun wedding once that was fun oh um uh Upstate New York up in the cat skills that was a gorgeous one that was my cousin’s wedding uh shout out Josh and Jillian um but yeah wait so so when you say you were in this wedding were you in the bridal party or were you the officient because I feel like you would make a great wedding officient no I was I was in the party my friend uh my friend Ivan shout out to him man uh he and I that’s that’s one of my uh good friends he came to to you met him he came to uh watch a game with us oh okay yeah yeah um so that’s one that’s one of my good friends and when he asked me to be in it it was absolutely I was in it and yeah I looked amazing because I saw my suit and now in that tux I had on it was stupid how good I looked it really was when when you’re walking down an hour and people are like damn all right you’re like yeah that’s right you know right like uh as opposed to the rest of the time when you also look amazing no it’s true well I’m I’m not gonna take away from that but you know you do have those moments where you just like damn you know what this is this is really working right here I’m feeling this right now you know like your whole setup like you got right now you know with the summer pack you because you you can wear something and look cool Matt but you what you have on you believe right now because this is summer pet right here all day long with the beverage included this is summer PC sir look at him Clear Eyes Full Hearts full chgo Bulls beer Pine class can’t lose wait when’s the last time you bought another tank top has it been away uh I think this is actually one of the more recent ones I bought um I didn’t I didn’t buy a new uh shorts tank top when I was up in Michigan last weekend uh because they didn’t make a new one yet this season I’m hoping that that will change when I go back up there later this summer because you can never have too many tank tops Dave that’s what you have taught me Matt I and I missed the uh the Cubs tank top giveaway at Rigley earlier they already did it earlier this uh this season and I was I was out of town for that one so I’m very jealous of some of my friends who went and got themselves a fresh Cubs tank it’d be back around it’ be back you know who else loves a good tank is our friend Cody from csgo Cubs oh yes he does you you tell no lies about that Cody loves a good tank top right there sir absolutely shout out to the 120 club uh so uh as I see people in the comments already talking about it we are going to talk about this trade proposal that we got from ESPN’s uh NBA front office Insider Bobby marks on a column he dropped for ESPN plus earlier today sending Zack LaVine to the Utah Jazz for for a couple of players that we’ll talk about but before that I wanted to get your reaction on game one of the NBA finals last night Big Dave the Celtics protect home court out of the gate they beat the Mavs 10789 Mavs made themselves a little bit of a comeback in the third quarter got it to I think as little as eight points before the Celtics just ran away with it big uh big storyline of course was Kristof porzingis coming back from his injury coming off the bench but he dropped a solid game Off the Bench 20 points six boards had three blocks what did you make of that game one Celtics Triumph uh it was kind of how I expected it to go um I didn’t expect a close game I thought it was going to be a beat down by Boston U they’re the better they’re the better team they’ve been the best team in the NBA like you if you’re removing remove conferences like they’re the best team like it’s the bottom line of it they are the best team so I’m not really surprised about it Matt the surprising thing was probably porzingis coming back and just being you know that dominant because I’m not used to watching him be that dominant um on both sides of the floor like he really controlled it in that second quarter that was his game uh in that second quarter man so I had never really seen him like that so that was really cool to see to be honest to you know be off that long come back in the finals and that’s what you do that’s not a norm uh also it’s not a norm that Luca uh played the way he did I thought he played horrible especially in that first half but he got it together in that second in that second half but he only had like one assist because they couldn’t score one assist yeah oneing everything you know one M shot 41 and a half% from the field and 26% on threes yeah that’s that’s not the norm for them you know what I mean so I’m not I’m not surprised Kyrie Irving you can tell he’s still exercising some demons uh down there in Boston man six for 19 from the field for Kyrie 0 of five from downtown yeah man he was missing he was missing some wide open threes that I we just know that he can hit so I’m not really surprised I I expect the adjustment to come uh in game two or even game three because I wouldn’t be surprised if Boston went up two either um so I I would expect the adjustment to come either this next game or or the game after but Kudos and tipia cap though to Boston man they came out uh definitely more ferocious and more physical and it’s easy to do that when you’re shooting like they do from the three-point line yeah Boston I mean they they followed their script to a te they shot 38 a half% on a huge volume I think they took 42 threes last night hit 16 of them uh shout out and condolences Devon in the comments you said LCA only got one assist because I bet that he’ get seven I mean you know it happens you don’t uh really expect to see a one in the assist column ever for Luca but yeah people weren’t hitting their shots and the other thing you know it’s one game I think they could still get it together but it’s crazy to watch Luca and Kyrie combin for seven turnovers in this game one last night when they picked apart the elite Minnesota defense in that series prior like yeah picked apart and I’m not saying the Celtics defense is scrubs the Celtics also have an elite defense but Minnesota’s Minnesota and Luca and Kyrie just took turns eviscerating that once vaunted defense they were SL they were both careless with the ball last night it cost them no you’re absolutely right man you hit it right on the head they both were uh careless and sloppy and not making shots that we used to seeing them hit even when Luka was getting to the free throw line you know he wasn’t great there like everything just kind of went wrong and and I I just like how Boston came out they were very prepared they were ready for the moment um on on both sides of the ball they just dominated them on their guards you know what I mean the big men uh they gave uh Daniel Gafford and Lively all kinds of fits Lively had five fouls in the third quarter like they gave them all kinds of fits and that’s what you expect from a team that’s a championship pedigree type team they’ve been there so many times and been his position this is all kind of new for for Dallas like so they just kind of Dallas I just think will calm down we’ll get it together uh I think kid will come up with a good game plan to uh reverse some of those things but at the very most they will hit those shots that we kind of saw them missing and I think it might be a closer game again I won’t be surprised at Boston wins game two I won’t I won’t be shocked at all but I think you’ll see a better performance up from Dallas uh MCM in the comments saying Kyrie will be the Carl Anthony towns of the finals uh fish saying even at the beginning of the Season Luca would have gotten 50% of those calls but I love the refs allowing some physical defense um you know and we we’ll see if the physicality escalates uh as we move forward through this series the other thing that I think will be you know a bit scary from from the Mavericks perspective is you got blown out last night and Tatum scored 16 on six of 16 from the field yeah like they didn’t even like yeah Tatum was doing his thing where he’ll drive and dish to one of the 18,000 three-point shooters that the Celtics have available to them but like there’s also the version of Jason Tatum and I know some NBA fans debate vigorously on whether or not he is in that upper estron of like super super duper Star top five player in the NBA kind of tag on Tatum not everybody buys that we have seen playoff performances from where he just goes off and says I’m taking over this game I’m dropping 40 yeah without a doubt you’ve seen it and it’s weird because I saw his stat I don’t remember the record of how many games but when he shoots under 40% they’re undefeated in these playoffs like like it’s it’s like they’re five and0 or six and0 or something like that like it’s so strange and weird but you’re right to play like that and your best player not have that kind of a performance and to be honest with you he has a really been consistently having that performance here in the playoffs it’s been Jaylen Brown which is why he was the finals MVP not to say uh Tatum ain’t been balling and doing his thing it’s just that brown has really kind of stood out a little bit more but you’re right Tatum’s Gonna Get It Together Matt one of these games and Dallas is gonna have to figure that out and adjust for that because the one thing you mentioned Minnesota’s defense the one thing that um helps Boston MO is they have the better backcourt Defenders I think Drew holiday is a better Defender than Edwards is you know what I mean they match up sizewise with those guys too so they literally have one two three four guys they can put you know what I’m saying at any time on on those guards you know so that’s a problem you know what I’m saying that is a true issue and on the other end of the floor they’re just gonna switch out Luca and get him on uh porzingis or switch out kyi and get him on porzingis and run that play uh kind of all day long so yeah they got to change their game planing up and they’re going to need some more help it’s kind of why you saw Tim Hardway Junior actually get some tick when I think he should never play again but I understand it’s the finals um I’m wonder if Marie morrris gets some playing time in the series uh maybe they need a little toughness I don’t know that’s what that’s why they get paid to figure that stuff out but I just get paid to talk about it and say y’all guys gotta be better yeah yeah I people kept saying in the Dallas Minnesota series whichever team’s two Stars play better is gonna win that series and turned out to be true Luca and Kyrie outplayed and and towns in that series and I feel like you could say the same thing uh about the Celtics and in game one none of those four stars between Tatum Jaylen Brown Luca and Kyrie had a particularly good game none of them were particularly efficient Luca I think was the closest you could say to having a good game despite the only one assist he still managed after you mentioned the slow start dropped 30 points on nearly 50% shooting four of 12 from downtown okay not great but the one star who had kind of a star stat line was on the team that lost by 20 right oh that’s a great Point that’s a great point and and the one thing that he does well didn’t show up which was the assist in there bro they scored 89 points that is wild for Dallas to score 189 points look at him that better or worse than the Bulls final score against the Heat in the second playing game I can’t remember listen you you can’t poo poo on the 42 and then bring that up at the end can’t have both sides come on man but I I would Luca we watch Luca score like 73 you know what I’m like by himself and for them to have just 89 it was just tough but I do like the I I agree with h fish about the refs because Luka was doing a lot of complaining as he usually does uh I think that’ll catch up you know what I mean because again they’re at home they’re in Boston it’s going to be a little bit different with those calls and they’re going to have to figure that out Boston is an institution and them getting calls has been going on since the 70s so like this isn’t going to change you know what I’m saying so they’ have to give shots they honestly like you pointed out Matt they had an opportunity when they cut that lead to eight like they had an opportunity to cut it even cut into it even further but they could not make a bucket after that kind of run that Luca went on and they were hitting some shots and things so they had a chance they couldn’t do it they I remember the steal Kyrie got where he was wide open for three and he just bricked it um the ball just swung around Derek Jones Jr was bricking everything like they just didn’t none of those guys kind of brought it you know for them and they’re gonna have to do that in in game two man to keep this close because Boston is no joke seriously Boston’s no joke you know red Arbok still pulling those strings the ghost of red rbox still pulling those strings oh let’s uh let’s knock out our first ad break then we’ll come back and dive into the uh juicy column that Bobby marks dropped on ESPN plus earlier today talking about teams that could make big offseason moves spoiler alert the Bulls were the first team on the list we will get to that on the other side hit that like button while we’re sharing these words from our sponsors make sure you also subscribe to the csj sports YouTube channel if you aren’t already first sponsor on Deck today is our friends at Circa check out that Circa Sportsbook app offering the tight money line splits and low hold model games always 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to Demar D rozan it is first team on Bobby Mark’s list in case you missed it is our beloved Bulls he starts by quoting something AK said at his season ending press conference about how this group doesn’t work we’ve done it for a couple years and it hasn’t worked everything is on the table and then Marx chimes in saying uh car chz is thinking is correct but how does Chicago go about changing its roster without taking two steps back as a bull’s most productive player DeMar rosen is a free agent and their highest paid player Zack LaVine had season ending foot surgery in February he then goes on to say Joey if you will talking about some Bulls opportunities and possible Avenues to explore that uh they could benefit if teams with salary cap space such as the Detroit Pistons miss out in free agency referring to finding a taker for Zack LaVine a salary dump to the Pistons gives Chicago Financial flexibility by avoiding the luxury tax to resign to Rosen and restrictive free AG of Patrick Williams while also having that 122.9 million non-t taxpaying midlevel exception and then he says but do these Chang es represent the status quo AK said he was vowing to change well rhetorical question I think there for Bobby marks um uh we can get to the trade proposal but before that anything that you know pequs your curiosity from from how Marx is evaluating the Bulls offseason Outlook from from an Outsiders perspective Dave well one he feels like he’s taking AK kind of at his word which us on the inside we like I don’t know you sure about that yeah like yeah like I know he said that you know like I heard no you’re right he did he said it and but I we’ll see you know so it’s funny when you hear these things that you can tell the ones who haven’t been scorned or you know I’m saying have dealt with certain pain and that it comes with being a fan of the Beloved but it is what it is um so that kind of stood out to me and him approaching it from a logical standpoint uh stands out to me as well but as you know Matt there is emotion involved and some of these themes because it feels like this front office is kind of tied to a couple of these players uh specifically a guy like dear de Rosen yeah uh real quick shout out to our friend druish who’s wishing everybody in Bulls Nation a happy Friday and a happy weekend also shout out to CJ artiste hope your day improves buddy thank you for joining us you are here with your Phil Bulls fans so hey misery loves company right um but so the the other thing that Mark’s talked about is how lavine’s Market is still at least from his perspective unpredictable that’s the word he used finding a team to take on that $43 million salary for the 2425 season could present a challenge Mark said that’s putting it lightly he also reminded Us in this column about the new CBA rules about teams making trades who are above the first or second apron of the luxury tax the new apron rule restricts teams from taking back more money in a trade if the incoming salary would put them over either the first or second apron also teams in the second apron aren’t allowed to aggregate contract salaries sent out in trades so that basically just condenses the number of teams that the Bulls can make a deal for when it comes to Zack LaVine and his very significantly sized contract um which is why you’re basically looking at teams who are not in that first second apron area and have cap space available to take in a contract of Zack size well man let me talk right there Joey said he’s got everything straight he wants to throw the graphic up for you a there we go right there sir just so people could see it you know I know Matt in the dosent tones you know what I’m saying it’s always good to hear him break it on down but just so everybody kind of has a visualization of uh what he was saying right there I just wanted you to get a good look at that like you said avoiding that that luxury tax to rec the rosan restricted free agent patri Williams hey Pistons you want you want Zack LaVine do you do you need it man oh man and Matt I think what always makes this interesting for me is when teams you want to trade to of course there are teams I want to trade with but sometimes you have to go with the teams that are that are in your face you know what I’m saying the ones that you can actually deal with and it’s it feels like the Pistons are always there like and I’m talking about like since the 2000s I’m thinking like Ben Gordon you know what I’m saying like the Pistons are always there and readily available to make this trade and they made no secret that they’ve wanted certain guys from the Bulls before uh Patrick Williams definitely a guy that they uh kind of covered it and kind of want it and it feels like Zack LaVine could end up being a team with Detroit I don’t want him to uh I’d rather send him somewhere else and let him you work that out somewhere else where I got to see him twice a year I could deal with that but keeping him in the same division and I know that doesn’t mean much to uh you or a lot of other people about keeping him in the same division and things like that but I don’t I just don’t like doing it but I it just trips me out when I see the the teams that you have to trade with are always the lottery pick teams you know like that’s it that’s how you’re always uh having and we’re not on that level where we can make those trades with these other bigger Market teams or teams that are actually making these true moves out here it just sucks that we’re kind of in this position uh right here with Zack LaVine and that extra 43 mil I mean that’s there’s nothing to sneeze at you know what I’m saying right there man and I think also Matt my question and and you can answer this if Zack LaVine is I and I shouldn’t say a better player I’ll say a healthier player if Zack LaVine is a healthier player how much does that 43 million come into consideration you know what I’m saying when we’re talking about teams like how many teams do you think would just be willing to bite the bullet and just take Zack LaVine because of the pure talent that this dude who can put up a 50 40 80 season for you can have and yeah and look I mean I I know Bulls fans are now more than ever I think uh saying look Zack LaVine is not worth this contract the Bulls signed him to and they’re trying to get off of it and even someone who said two summers ago the Bulls should sign Zach to that max deal like it’s it’s the best of a bunch of shitty options to just Zack to that deal and then if he wants to move or they want to move him we’ll figure it out later and now we’re here but a healthy version of Zack LaVine who like you said could be a 50490 guy it could be a 255 and five guy two-time All-Star 43 million is not that much money for a player like that in today’s NBA salary cap math you you take a look at some of these new caps that they’re projecting with the new TV rights deal that is almost nearly fully signed crossed eyes cross teas dotted eyes with with NBC Amazon and espn/abc you’re talking about the next wave of Max and supermax players getting salaries that are approaching a 100 million for one season 80 mil 85 mil so look yeah does it sound like a lot to say that Zach has three years and 138 million left on his contract right now it does it sounds gross but if there is a healthy 255 and5 version of or something close to it I think plenty of teams around the league would say that’s a player worth $43 million it’s like may maybe a bit of a stretch but that’s the salary cap math that exists now yeah I agree and and I think it would put to beds of course when you’re injured or those kind of things like that other things come up like your your personality you know how you act on the team like those things come up only when a player is showing that kind of injury it doesn’t come up when you’re putting up those kind of numbers like that you know like even if it does teams aren’t really tripping on it like they’re like okay great y oh yeah understand maybe it’s just a situation he hasn’t been whatever the problem with Zach is it’s been a perfect storm of bad you know what I’m saying to come his way you know Matt like the injuries happening your team playing better without you uh the dust up you had you know what I’m saying with Bulls PR on on the sideline like all of those things and then oh and then of course your team not winning and you’re not being considered a winning player and you finally winning four games in a row two years ago for the first time your care and then your team starting to play a little bit better when you get hurt and go to the sideline yeah yeah when you’re not there they look better Kobe white becomes second most improved player award uh nominee you know what I’m saying he becomes second in that voting how much of that is with you not being there with the team so all of that stuff comes into consider consideration and I thinking strictly because of injury because like you just said and that’s what I that’s why I was asking you the question because I wanted to know how you felt on that that money won’t matter if you’re balling they they like okay we pay money for Ballers it’s the NBA this is what we pay for is somebody who can get out there and do their thing and the problem man is you and I both know Zach can get out there and do his thing we’ve seen it we watched it that’s why we advocated so much when it was time for him to sign that contract because he can ball that dude can get in and play some basketball but man it was just a perfect storm of bad that hit him everywhere from every place making the wrong decision sitting at the game you know with clutch Sports rocking the hoodies nothing worked right you know what I’m saying doing this storm of bad for Zach man and it just feels like it’s might be that time to you know move on which sucks I think we found ourselves our next catchphrase for Bulls basketball Perfect Storm of bad hey at least at least it’s a bit more interesting and like mysterious than just continuity or competitive uh Kyle what’s up buddy in the comments also people in the comments wondering Anthony uh some Darkhorse teams uh with a Zack LaVine trade Anthony bringing up the kings of course we’ve always heard about the you know herder and Barnes deal maybe a pick involved Anthony also suggesting Philly Houston Orlando teams that uh have come up before I don’t think we’ve talked about Houston we’ve talked about the others but do you want to get to the Juicy Store from Bobby marks because he threw in a Darkhorse team a team that Bulls fans of a certain generation know quite well uh they just unveiled their new jerseys for next season and they look very very 90s it is the Utah Jazz uh in uh Mark’s column which he takes a look at these five different teams that could be making big offseason moves for each one he says here’s a trade we would like to see I don’t know who the wi is in that alongside marks other ESPN people other NBA people whatever but the trade he proposes in the Bulls offseason Outlook is trading Zack to Utah for two SE two two season veteran players who are pretty decent John Collins and Jordan Clarkson that is the proposed trade no picks uh even as an offseason trade uh it sounds like Utah would have the ability to bring in Zach’s contract and combined Collins and Clark are fairly close to Zachs uh next season let’s see they are under contract for um Clarkson at 14.1 Collins at 26.6 they each have two years remaining on their deal uh John Collins second year uh of his remaining contract being a player option whereas Clarkson just has two fully guaranteed years uh at just over 14 mil Dave this is the first time we have heard this specific trade proposal for Zack LaVine how do you feel about this compared to others that we have seen or or talked about ourselves okay listen I know we got I know we got to take a break so I’m Gonna Keep little I’m G keep this a little short and then expound on this when we come back yes I would do this trade to for for lack of a better term uh those are the two best names I’ve heard in any exactline trade that has come up it’s those two names what scares me is both of them I do not equate with winning at all I don’t equate John Collins with and I don’t equate Jordan Clarkson maybe Jordan Clarks a little bit more because I’ve seen him be that guy take over a game and things like that of course I start thinking fit and all that other stuff like that and I’ll get into that after the break but off the top of my head it just yes it’s those are the best names I’ve heard be offered for a one zackly bean they’re I they’re they’re players they are players uh and they are players that have strengths and weaknesses we could talk about how they might fit in to a tweaked or retooled Bulls roster uh after we take this break uh cuz I was looking at some of their numbers uh as far as Collins with his injuries and then Clarkson with his efficiency and yeah there’s some I like and some I don’t like so we will get to that on the other side of this break if you didn’t hit the like button the first time around now’s your chance do it for our friend troll Joe who is not gonna have a good weekend unless you give him that like button that he always always craves Dave who’s next Pizza also a part of the summer Peg diet is pizza he’s got have it gota have place you got to go to get it y’all and I mean the right Tavern style pizza because Matt is very specific about that Tavern style the right one you got to have is at SOS man just go on and stop by at SOS on tap located at 121 West Grand Avenue in Chicago’s West Town enjoy that Tavern style pizza and some of those Frosty ice cold beers whether you’re headed to the game you want to watch it live on the big screen TV that they got there or TVs plural that they have there or you just want to pick it up and watch it at home they got you covered any way you want to do it any way you want it that’s the way you need go to Salos pizza.com or call 312 666 3444 that’s Saros pizza.com and that number again is 312 666 3444 mention chgo and get half off of your pizza half Eddie don’t treat me like animal get half off of your pizza at AOS on tap in Grand Avenue speaking of cinos uh shout out to our friends uh on the chj Blackhawks crew because they are hosting speaking of going to SOS to eat delicious pizza and watch sports they’re hosting a watch party for Stanley Cup finals this weekend I believe so if you want to watch want to watch some dope hockey with some fellow hockey uh lunatics our our guys Greg and Jay from CSO Hawks are going to be at ceros watching the Stanley Cup finals go hang out with them e June 10th I which I mean like whether it’s Stanley Cup or NBA I am annoyed Dave we gotta wait until Sunday for game two yeah what could you do in that time Matt but eat pizza and have sunny side and drink beers and say I I’ll find a way to pass the time drink drinking beers on my roof I Believe In You mat I believe you you want to come over and drink beer on my roof until until Sunday night when game two happens da you’re welcome to you’re welcome to come hang out you too Joe let me think I might I might do that summer peek and full effect fact come on come hang out we can order pizza uh speaking of great life choices a reminder to sign up to become a c die hard if you aren’t already uh perks on perks on perks you get a free shirt of your choice from the merch Locker when you sign up uh along with all of the other goodie bag items that you get in the mail uh your dieh hard care package cool stickers and other uh stuff official card member and then of course 20% off every single time you shop at the chgo merch Locker you got some Chicago sports fans in your life friends family significant other and you want to get them some super soft super comfy and super stylish Chicago sports themed gear 20% off every time for you die hards out there it’s literally just pennies a day when you extrapolate our annual membership and you get the best of the best content wise you get of course the access to the die hards only Discord channel one uh uh Discord CS Joe die hards one for each team and some of the upper echelon high quality content from our wide array of talented and credential Sports writers and reporters at chgo including our own willig go galib his NBA 2024 draft class uh database is up on allo.com right now all kinds of great info and Intel and Analysis in there only available to die hards uh so sign up to become a die hard today join the Cool Kids Club all right diving back in to this conversation and in the comments shout out saying I just want the uh record to reflect I did say we needed Jordan Clarkson instant spark uh of offense for any team uh so ripped saying he’s taking that Zack to the Utah Jazz deal all day Loki one saying quickly uh fish thinks Clarkson’s okay um so look I okay let’s let’s start with Jordan Clarkson Because I think when you’re talking about giving up Zack LaVine and replacing the offensive punch of Zack LaVine Clarkson would be the one to replace a bit more of that offensive punch than John Collins who can get Buckets in his own right but true Clarkson look uh I believe it was last season he averaged 20 points per game nearly 21 points per game for Utah when he went into a starting role he played 61 games he started all 61 games in the 2223 season and a couple Seasons before that he won the NBA six Man of the Year award as one of the best bench pieces on a Utah team that had not Fallen apart and you know like essentially dissolved yet from the Mitchell and Rudy goberry years on a pretty decent team yeah however this season 23 24 he managed just 55 games played including missing the last month is of the season with something that I do not like to hear when it comes to players who the Bulls might be trading for joint inflammation in his back oh my goodness that to me is a o red flag and when he was out there this season his scoring dipped a bit um his minutes did too but 17 points per game here’s what I don’t love Jordan Clarkson shot 41.3 % from the field this season on five and a half three-point attempts per game this season he shot 29 and a half per. Jordan Clarkson shot like voo this season yeah yeah that’s that’s not good not great and the other thing about Jordan Clarkson and to be fair to him he’s never really been over like 45% from the field like in his career like he always kind of hovers like around that um but I will say the difference in Utah is his he got more bites of the Apple you know what I mean got much more attempts to to get himself to those 15 points a game so I believe man his three-point attempts you mentioned the five like the year before we’re talking seven the year before that seven the year before that eight like this is all because he was in Utah like he wasn’t taking that that many threes before that like before you know it was four it was five it was three you know he was playing on the Lakers and you know a few other teams like that so he was coming off the bench but he had the green light when he was out there in Utah and that’s why those numbers go up and that’s what scares you though also Matt because those percentages from three when you’re shooting on more attempts but your percentage isn’t going up or you know getting better it’s looking like it’s getting a little worse because you’re dealing with the back atomy and and that’s never a good thing and even his uh shots you know just from from the field just almost 10 10 shots a game from the field man so the green light was his uh he averaged the most points he’s ever averaged in his career uh playing with Utah and that will be the difference here is I don’t think that light will be as green uh here on the team but again depends on who’s here and who and who’s going to be on the squad like that but if he’s coming in second unit that’s what he does he’s he’s getting it he’s going one-onone he’s dribbling it and he’s going to pull the Tri and that’s I I don’t know how that would fit here I don’t know but I’ll take it I’ll find out uh MCM in the comments saying Clarkson gets buckets it just takes him a lot of shots yeah I mean he got up near he got up nearly 15 shots a game for Utah last season uh in in you know starting just 19 of the 55 he played so he was primarily back to being a bench guy and he got out 15 shots so ripped in the comments saying they were tanking I don’t know if you’re referring to why uh Clarkson sat for the last month of the season with the back inflammation or if you referring to Clarkson not being a very efficient shooter for Utah this season and which one of those you’re referring to when you’re talking about Utah tanking um May maybe the injury uh cjrt saying does Bobby Mark say why in the hell the Jazz would make this deal without a draft pick attached Danny a ain’t dumb so true that goes back to what you were just asking me Dave yeah the version of Zack LaVine that we know exists in the not too distant past you get that player giving up Clarkson and Collins if if LaVine Buys in and fits into what you’re trying to build in Utah I think there is a world in which you feel good about that being an even trade or maybe even a trade that you win if you’re Danny a but again that is it all hangs on the balance of what the hell version of Zack LaVine is show up for whichever team he’s playing for at the start of the 2425 season no honestly I think you’re dead on on that Matt um I can see Danny AES kind of making that because of the player the best player in that trade is still Zack LaVine like yeah arguing that is just like a Zach hater that’s just yeah he’s the best player of those three players it is like any six-man award included like he’s still the best player uh out there on on that an allar I don’t think so uh no no he’s not yeah it yeah no it would it wouldn’t happen for him that way no so I still think yeah that’s a good move uh about Danny a especially in the position that he’s in as far as rebuilding and you know restarting and really going forward to win getting somebody that’s still in their Prime uh of their career who is still who’s gonna be healthy you know coming back off the surgery that he had he’s gonna be healthy he’s gonna be ready to go and ready to play and you can get that for a John Collins and a Jordan Clarkson like sound like a good deal to me that’s just sound like a bad deal like where I have to attach something uh to do that so I can see Danny a thinking in that mode man and and making that trade so yeah I I I think it’s a good trade you know for both sides in a sense of you know getting Zack off because they clearly understand that that uh water has run dry here in Chicago so they want to move on from that and then Danny a letting it be known that it’s time for me us to win and I want to build a winning team here in Utah so why not started with that kind of player on your squad when you can get rid of those two guys right there because again I don’t equate John with winning he’s a good player and we’ll get into him but I don’t equate him with winning just like I said it about Andre drum I used to say that about Drummond also all the time and then I get a lifelong Detroit Piston yes and then I get the shacked in the fool of the Year moment to add to my point you know what I’m saying yeah uh CJ RT saying Zack’s definitely the best player in that trade sure I just don’t see the motivation when they are there are other deals out there so my answer to you CJ RTI on that and you bring up a fair point is it’s the same reason the Pistons might be interested yeah if you’re the Utah Jazz looking to add All-Star level Talent this off season to a team that you’ve rebuilt in the post Donovan Mitchell Rudy goar era who’s who’s picking Utah yeah other than other than low who’s happy he wound up there because it reminds him of his homeless land yes it does who’s picking Utah no one picks Utah I feel sorry for people in Utah it’s [ __ ] Utah so if you want to add star players in the NBA to your team that’s based in Utah also condolences to the poor bastards whoever end up playing there for their new NHL team I I’m still mad about you know the coyotes being ripped away from Arizona shout out to our phnx crew but that’s why why would they do that when there are other deals out there because they’re the Jazz and they’re going get left out in the cold pun intended because no one wants to no one’s going to pick Utah they have to trade for Star talent in Utah and the other part of that Matt is what other caliber kind of St Allstar can you get for John Collins and Jordan Clarkson you know like who who you getting for that like you I’m sure they’re gonna go after Paul George you know they’re gonna do their due diligence on those guys but we can kind of take them off the table right like like those guys don’t I don’t think they want to go there like I I just don’t so you’re going to be coming around to players like Zach LaVine who might be the best of the bunch that’s left over and again who Zack LaVine talent-wise who can you tell me that is available that the Bulls are willing a team that’s willing to take on those two dudes and those two contracts where you’re like okay it’s fine you know like I I don’t know who it is and maybe you all can inform me of it but I just don’t know that kind of star that’s available like that like Zack LaVine is right so it’s like Utah’s not getting Paul George obviously uh maybe they lose out on Brandon Ingram because there’s some team that can offer Brandon Ingram and the Pelicans more than what you Utah can offer sure for a player in Zach’s current situation coming off of a season ending surgery did not look great uh in the limited amount of games he played this season and does have those three years and 138 Mill remaining on the deal he still is a star caliber player if he comes back healthy and looks like the former version of himself he’s still in his age in athleticism Prime yes if he’s healthy that is a cheap get for an All-Star caliber player in the grand scheme of things um before we move to talk a bit more about John Collins Dave curious to hear your thoughts on this comment from our guy fish you said Clarkson is a guy who quote needs the ball in his hands as they say what would you make of Clarkson fitting into a Bulls team son’s Zack LaVine that maybe still has Demar de rzan on it and a young blossoming Kobe white yeah and that’s the question we were kind of talking about before the break was fit and how that would work now obviously Demar de rozan has the greenest light on the team if he’s still there like it’s Demar de rozan and Kobe white will probably have the second green light on that team Clarkson Matt is interesting because we understand that with him it takes more time to get those buckets like he has to play more minutes you know to get those buckets he played what 30 minutes a game those past two seasons uh in Utah and was like 27 or 26 coming off the bench or something like that does Billy Donovan have that kind of patience if he comes out and he’s and he’s clanging him up you know what I mean and he’s turning it over ask Javon Carter exactly thank you Matt way to be in my brain because that’s exactly what I was going to say like he has shown you he don’t have that kind of patience for those kind of things and a guy who is not going to be a Plus on the defensive end either Jordan Clarkson is not a Defender like that you know what I mean so having him out there just for the offense sake dribbling dribble dribble dribble dribble dribbling a shot clock down going in and maybe scoring and getting a bucket and you’re coming off the bench doing this I could see Billy Donovan pulling him and and telling him to have a seat and him getting maybe 14 15 minutes a game and that could do something to the psyche of of a guy like Clarkson Because Of how Billy is and yeah like the only person I’m telling you that I think is allowed to do those things is DeMar de rozan like you have to prove it to Billy that he’s like oh okay you could go in and do those kind of things but everything else has told me he he wants an offense where the ball is moving and not getting stuck it’s the one thing we complained about a lot with Demar de roen not not how great he is but just how it kind of you know changes your offense because he has to have the ball and he needs space and time to do what his thing so you’re giving me a guy who can’t you can’t tell me is on that same level of a demard Rosen and you’re giving him that kind of minutes to figure that out I ain’t seen Billy do it that’s all I’m saying I haven’t seen him do it yet Matt if there’s a game or player you can name me that you’ve seen him have that kind of patience for that’s a veteran yeah then I’m all I’m all ears on that one because we watch him not play Derek Jones Jr you we just mentioned Javon Carter and how he did him like Billy is quick to sit you you know I mean especially a veteran if it’s not like that so I don’t know that’s what that’s why my issue comes up with far as the fit is concerned because I I don’t know yeah um the the fit would be interesting um and I do kind of agree like if if you want Jordan Clarkson to cook you gotta you gotta give him the Rock and gota give him the rock yeah if if uh you know if King dear is still here how how how many shots is CL and taken away from dear yeah I think my answer would be probably not many like as much as dear’s like hey like yeah let’s share the wealth and don’t make me do everything well yeah we’ve watched for three years now where if the Bulls want to win most often no no slide to Kobe or Zager but dear’s got to do most of the work um so real quick it would be different if he could hit threes too it would be a whole different beat totally totally um I mean his his career numbers are not uh as bad as that 29% that he shot this season but again this is what what do the Bulls need they need guys who can shoot and Clarkson coming off of that season I don’t feel great about it um John Collins on the other hand is uh okay so my first thought when I heard John Collins was O just giant injury flag in like it seemed like he was always injured at the first you know the first third of his career playing in Atlanta uh and and I went back and I was like yeah okay my memory serves correctly from the 1920 season through the 2122 season his games played tallies were 41 63 54 that’s that’s a good chunk of games missed but the past two seasons being the last he spent in Atlanta and then this first season he spent in Utah 71 and 68 you’re like okay that’s you know John Collins got himself a bit healthier you like to see that as a big you’re like okay well he could obviously play the four he could play the five in certain lineups and you know as a 69 undersiz Center because he has the length attached to that 69ine frame um does he give you Elite level Rim protection no I don’t think that that’s the player that John Collins is I would also say that some of his defensive stats and advanced defensive met metrics are not as good as you would expect them to be for a player like John Collins but I also will give him a pass at least partly because those Atlanta teams he played on were not about defense they just weren’t they were’re not that’s not that was not their MO out there at all um so I’ll say this about John Collins if you if we’re just looking at him as far as numbers are concerned he’s he’s pretty awesome if you’re just looking at the numbers uh going by that he you can basically put it in pin that he’s going to get you uh 12 points with 14 points and eight rebounds seven eight rebounds and be solid on the offensive rebounding tip as well even even had a 21 and 10 year in Atlanta in 1920 right you know what I mean and and be a solid uh shooter also from the three-point line now he didn’t shoot great I believe in the year before this one he didn’t shoot great uh last season he shot 29% oh it was that one okay all right this this season he got it back up to 37 he’s a career 35.8% three-point shooter on low volume like has gradually built up from like one or two a game in his early career few years it’s been somewhere between three and four attempts per game which is fine like I don’t I don’t really think of him taking six threes a game like him hitting three or four but shooting a solid percentage because you want him in the paint doing those things more so than anything so honestly it doesn’t bother me he takes like three it’s the fact that he’s hitting him at a solid clip and it’s it’s serviceable it’s a plus it’s having him a three it’s still a plus so that’s cool too I like the rebounding aspect of him because I first thing I think of is uh Patrick Williams who is not not going to be that rebounder and I’m GNA need one you know what I’m saying somebody who wants to actually go down do the dirty work and then him being a solid offensive rebounder uh as well I think is also a good thing as far as John Collins is concerned a guy you can give the ball to on the post you know what I’m saying who can who can score buckets that way as well he will shoot well over 50% from the field uh that’s just how he is um so honestly I see his fit a little better than Jordan Clarkson’s the the only issue I have is again it reminds me of getting somebody like Andre Drummond like I don’t equate it with winning I see I see bonehead plays happening you know what I mean immediately like I just see those kind of things dribbling off the foot forgetting the time on the shot clock you know what I’m saying throwing it back court getting technical foul like I see those kind of things happening with the John Collins uh on your squad but again the Bulls might are in a position where the Beggars cannot be choosers if they’re gonna give you somebody with that with Talent like that like I don’t know anybody that we’ve talked about Matt who has John Collin’s Talent as far as who the Bulls can get back and if you’re telling me I can get that for Zack LaVine because nobody else is willing to offer somebody with that kind of talent I mean I wrote a dice on that man yeah I I mean he’s he’s still obviously in his prime he’s 26 years old he puts up you know 15-8 15- N I mentioned the 121 and 10 year he had just regularly when he’s out there playing when he’s healthy that’s what he does and that’s a useful piece to have and you know I I think I mentioned uh their their contracts at the beginning of this conversation but just to Circle back to it you know he’s he’s uh the Richer uh the Richer player than Clarkson on these current contracts 26 and a half million uh I saw somebody in the comments a minute ago saying like you know Zack LaVine is not a a Max Level player making 40 million he’s like he should be making 25 uh at most well welcome to today’s NBA salary cap John Collins makes $25 million drink that in ladies and gents welcome to the the finan realities of the NBA salary cap thanks for joining conratulations um so I mean like look when he is healthy in playing well that’s not a terrible deal he does have that player option on year two so for the 25 26 Season could be an interesting fit what I thought about also Dave is okay we’re bringing in John Collins does he nudge out Patrick Williams in this hypothetical Universe because Collins could play the four next devu you finally get a bit more size in your starting five that Bulls fans have been clamoring for instead of all these Billy Donovan small ball billions of guards lineups when like parenthesis yeah let’s blame Billy for that hey he works with the roster that he’s been given um but maybe Patrick Williams stays because the Bulls match an offer sheet for him or sign him to a new deal and you slide Patrick to the three which is something else other Bulls fans have talked about wanting to see but oh wait then where’s DeMark so trying trying to fit the John Collins piece into the puzzle if you’re talking about John Collins in your starting five yeah it’s hard to figure out where he goes yeah I don’t yeah and in my mind man I wasn’t even thinking of him as a starter and I hope nobody else was um because the Bulls are I just feel they’re gonna They’re Gonna Keep Patrick Williams one because that’s their guy and two because as we tell you all the times the Bulls classic they love their toys dude uh since his rookie season when he play play 74 and started 26 since then so 1 2 3 4 5 six seasons worth of games John Collins has played but not started in three five games wow five games spanning the past six seasons Collins has played but not started wow that’s saying something ladies and gents and you so to come to the Bulls and you like I’m G start Patrick Williams over him that’s a great question that mat bringing up is hair over me right Patrick Williams over me because of course you can see it working if you’re talking about the bench you’re like cool I could just side Pat to the three I could slide Collins to the four and everything works out or even put up 15 and eight over a season Bulls fans would be apoplectically happy oh my gosh so yes that that brings up that kind of question back to AK back to Bobby marks what changes are you talking about making you know what I’m saying what are you talking about doing because you can then make that trade and and honestly I think I think you’re on board with this too if make trading for these guys Zach right it’s it’s one of the better deals that I’ve heard okay it does not involve sending draft Capital along with Zach to get off of his contract yes yes exactly it’s it it it helps you sleep a little bit better at night an extra 30 minutes for that at night you know what I’m saying he gets to sleep so it RS that’s it so I said two hours and 30 minutes is all you probably getting so so that gets you that and and that’s fine and because you have to leave with something the fact that you can leave with something out this because guys think about the other names being brought up you’ve heard wisman you know I mean you heard Harrison Barnes you know herder you know Davon Mitchell you know I’m saying like what guys can tell that have that Talent of a guy like Collins that versatile kind of Talent of a guy like Collins you know who just maybe needs a little coaching and needs to stay healthy as Matt keeps uh pointing out but the dude’s a starter in this league and like him at the four you see it you know like you see where it is you see where it fits so you’re like well if you’re gonna sign Patrick well dear like what are you gonna do what are you going to do are you saying I’m G sign Patrick to 100 Mil and then bring him off the bench that’s what you gonna tell me like you y’all got some interesting decisions to make interesting decisions to make especially if you make this kind of trade just start dear next to Kobe just put just put him in the backward put him back at the two that’s where he started that’s where it all started for dear that’s what I’m saying man yeah where where else does where else does he go where else does he go yeah where where yeah how do you fit Collins into your starting five if dear and Pat are both back on New Deals this summer which is looking more and more likely we’re talking finding a trade for Zack LaVine and that being the front office’s top priority this summer how about you uh find a way to trade VJ for a bag of Doritos and you move Collins to the five how about we do that I I’ll cheat with him at the five how about that hey man yeah as as long as he uh as long as he shoots 29% on uh you know five or six three-point attempts per game you gotta you gotta feel that void gotta feel that V void my God uh shout out to Charlie Ruby in the comments who said I’ll just take whatever at this point I’m just saying man like this is it’s not a bad deal it’s not it’s not a bad deal the issue comes in with the fit and if you’re keeping Demar de R rozan that’s where the issues start to occur if you’re not keeping Demar you see where everything kind of falls into place as far as having these two guys on the team but they’ve got to make that decision I’m telling you this is gonna be interesting time in these next couple weeks man this gonna be an interesting time here in Chicago uh D Grant shout out in the comments saying I’m a Knicks fan when are you guys gonna get your next MJ so we can Trash you guys is that how it went when we had an MJ yeah I don’t know if you remember that I went like that my man Grant but how did those years go how did those playoffs years go how I’d be happy to tell you about them show show show me all those show me all those banners that ying and Starks won together in the 90s what do you what are you talking about man show me the banners you won with Mike there show me those banners like ladies and gentlemen don’t do this don’t do this to yourself we can well actually no do do this because I would love to have these discussions with you how about the greatest dunks and Bulls history are both on the Knicks like I I would love to have these discussions with you stripping Charles Smith oh God euphoric eight times nine times 10 times yeah yeah condolences on losing that playoff series to the Indiana Pacers man I mean that’s that’s gotough talking a lot of [ __ ] in the first half of that series talking a when will Nicks fans learn Dave when will they learn never they they’ll be doing the same thing next year uh wish you Lu you got a great one in Brunson though I give you that bunson is awesome Bon is awesome man so but yeah no you don’t want none of MJ again you don’t want to do that to yourself MJ would go to the Garden tonight and drop 60 if he felt like it uh we uh we are out of time uh appreciate everybody for hanging out with us today and all week reminder if you didn’t catch it yesterday’s episode was a fun one we had our friend Darnell Mayberry on in studio with us uh Bulls beat reporter for the athletic we talked to him about his scathing column asking 10 big questions um uh that the Bulls are facing this offseason including this Zack LaVine stuff that we were just talking about today so go back and give that a listen or a watch if you haven’t yet um and have a wonderful weekend we will be back Monday with a fresh dose of five episodes for yall as we will be all off seon long for you bull sick goes out there just like us can’t get can’t get enough of that torture uh Big Dave Joey I’m going up to the roof I’m bringing a cooler full of beers come over play some bags summer is here let’s enjoy it summer peack is in effect ladies and gents big DAV is at pal bawl Sports our P producer Joey behind the controls is at Joy’s path is also follow our guy will the goat Who’s down in uh down in Mexico for a wedding this weekend willor gole safe travels to him hope he’s having fun we are csor bulls and we will talk to you on Monday have a great weekend Bulls Nation see R be good Peace Love [Applause]

The CHGO Bulls crew discuss a Zach LaVine trade to the Utah Jazz proposed by ESPN’s NBA Front Office Insider Bobby Marks. The proposed trade would send LaVine out west for Jordan Clarkson and John Collins, who each have two years remaining on their contracts. Matt and Big Dave weigh the pros and cons of the trade, and how well Collins and Clarkson would fit with the Bulls. Would most Bulls fans approve of this trade, or see it as selling too low? The guys also react to Boston’s Game 1 victory in the NBA Finals.

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