What’s Next for Evan Mobley? (Q n Colb) – Cleveland Cavaliers news, Cavs free agency

What’s Next for Evan Mobley? (Q n Colb) – Cleveland Cavaliers news, Cavs free agency

this is the moment we’ve all been waiting for for the thousands independants and the millions watching around the [Applause] world let’s get ready [Applause] [Music] here welcome to the junkyard pod today we are starting a new series called what’s next uh where we are going to focus on key players for the Cleveland Cavaliers and what we expect from them this Summer and moving forward joining me today to talk about Evan Mo’s potential contract extension and his future with the Cavaliers we have Quincy carrier and jaob be Hart both hosts of The Q and Cole podcast I can’t recommend following both of these guys on Twitter enough and subscribing to their podcast they do great stuff over there I’ve been looking forward to this one so thank you both for coming on what’s up man I a’t heard the full day it a minute put the put the government out there you know what I’m saying I had to do some some searching to find out too man it’s not it’s not easy to find I’m pretty sure like 5 10 people like that’s what it is you could have just asked me you know what saying be prepared I wanted to be professional you know professional oh feel like I can’t swear nothing on this you know some shoes on my bad I this was casual no we’ll keep it casual we’ll keep it free flowing but uh for this series The the way I plan on starting each episode is just by quickly touching base on where we left off in the season uh now we will talk more in depth about Mo’s final showing in the playoffs uh you know but to focus briefly on the overall picture we can start with Quincy can you give just a quick summary of how you feel about Moy and what he showed last season I feel good about Moy I think he showed some ress I think we get this tendency to make up an image that does not exist of a player and then hold that player to that image and think that like all of the problems that surround that player are going to go away like when we think of whatever you think of peak LeBron you probably aren’t thinking of some of the bad things that happened when LeBron like LeBron turned the ball over a good amount of time his second time in Cleveland right like we never talk about that because it’s not like a a a main part of what we bring up with him but that thing does exist when you talk about LeBron right and when you watch it in real time you notice those kind of things and they kind of bug you because it’s messing with the perfect image that you have of that player now obviously Evan Moy is not LeBron James but Ean Mobley has progressed offensively like he is clearly a much better player this year offensively than he was last year he developed somewhat of a three-point shot that he feels a little bit more confident every time he shot a three-pointer last year you could tell that like the shooting coach was like you better shoot that three Evan like it was like they just wanted him to get used to shooting them in games where it looked like he was like no this a good look I’mma take it um more often right and he made I thought he his more interesting makes this year where when he wasn’t like super wide open and he just got space he saw the hoop he was like no I’m taking this right when he was more confident in there there are some things you’re still gon to have to wait on with Evan right Evan’s got to gain some weight eventually right you want him to get a little bit bigger you I think that’s going to be something that helps his consistency with his jumper and his free throw shooting um because his mechanics are pretty good it’s just he’s he’s super light out there so like if he gets touched while he’s in midair he’s super easy to manipulate and make him change his shot or sometimes his lack of uh strength or his lack of confidence in his strength which I think is honestly a bigger deal than his lack of strength overall just affects his ability to be like no just going to go up and finish through because it feels like it takes two quarters of coaching of of telling Evan Moy you need to finish through and finish stronger for him to start to do it in a game um which is frustrating but that’s something that happens with young players funny enough I know I keep bringing up Bron but brion’s the one player we all saw develop at a high level here in Cleveland was something we were concerned about with LeBron very early on oh he pulls up and takes too many jumpers right uh he doesn’t get hit the r enough I remember we just the big thing about the Detroit game was that LeBron was like crashing to hoop like what 25 out of like 30 shot attempts like oh he figured it out and all of this stuff right um but yeah I think Evan sometimes it’s a mentality thing sometimes it’s um um you want him to just have more confidence in himself I do think eventually like in the pretty near future it would benefit the Cavs to clear some space up offensively to allow Evan to develop and I don’t know if that makes you a better team right now like for next year it might not make you a better team but it will make you better in the long run because I think Evan has the potential to develop into somebody who could give you a healthy 20 and 12 and play excellent defense on the other side but if he’s never in a position where his offense is necessary for the team’s success it’s always going to feel like an option to him like I can score if I need to or if I want to I can um and that is not going to be with helpful right you want Evan Moy to be consistent 20 and 12 guy you got to start making moves that show that you trust him to develop into that and that you’re G to make him like at least attempt to live up to that potential so uh Evan I think Evan’s a great player we’ll see how far it goes we’ve all gotten carried away early with Evan like the comps were ridiculous coming out of college I’m guilty of it yeah got little carried away chis it went from Chris BOS to Kevin Garnett to Tim Duncan to Anthony Davis like it just we never just let this man grow right we were always like you must grow into a Hall of Famer from day one with Evan Mobley um and he’s doing some things where you can say he’s on track like in some of these spaces like especially defensively he what he finished second in defensive player of the year last year like I think I think he might have finished third I think he should have been first but even even if you’re gonna say jiren Jackson deserved it which sure he did he should have been ahead of Brook Lopez I’m sorry but that was that was BS like way they did try to sneak Brook on the Lakers fan is coming out Jared Jackson Jr didn’t deserve it he absolutely was not the defense to play I would agree I would agree he fouls too much listen we could open up this whole rant because that was he it like Jackson won that defensive player the year five years ago it’s like listen they played the Lakers the first round they were the two seed the Lakers were the seven seed and Anthony Davis was far away a better defenser better Defender than Jared Jackson J was not close see some defensive player of the year gets treated like offensive player of the year where it doesn’t go to the best defensive player a lot of the times like it’s like oh who do we want to reward with defensive player of the year and they just felt like it was jiren Jackson’s turn and that Evan Moy was too young to get that award but that’s worries me is because I I think Anthony Davis could have won how many defensive player of the years probably but early on it was oh well he’ll he’ll get there eventually you know like he his time will come they didn’t give it to him right away and now you look back and I’m pretty sure he’s never even won the award and I I kind of said that at the time when Moy uh finished third last season I was like I’m worried he’s gonna end up having a similar trajectory where we just assume he’s going to win this award because it seems obvious and then he doesn’t get it the year he probably should have and now Victor wanyama is GNA win the next 15 you think Evan was on that was caught on the wing with Luca he uh he ends up like uh Rudy hey man I would love to say no but I I remember at the end of the regular season Paul George dropped him in that on that gamewinner if you remember that so I’m like you know what I I trust Evan Mobley out there but if he got cooked hey that’s just life as a seven footer when you’re on an island can’t move like Luka can’t move like PG though like L can’t move like PG PG’s cold he’s super cold I’m note he’s cold Evan was taking a healthy drop on that coverage too hey if Luca got that ball at the top he using all that L to get in there like nah I’m not gonna let you shoot it like I’m not worried he can better thany definitely definitely trust Evans versatility out there more than I trust Rudy but uh yeah to to summarize Moy season I think I agree with a lot with what uh qu Quincy said I think uh something else to note is that the injuries limited our chance to really see what we may have wanted to see uh he had the knee injury earlier and then he twisted his ankle towards the end of the year I really wanted to see Moy grow as an offensive Hub get a chance to you know handle the ball try to do some playmaking um we didn’t it never felt like it truly became a staple of the Cavs offense so we’re going to talk a lot about towards the end of the episode what the Cavs can do to maximize Mo I think that’s one Avenue for them to do it maybe the coaching change that’s that’s on the way could help open things up uh I do want to transition and talk about the playoffs and get CO’s thoughts on this because we heard all season about how Evan Moy didn’t improve this is what we had to deal with all year and then right at the end Moy kind of shut that down and gave us all some much needed Ammunition by just really having the best offensive stretch we’ve seen from him on a big stage against Boston so I want to ask you Cole how important was that that Moy showed us a glimpse of what he is capable of where do I even start it’s it’s like okay so let me let me just preface what I’m gonna say by saying this if you follow me and Tony on Twitter you know we have been the mo Defenders all year and it felt weird for me to do it because I’m a Laker fan and I’m just like why why is everybody hating on this kids so much like I don’t I don’t understand what the I don’t understand what the deal is like why does everybody hates this kid did so much it was so important for him not even just the Boston series but the last couple the last few games that Orlando Series where he was playing the five the entire time it was important for everybody to see that because now you know that he can do it and I I kind of had my doubts about him being a full-time Center yeah in a large part because I know Q talked about it I don’t feel like he I never felt like he was strong enough to handle being the center full time for a full season in playoffs but it was so important for him to be able to hold it down defensively defensively but not even just that be able to score and impact the game offensively not even just as a scorer but also as a passer and I’ve been saying this for the longest I think his most undervalued underutilized and underrated skill that Evan Mobley has is as a passer of the basketball yeah I’m with you he shows you he showed you in the post season he could I think he had I think it was the game that they actually won in Boston what was that game against Boston so that was game two yeah I think so game two game right he had two he had two different assists to Carris Levert hit him perfectly in stride for buckets and I’m like he can do that all the time he can do it all the time if you just give him the opportunity so I think the playoffs were important because they were like hey we need you to score we need you to be aggressive constantly he did that and he had probably the most success he’s ever had on a national stage yeah horrible National TV games I feel like every time they on Nation TV he struggled and it just season like earlier in the season like that that first game that was on national TV against the Knicks struggled in that game Tim is in the arena I know folding so I I need I think Von temps covered the Celtics series too so I was like thank God someone is finally seeing Evan Moy play up to expectations because yeah for whatever reason the national perception just I feel like it was so much worse because of how much he happened to struggle in those games but did you hear what people were saying and I’m get I’m Gonna Let You Go on the second CU did you hear what people were saying dorber uh JJ reick who does who does the games for NBA Greg Anthony whoever was watching him kept saying the same thing over and over and over they were like hey he’s really talented he needs to be more aggressive he needs to be aggressive all the time he needs to be trying to score all the time I feel like he could help them if he’s more aggressive and when he when Jared Allen got hurt and he didn’t have a choice but to be more aggressive he thrived and I think that’s important that was important for the cast to see that’s obviously important for the fans to see he can do and he can become the player that everybody believes that he can become he just needs the opportunity which is why I think this summer they’re going to make that bet on him and give him the opportunity to grow into that player so with that in mind with Evan moy’s strength as a passer doesn’t that kind of recontextualize a lot of the conversation people be having about Jared Allen because people be acting like Jared Allen don’t fit with him but it’s like oh if you can get into a position where he can make some passes he’s really good at working that big to big stuff and Jared Allen not not like a great facilitator but a good passing big in a traditional sense too improved a lot this year too I think that’s the vision if if you are going to keep them together I see the argument both ways if you do keep them together the vision is you want Moy to be able to play farther away from the basket and while yes shooting is a way to do that also just letting him face up and create plays for others is a way to make that happen we’ve seen that he can make passes to Allen in that big to big game um but really and and I want to talk about this later it’s it’s mainly he just needs to face up and attack the basket more often they really don’t do that very often and we’ll definitely talk about that when we talk about uh what comes next how the Cavs can maximize Mo’s potential um the playoffs were a huge moment for him though because I always look for those flashes from a young player and this was like a blinding lights moment where it was clear as day he has some untapped potential there’s something here still uh you mentioned the passing listen I think we talk about some of the comparisons too to like Anthony Davis Tim Duncan that those were out of those were way out of hand but if you think of someone like bam atab bio I mean this is a realistic path for him I think I could see Moy being a guy who at his Peak averages 20 points four or five assists 10 rebounds and that’s a pretty damn good player when you add in the defense Tony I’m GNA throw I’m gonna throw compis it out for you okay yeah you Q know Q know he knows what it is he knows what it is he knows what it is it’s it’s G it might make some C fans a little apprehensive at first little concerned but stay stay with me stay with me stay with me shout out my guy Jim D on Twitter because me and him are on the same page with this if I told you at the peak of his career Evan Mobley is like Draymond Green 2.0 you know what are you up foot Draymond seven foot like seven foot Draymond Green who can score I wouldn’t hate it I know a lot of fans would hate it but I feel like people I am in such place with Draymond than most cash fans because I think I am too I don’t know where you’re going with this but draymond’s a hell of a player Draymond is really damn good especially during it when they were winning championships I mean if that’s that’s what Moy becomes and and I use the Warriors as an example all the time and people get upset because I know Donovan Mitchell and Darius Garland that’s not Stephen Clay that’s not the comparison I’m making but the warriors were winning championships with two non-shooting players out there you had Draymond and Iguodala a lot of the time out there that was their death lineup those are two players who could not shoot the three-pointer really if you’re looking at the Cavs you’re trying to figure out hey how do we make an allen Moy pairing work well you need someone to be like Draymond who can create plays for others in that short role and that’s I think I could see Moy being that to a degree yeah I think that’s the perfect comparison yeah I think Draymond is so underrated and this gonna get me in trouble if people but I feel like Draymond is so especially like the version of him that existed before KD was on the Warriors I’m like we acted like we didn’t remember the reason we hate Draymond is because he was legitimately the most annoying player on the team because he was good like like there were times where like I know during like the whole initial Warriors cast run like I wasn’t really worried about Steph as much as you would think that somebody would be worried about Steph it was like what’s clay and Draymond gonna be on right because that’s what would set it off in the positive direction for the Warriors of like I mean not Steph uh clay and Draymond are on right like if clay and Draymond are having good games and Draymond makes a couple of them little threes that he be shooting it’s tough it’s tough like it’s tough like I don’t know what you supposed to do and then Draymond like really into it now so now he’s making sure all of the switches happen on defense and everybody’s in the right place offensively um yeah I think Draymond is is very underrated I think because he was on some of those like KD Warriors teams and people are like what does he bring to the table and again it’s another conversation where like Evan brings a lot to the table that not going to see when you peruse a box scorer right that really do matter to this team and that’s the same thing with Draymond I do think like Evan is like the fully realized version of that right Draymond was like 66 and it was like let’s just see if this works right like kind of like the beta test of it and it turned into a Hall of Fame player uh which he is and if Evan can be that I mean we’re talking about a Hall of Fame player like in the right circumstances at 7 foot being able to score the way that he had he can um the smoothness the the smoothness with his shot that Draymond just never had I mean you can compare their shots it does not look like Draymond shot he’s got a backpack on the backpack it was so weird to me because he wasn’t a bad three-point shooter for a while it did like he just became a awful three-point shooter like the dude we made the memes about yeah the dudes we made the memes about shooting the ball for the Warriors for the long it’s like Harrison Barnes cuz he didn’t make anything in the 2015 well 2016 fight finals right we forget he was a part of that whole thing now but that was who we were joking on we weren’t making jokes about Dre mod not making threes because you know what happened in game seven game seven I thought it was over he almost won Finals MVP in game seven that’s why that’s a crazy alternate reality so much so much in that like early Cav Warriors um history is going to be like Rewritten by whatever LeBron does Doc ment wise whatever Steph Curry does and it’s goingon to be frustrating as hell for us who live through it because Steph GNA come out there and act like he was hooping um in some of these games I’m like n Steph stop stop hey bro Draymond was trying to cast game bro hey if LeBron’s documentary does not mention Jr Smith’s third quarter contributions I don’t want it that that and one three-pointer man I mean it those little moments that just kept him alive because Draymond was that was one of the most insane performances ever yeah LeBron was breaking some some pretty he was smoking some layups down the stretch there when nobody was scoring like he got the block so we didn’t care it was a couple like damn bra like what’s going on like be honest be honest was there any more stressful stretch of a of a sporting event than when that neither team could score and that game it was like a six it was like a five six minute it was a fever dream dog nobody nobody could get a bucket it was so crazy you know that feeling you get when you watch like your favorite football team go out to kick the final field goal and you like here it is there’s no more time either we win or lose on this kick it’s like they like called the timeout to freeze the kicker but it just went on for like five it was like 15 minutes of like legitimate time where you’re just like what is going to happen oh my God fast break oh LeBron James has blocked him oh what is Kyrie doing oh yeah that that play where Kyrie kind of just drove wildly to the basket and I can’t remember up topall JR Smith and JR Smith had to be the one be like all right let’s call a timeout oh man I was holding my breath that whole that that couldas been a train w why is JR being the voice of re what are we doing yeah you just look at Kyrie he’s like I would have had it I’m like what were you trying to go for dog like there’s so many moments I was watching that Rudy go bear defensive play and I’m like see that’s what Steph was trying to get on on Kevin Love in that play he was trying to get that step back but Kevin just founded to not get to not get dropped off no thre doesn’t matter what else happens it’s not gonna be a three-pointer he shout out to Kevin because we never talk about the fact that he had six points in that game need every single one of them he was cleaning the boards he was cleaning the boards 13 rebounds six points my man was putting a Tristan Topson numbers and we like yeah you was you big three I know Tristan Thompson somewhere like anyways back to hey we we did a whole retrospective on game seven why not you know I I think it was worthwhile but one one key thing to watch this summer is going to be the potential contract extension that Mo signs now according to Brian windhorse the Cavs are very likely to give Moy the extension basically as soon as it’s available in July uh now I’m not a cap expert I don’t know much about the NBA salary cap but I did ask on Twitter and according to uh Bobby marks it would be a fiveyear $215 million deal now I know some people in the comments probably just had a heart attack here that but I do want to offer some perspective before we get into this because NBA salaries have just gotten insane and I feel like we need a reminder of where Moy would stand so with that contract Moy would be making around 43 million a year which sounds nuts but that would make him the 15th highest paid player and that’s before we even get into this summer free agency cycle where I’m sure more guys will get incredible deals Listen by by 2027 there will be nine guys making over 57 million one of them is Bradley Beal so so 43 million for Moy is pretty reasonable especially when you just look at the what NBA teams have to offer at this point you factor in his age and all that but and and ultimately Wind Horse went on to say that he would expect every team in the NBA to give Moy that deal so my question is pretty simple Quincy is this the right move for Cleveland giving Moy the max yeah and by the way shout out to the Wizards for just giving some generational wealth out like yeah why not you know shout out to y’all man John Wall Bradley bille look they might have never W more than the one thech they didn’t give him that contract but still I mean he’s he’s keeping it the tradition alive oh yeah oh yeah they paid Jordan P did they do that they’re gonna be paying him the Warriors gave him the contract but they they’ll be finishing it off oh yeah they traded for that contract yes yes they said we’ll take that one actually shout out to DC man like ain’t got nothing better to do give money away hey man you want some money yeah it’s being and cools out here like come on bro like he I’m just thankful Victor with didn’t end up over there God yeah how do you end up in a situation all right let me not be sidetracked by the $54 million that Bradley Bill is making to not play basketball um uh yeah Evan bble picking up his max I mean I I feel like this is an obvious yes like yeah I think so yeah I don’t see a world where you’re like oh let’s try to Short change them and give him like a threeyear 90 million extension or something like that like I feel like that would be silly like you’re your your your ceiling as a franchise is partly tied to the ceiling of Evan Moy as a player you usually give that guy to Max right um even if you don’t want to you usually give that Guy the ma I mean they gave DG the max right well yeah yeah they gave DG the max so yeah if DG got the max Evan Moy most certainly should and again this goes down to a very a conversation we have all the time about basketball we gotta stop acting like defense is not a part of it like Evan moley is growing on offense and that is a bonus to what he provides on defense which is one of the best defenders in the NBA before he’s turned 26 I don’t think people understand how special that is for Evan mile to be that good of a Defender this early into his NBA career while he still is undersized at most of the positions he’s asked to play on a night in Night Out basis right like we talk about the undersiz thing look what he’s accomplished in the league in spite of that and like if he ever is just at weight at that position then that’s really going to change a lot of things about how we view him so yeah I think Evan gets the max here um it was funny and Tony maybe you can clear this up with me wasn’t there some kind of controversy about how we couldn’t keep get Evan Moy on the max because of the trade for Donovan Mitchell that’s why I said I’m not an expert on this stuff because I swear there was a whole thing about how you can’t have three I believe it was you can’t have three players on rookie Max extensions and we have Darius Garland on one Donovan Mitchell and now we would have Moy on it uh but Bobby marks said that it would be a five-year deal so I don’t I don’t know the regardless I would assume that this deal is going to be somewhere in the4 50 million maybe that changes because Mitchell might sign a different extension I have no idea so I can’t really clear it up for you but this is this this goes to a point that I want to push a sports fans with it C of the salary cap that they got nothing to do with you right they G figure it out if they want to it’s not my money I’m not paying it don’t spend no I hate when sports fans waste so much time being worried about the salary cap oh I promise you they have mechanisms to get that to get that right if they want to get it right like it Warriors add KD to staff clay and Draymond like you you’ll figure it out figure it out they can figure it out look LeBron gonna get $60 million to play basketball somewhere they gonna figure it out like they’ll they’ll they’ll work it out they’ll pull whatever streets they need to if they can afford to I know coob is a Laker fan and they ain’t really got it like that no more but you know listen listen we gonna figure it out we gonna be all right don’t worry about that we gonna be all right yeah LeBron gonna have part ownership with the Lakers it’s gonna be disgusting okay JJ reic he’s gonna he’s gonna turn the ship around for you guys listen I I don’t want to talk about that hey did y’all hire the JJ reic for the clip show we did not hire the JJ re from the clip show we did not hire I don’t want to get a sidetracked but I saw something in that I was watching it and I saw Draymond I mean not Draymond DeAndre Jordan look Chris more I eye I’m like y’all need to try better man y’all need to do something about this dog why is that I understand you can’t get somebody who’s seven feet tall like you know that’s hard but like don’t let me know he not seven feet tall why he look at Chris Paul eye to eye right now camera angles or something man yeah why is Blake just standing there like eye to eye with like everybody 510 It’s hard out here man it’s hard out here you know what I’m saying like you got Apple crates like DeAndre Jordan is giant like they need to recreate the DeAndre Jordan duck or Brad or uh not what the show is about C that’s not what the show you had the opportunity to do it I need to see that I need to see that happen go on YouTube see reenacted yeah I need to see it reenacted with a bunch of five foot dudes like I need to see how they do that like I want to know how far CG has truly progressed I don’t know what their budget is but I’m sure they can find a way to make that work hey man they got lorence Fishburn out there in the Doc Rivers no hair hairline like they they can figure this out like if they wanted to what were we talking we find out how the Clippers how the Clippers players even feel about the show did we even find out I I haven’t seen any reactions yet because it’s making Doc Rivers look really good and I’m like I’m like [Music] I wonder who they interviewed such hater dog such a hater I’m not Doc Rivers at one point in that show Compares himself to Obama okay that sounds like something Doc Rivers would do yeah but it’s not viewed as hey he tripping there’s one where Doc Rivers talks ruthless garbage to all the talk about why Matt Bar’s wife is leaving him and then they pain it as he just did that so they could get used to Draymond Green’s trash talk in 2012 like we knew Draymond Green trash talk in 2012 like no they out here just telling lies in that show dog and I’m like this sound like Doc Rivers to me like he might had he might have had a hand in that one it sounds like I still haven’t seen the show but you’re you’re pitching me on it now I want to check out seems like the most reasonable person in that in that show and I’m like look he is compared to battle Sterling but act like the every man in this one I’m like I know doc ain’t no every man like we heard too much by the way they doing Blake Griffin bad on that show that’s the only thing I’ve heard about it so far is that Blake Griffin is is he’s a character what I heard if I’m Blake Griffin I gotta fight like what is this protrayal of me like that is going on right now BL over there like hey what did people about me bro what people tell you like why yall tell everybody he held me by the hand like this don’t make any sense to be putting on this TV show man he just out here being selfish like I’m like yo y’all hate Blake like why y’all doing this to him it’s a good show though yeah hey you know what I think I think you sold me I’m gonna have to check it out now uh but anyways uh moving into our last topic here and it’s kind of similar to to this one talking about the max contract because one thing that I’ve been saying and I think we all agree here if you’re I yes give Moy the max but if you do that it’s time to treat him like a max player it’s time to put him in a position to really prove that he is worth that money so building on that point Co what growth do you need to see from Moy and what do the Cavs have to do to maximize that potential well starting off if we’re talking about growth I I don’t really think there’s anything he’s going to have to really work on defensively is like being the anchor of the defense is is is a little bit of a concern to me like not having Jared Allen back there with you and being able to hold everything down yourself is gonna be an adjustment for him but I think that’s an adjustment that I think he can make and he’ll be fine the biggest growth is all gonna come on offense like you can’t be passive you can’t just kind of be there and let Darius and Donovan and Allen just handle everything especially because they may not be there two of them may not be there anymore so he’s going to have to be aggressive he’s gonna have to be assertive he’s gonna have to become like a 20 point 22 Point 24 point a game kind of guy and he’s gonna have to become a consistent double digit rebound guy you know what I’m saying like he’s he’s been about he’s been at like around like nine his first three seasons playing with Allen so that shouldn’t be difficult for him to do if he’s the only big he should be getting at least 10 boards every game biggest thing with him I want to see him utilize more as a playmaker I want to see him become like a four five assist guy like he’s gonna have to become like a 25 25 2010 and four I about to say MP no n he’s not I don’t I don’t think he’s going to get 25 but he has to be a 2010 and five or 2010 and four some somewhere around that’s reasonable I think he if he’s gonna be a max player he’s gonna have to do that every night yeah I would agree with a lot of what Co said um this is like the Cavs have a number of interesting dilemmas on the roster that don’t necessarily have one solution that fixes it all right one of the dilemmas they have right we talked about Co talks about it all the time you know told it’s like a Wing Stop the way he talk about the cats they need Wings they need Wings you know what they need Wings he be like hell yeah they do you think moving off from JB was the right move I don’t know but they need wings like that’s kind of like they won’t solve the problem they will not Sol the problem um but there the other issue that I’m like that exists with Evan is right now Evan I think needs to up his usage right like he needs to have ball in his hand a little bit more how do you make that happen you have to lower somebody’s usage Who’s Who on this team right now like is gonna still like is Darius Garland still gonna be as effective as Darius Garland is if he can’t have the ball as much as Darius Garland has it it’s a real question I don’t know what the answer to that is when you bring Carris Levert Off the Bench that’s not really good for getting Evan the ball more because Caris one sometimes he gets tunnel vision and two he needs the ball right like how many guys on this team need the ball to be successful and if we’re gonna add Evan into that list of guys who need the ball you just cannot function as a team that is four or five guys deep and they need the ball territory there’s not enough uh uh usage to go around so they have to figure out who needs to go in order for that to happen right because I don’t think Jared Allen really factors in because Jared Allen don’t be having the ball that much he just gets lobs or or put backs or he he’s he’s actually a part of the solution to me where I’m like oh he’s pretty efficient with this touches um it’s like you just need to get more guys like that and you need to probably like figure out hey is this Darius Donovan Mitchell thing gonna work and I don’t think Darius is a bad player I don’t think Darius is who he was last year you made a great point on Twitter Tony where you talked about they we’ll excuse a Bad season everybody gets a Bad season in the NBA two Bad seasons in a row you kind of become a meme yeah so yeah Darius is he used up his one well he had some bad Seasons before but we don’t care about none of that like all the bad K you’re on a lottery team it’s a little yeah yeah we don’t we don’t care until you start playing good like you make your first All-Star team that’s when we start to actually care about what you do consistently or when you get close to being an Allstar um and DJ used up his One Bad season post that run um and we’ll see what he does after that I think he’s a good player but I’m wondering like hey is the fit there now if you do move Darius Garland on coob always brings us up and I think it’s a great Point who’s gonna play point guard like somebody somebody needs to facilitate right like somebody I think we’ve talked about it in a perfect world if you could get Lonzo ball to be your point guard like I think that would be what this team kind of needs because he provides good defense length all of that stuff shooting honestly yeah yeah a great spot up shooter um so it it’s just about figuring out like what’s the right fit what can you get can you get Wing that’s worthwhile I know Co likes Brandon Ingram I think I’m a little bit on the like I wouldn’t be mad if we gave it a try but I also think Brandon Ingram provides some of the same issues that I have with like having Darius Garland in the back court with him which is he’s not necessarily like a strong Wing like he’s a guy who could score on the wing defend he’s better than not like yeah he’s better than throwing out like Dean Wade at the three as like our big solution for like how we’re going to stop guys or or or plug that position but you know I think there’s some questions with him that are kind of along the same lines of Darius Garland um as far as his scoring uh efficiency goes and if he’s not providing you scoring then what is he actually providing you is another question with with Brandon Ingram which was a question this year for the uh Pelicans so yeah I don’t know if the perfect solution exists for Wing but I do think if you’re the Cavs you you you’re G to give Evan Mobley this Max and you need to say to yourself okay what do we need to do to get the most out of him offensively what position do we need to do put him in as an organization to get the most out of him and what does that require of us on the roster look Donovan Mitchell’s gonna be here that’s fine I think him and Evan can play well together um it’s just who else is on that list of they need the ball in order to be successful um and we gota be better at picking these role players like quick R quick rat quick rat real quick I’ve watched the Cleveland Cavaliers All Season all every game watched every game I have never seen a player make me more Angry George George I’ve never dude it was so bad all the Lakers teams I’ve watched George would mess up I would just hear Cove every time I saw George missing three turn it over I would hear Co and then like when George had those stretches where he would get like nine points out of nowhere I could just imagine Co just sitting there like I can’t believe this SL look man I tried to defend him at the start of the Year too I tried and people for all the people who say I’m just blindly optimistic about Cavs players you haven’t heard me talk about George neang because if I think a Cavs player truly sucks I’m gonna tell you guys and George they whiffed on that one all right I I’m rooting for him I was rooting for him then I still I still hope he becomes a a rotational player but he is just not a rotational player in the NBA right now he just can’t be on Flor you know what he is he’s like what if Kyle Anderson was actually bad like that’s what just had no finesse no other skills speed cause Kyle Anderson plays that slow you feel like that’s intentional like that’s so he could be in control kind of like you know and out of control it’s like a is that slow because that’s just how he can play do you understand they signed Marcus Morris when they had like 12 games left in the season and he was significantly better so much better than George ni was came right off the couch and was already an improvement like that is terrible bro like that that is not good that we knew it was going to be an improvement like a immediately the first second we saw him in a uniform like oh yeah that’s better than putting George got there just I don’t even want to get into max sh I I don’t I don’t even want to get into that yeah I don’t I don’t want to get into that I will I will say on the max Shu thing they’re asking too much of him you make him a six-man you make him a bench player I think it makes way more sense I think really to to bring this to try and tie this all together definitely have to yeah you want him to play the wing you’re just asking him too much uh they need they need to find a way to round out this roster as far as breaking up the core the thing that concerns me and I think Quincy mentioned this a little bit you might kind of trial and error your way back to saying hey we need a a center to help Moy out hey we need a traditional point guard next to Mitchell you might end up finding that you need you’re you’re looking for a Darius Garland or Jared Allen uh now if you believe that Moy can be a fulltime Center and I think he’s shown flashes of it you can make that move you’re going to need to get a good reliever on the bench for you need AIT a backup big to help him so if that’s the way to maximize him I see that I still think regardless of however you in increase his usage he needs to be aggressive and it can’t be empty usage he needs to start actually making the most of it I think the Cavs they’ve been too afraid of letting Moy fail as an offensive player I think he needs to have the freedom to try things and it’s okay if he fails he’s become so robotic with the ball you already know he’s going to stick to whatever the play design is he’s just gonna kind of run through the motions you need him to have the freedom to break away from it and try to create something on its own on his own whether it’s a shot or creating a play for someone else he should be able to trust his instincts a stat that I pulled Moy as a rookie he had four games where he attempted 20 or more field goals since then in the full two seasons since then he’s had three of those games uh and one of them was in the playoffs so you need to see more of that like Moy should be able to have games where he scores 25 30 points and the Cavs end up losing uh because every star player has moments like that in their development the Cavs are so afraid of letting Moy shoot the ball because they’re they’re trying to win a bunch of regular season games and I get it but if you’re gonna make yourself a competitor in the playoffs you need to start testing the guy who is gonna be your franchise Cornerstone alongside Donovan Mitchell so it’s time to take the training wheels off you got to allow him to get some scuffs and bruises and let Moi work through some things rather than being so safeguarded yeah I was just about say that you know I kind of want to defend the Cavs a little bit on this standpoint only because when they drafted him they immediately became a winning team yeah and when that happens and you have a young player who you draft super high I mean third overall pick super high of the draft and you immediately start winning it’s difficult to allow him to just do things on the court and see where it goes you can do that with K Cunningham you can do that with Jaylen green I think Jaylen GRE is perfect example of a player who’s you know failed and then the end of this season it just clicked you know what I mean so I kind of want to defend the Cav on on that front but it kind of goes back to what Q was saying earlier like now you just got to let him like you got to let him go out there do things that you may it may impact the win losses in the regular season but you’re going to be better forward going for it because now he knows what he can do and two things or three things on that right one I think it’s more difficult when that player is so Advanced defensively that like you need them on the floor but they’re not there yet offensively and it it becomes easier to ignore that player’s progress right because you’re worried about that and then you you want to bring in like a Donovan Mitchell to score you want to bring in you want to have Darius Garland score the ball more it just becomes something where it’s like easy to forget that okay he needs to develop as a big um scoring the ball another thing is I have a question of like where I am on Kobe Alman as a general manager I understand he’s done some good moves but the good moves he’ve made they’re not like these moves where I’m G to give the guy who made him a ton of credit you trade for Donovan Mitchell the trade for him was pretty stocked we knew Donovan Mitchell was good I don’t know how much credit you get for trading for Donovan Mitchell right um or like drafting Evan Mobley you could have messed that up but if you messed that up then you look like an idiot right like it’s not like a a you went and found the guy from overseas like I’m not trying to diminish any credit he gets but then when you look at that and you look at some of the moves the Cs have constantly been trying to fix problems but creating more problems by fixing some of these problems um like you bring in Carris Levert because you don’t have enough guys who can dribble pass and shoot on the original version of this team without downan Mitchell right so Carris lever was brought into be the second score D In fairness to Kobe In fairness to Kobe the Lori market and trade was a good trade true that’s true right so you get but here here’s the thing trade was good too you add him in the Utah trade for Donovan Mitchell which maybe you just had to do that right like that I don’t know where that where negotiations were we’ll find out when somebody writes a book one day but you put Lori in that trade and you’ve had this hole at Wing ever since that you have tried to fill with questionable characters like after questionable character like it’s it it’ be one thing is like I understand you’re not going to get a a at the quality of of L markeing and it’s kind of like ingenious that JB had the idea to even put him there to begin with which is why I don’t think JB is a terrible coach like I do think he has good ideas um but it’s also like okay so you move on from that and it’s like man all right we need to find a suitable wing and we’re like okay we’re gonna put Carris out there for like we started Carris the whole season I believe like for a period of time at the wing like we settled on starting Caris or like it’s like okay put out there or putting Lavar there like it was just like all these kind of like why are we why are we putting this guy who would probably be somebody’s eighth or ninth guy in rotation in position to start as our wing so not only is this guy not like that good to begin with they’re playing out of position which is even weirder right and maybe that’s a JB thing right maybe JB just was was really weird about the wing position but I have to imagine Kobe has something to do with that Kobe’s got to take some heat for it I think this season this summer is very maker break for Kobe I think I you’re his legacy is on the line his career his Co his job is on the line this summer because if he blows it like last year make you could you could look at Nang that was clearly he whiffed uh bringing in Tai Jerome looky gets injured right away so you can kind of say oh can’t can’t predict that streu was your big signing of the summer and it didn’t pan out the way you wanted it to he’s got to make some moves this summer that improved the team you gota we got we have to be able to look back on it and be like that was a really good move by Kobe if he drops the ball again or just stays lateral it’s getting hard to defend him I like I think he’s made some good I’m glad you said that glad you said that Tony because I want to say something there’s no such thing as lateral moves it’s not okay it’s not a real thing when he said that there were moves that he could have made to improve this roster the Dallas Mavericks are the perfect example of this oh yeah they killed it there there’s no such thing as lateral moves no such thing he’s had opportunities to improve this roster and make the Cavs a more serious Contender he has not made them has not made that’s fair look I know we focus on a lot of stuff that’s happened recently with Kobe all man we watching the finals right now and look it wasn’t his fault Kyrie got traded might have been one of the worst trade returns I’ve ever seen in my life loser in that one I I don’t put that I don’t put that on him he chose to draft P ston like that I put on him he had this obsession with this is the thing too some of the stuff people tell me oh he just fell into this this is why he has this small back I’m like he has made Moves every step of the way to be like no I want two guys in the back court like jam CJ because he did this with uh kyin ston and then Darius Garland Darius gar finally hit a couple years later and he’s like you know who I’m bringing in Donovan Mitchell another 63 guard he’s allergic to players who are 67 basically I’m like a gap why do you want to recreate Damon he also tried for Isaiah Thomas in that move like he loves these undersized guys it’s it just baffles me like why we continue to do this and it’s like and so we got look at C like hey bro there’s a there’s a track record here that points to him not being the man who’s gonna figure out these roster fits because yeah some of this is because this is who he got his hands on but he’s choosing this sometimes and that is the more concerning part with me with Kobe is like we’re asking him to F fix things that I don’t think he sees as a problem yeah yeah that that’s kind of what it sounded like in his end of the season interview although I think I I said this on the last episode I think it’s a little bit of two things I think yes I think Kobe believes in this core but I also think it’s a little bit of P talk where he can’t just come out and say that he’s trading anybody uh now he really might not trade anybody I wouldn’t be surprised if he if he didn’t uh I’m still just so up in the air I I can’t make up my mind the main thing is like trying to find the package that’s like that the one I want if there was if there was something available like that then I’d be like yeah make a trade but also yeah he drafted Isaac a Coro to be a wing at six fo five me I’m not trying Coro as Co is but not trying to piss people off I’m not trying to do I I have I have contended for a very long time hey man we gotta not we got to stop pretending like he’s not six foot five and not very long right like he’s actually a two but how many six foot five guys or or tall guys who don’t play tall are we gonna have play the wing for the Cavs before we realize this is just what Kobe Alman wants it doesn’t work man you might be H to something yeah wait he had Isaac a Coro playing power forward in the playoffs against remember when he remember in 2021 when he tried to get Larry Nance on the wing oh he’s been a sicko with the big lineups we had th maker javil McGee Andre Drummond and Larry Nance out there at one point clearly there’s some things that he’s been trying to experiment with so listen if they if they draft a player who is shorter than six foot six if they keep this pick I’m gonna lose my mind there’s I don’t care you’re at 20 at that point you can take a chance on any guy who’s above six foot s okay you don’t need to draft another guard I or a big the only reason you would draft a big is if you’re trading Jared Allen but yeah that’s just dra a wing please for the love of God Ronnie James doing it for three years Nothing But Wings Nothing But Wings this offseason I swear he don’t like them I he don’t like what have you ever heard the Cavs be connected to any of these Wings in a legitimate way like I just don’t think he likes them likeit just he just he he believes in Dean Wade man he just he’s got his guy he’s waiting for it to happen uh he he did draft Dylan wler and I I was a believer in wiler but uh was like 66 he was a Cabo right yeah he tried he they tried they were supposed to draft Kell Johnson that’s who they were supposed but hey man I’m just saying even some of these we tried to do this moments ain’t even that impressive to me I’m like damn like yo yo we could have did this Hit List ain’t harder than Kellin Johnson like hey you know what I think I found I think I found the cause I think I found the cause okay why he don’t why he don’t draft wings no more Craig Porter Jr not Craig Porter Jr Kevin Porter J oh yeah what Kevin Porter got to do with this though he was just just a jerk he had the worst experience of his life Kevin J tell me he mad at Kevin Porter LeBron so he don’t want wings anymore they’ve caused him nothing but stress nothing but stress it’s nuts y’all talk about Tristan Thomson playing point guard wait till he get Tristan Thomson out there on that Wing okay all light go cook man what you talking about spot up and shoot them threes Tristan you can be Draymond but that is the one think we do have to point to like when we criticize the Cavs because you brought up the Warriors I do think the warriors death lineup is something that they’re trying to go after as an undiz team that can shoot the ball well have players that can shoot the ball they can’t shoot the ball collectively well consistently but they have guys who can shoot the ball um and the thing is yes Andre Iguodala was there and there is nobody on this team that is remotely like Andre Iguodala like my big thing with the Cavs lineups is okay it’s I don’t really care where you have guys at what position at Jaylen r always says his position is positions were created so novices could follow the game it’s about roles and who could feel those roles and the biggest issue that I have with the Cavs is it legitimately feels like Donovan Mitchell is the strongest player on the court a lot of the times like if I need a rebound to happen it’s like man I think Donovan’s gonna have the best shot at musling out that rebound at times and like it’s not even hyperbole like it’s actually happened in NBA games where Donovan has to come from outside the scrummage get the rebound and keep the game going right like that’s the issue is that they don’t have a lot of strength out there and look you’re not going to have you’re not going to be the strongest lineup when your bigs are Evan and um Jared Allen just not super strong guys which is fine you do need strength at the wing though if that’s how you’re gonna roll and they just don’t have any of that like they don’t have any of that at the wing like you look at those Warriors scenes they had David West and mo Spates coming off the bench like where is the strength that they can inject in this lineup to get them through some spurts where teams are being physical think people confuse that with being soft we’ve went through that whole thing with the Cavs oh they’re soft no they’re just not that strong like that’s just what it is like teams that are going to play some strength are going to be able to move them because they’re not that big they’re not that strong um and that’s the thing that I’m like I’m interested to see if they really make an attempt to kind of add to the team because the lack of strength is something I’m like man you really had an opportunity here with the Celtics out well Robert Williams been out forever um but basically down to out Horford as their only big that they can really use and Luke L was it Luke cornette is that his name Luke cornette Luke cornette yeah they were down to those two guys if you had some stronger lineups you can throw out there at them you could have really moved them off the ball and and really clear some space for Donovan Mitchell when Donovan got hurt but for darus Garland get some easier buckets like or Evan Moy or whoever that you wanted but you just don’t have to strengthen any of your lineups like you gotta bring in Marcus Morris and Tristan Thompson to create that strength and like no no disrespect to Tristan but Tristan declined in 2018 it is 2024 we were done with Tristan Thompson starting basketball games in 2018 like 2024 he’s been a pivotal part of your team out side of like locker room stuff like he should not be in your playoff rotation that’s a bad like he won the championship with the Lakers Cole did he play I don’t know what number he wore he wasn’t on the Lakers when they won he wasn’t no he was there the year he was there for the Conference Finals run okay did he even play in that Western Conference Finals run he got in for like that one game where he was I remember right seeing a Kardashian kid in a in a Lakers jersey and everybody was like whose jersey is she wearing and everyone was like I think that’s Tristan but nobody could confirm what number he wore yeah yeah Jr Jr was the one who who won yeah yeah yes Jr’s the one who won the by the way shout out Jr and Dion okay we my third favorite Cavalier of all time off this yeah hey I was on waiters Island too you know what my first NBA game that I ever went to was Deion waiters debut so hey look man forget he went Toe to Toe with Tim Hardaway in that rookie sophomore game and we thought it was GNA be there right oh man that was a breakout moment remember after his rookie year there was a video of him riding a bike through his hood in Syracuse and he was like you know what man it’s time for me to stop playing I need to take over the league and I knew that that was all kind of messy because Kyrie is the best player on this team like waiters tried tried his best to take over the league I’ll give him credit there there was never a moment where Deon Waiters didn’t think he could take over the only player to stand on top of the heat scoring table in a Miami Heat jersey and tell the way waade this this mine how can you not love a character like that you have to man you got to respect it the ultimate confence what’s quote about shooting if I miss a 100 shot I’m shoot a 100 Mo he had something i’ rather go over for 28 than over for eight or something like that’s the confidence we need Mo to have honestly a little bit Dion Waiters get a job as a coach right right now like some of that confidence he gonna have Evan doing crazy [ __ ] absolutely remember his voice over in 2K4 where he just like did not D real bad real bad hey Dion Waiters is on my list of like most hilarious basketball players that I love you gota be out there him Lance Stevenson I saw a montage of Lance the other day that my be hilarious player Lance Lance is easily funniest NBA player wait wait we got to go to like Lance the the rip off version of Lance Stevenson DeShawn Stevenson where tattoo on his neck just wasn’t just wasn’t funny he he was irritant like he’s irr he was hilarious to me because he was like dead serious about trying to be this to LeBron like like remember I think Stanley Johnson is another one because Stanley Johnson was like yeah I locked him down in that Series where they got swept and like LeBron had 3288 and like it’s the first round so you know LeBron wasn’t really working that hard it the NBA in basketball in general has this ability to give us hilarious players and I feel like we be so deep into the stat sheets that we don’t take the time to appreciate hilariousness honestly should really appreciate Carl Anthony TOS more like the way I love some of these hilarious guys because like if I like waiters why can’t I appreciate Carl TOS going 0 for nine you know like May I’m rethinking my my my STS on Carl TOS like maybe I’ve been looking at this the wrong way because how do you work cat into any NBA Discord I be NFL convers we have to do a cat ban on the PT now no we were this close Cove we were this close I was ready to give up give it up I was ready and then he went 0 for nine yeah he he blew had a point in two quarters I’m like Dam reputation he got a one missed what is going on I do this every time give y’all the whole q and cve experience hey man it was great it was great this was this is one of the most fun episodes we’ve done I think uh and with that being said that is all for this episode of what’s next uh thank you both of you for joining the show honestly it was it was such a blast uh I want to thank everyone for watching or listening if you enjoy this content please hit subscribe drop a like I’ll have more episodes of what’s next coming soon with different guest appearances from a few other Cavs creators out there um and I do a weekly recap of Cavs news on the junkyard pod so if you like the channel help us out by hitting subscribe and I will have links in the description to all of that as well as the link to q and C if you’ve enjoyed them so please go check them out and go Cavs

Q n Colb join The Junkyard Pod gto discuss what comes next for Cleveland Cavaliers cornerstone Evan Mobley!

– Recap Mobley’s season
– Mobley’s Playoff breakout
– Does Mobley deserve the max?
– How can the Cavs get the most out of Mobley?

Check out Q n Colb!
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/ @QnColb
Quincy: https://x.com/Kwen_C
Colb: https://x.com/___Colb___

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