Breaking down the Indiana Pacers’ draft picks, free agent targets | From Way Downtown Pacers Podcast
hello welcome to the uh Indie stars from way downtown Pacers podcast I am Pacers editor Nat new here with our Insider Dustin Dak uh been a busy uh week I don’t know that anything that’s happened or is going to happen will have an enormous impact on the team if things go as we expect um but hey we can always be wrong and hope that they uh do something crazy so uh we’ll start with the draft no first round pick um um and we you know they sort of went against the grain of what we thought they might do with their first pick um but just give us your quick thoughts on on how the draft went for the Pacers yeah know I mean I think they did in the sense that um we just didn’t think Johnny Fury was gonna be on the board uh you know that just wasn’t he he C like it seemed like they you know obviously they were doing their due diligence um and and this is certainly a a testament to that that you have to be ready for what shows up and basically have to decide um whether if somebody slips you know they’re worth what you want they obviously prepped as if um you know hey it’s probably going to be we’re probably gonna be looking at a bunch of four four and five year guys um you know that are that don’t necessarily have high ceilings but maybe have high floors you know let’s go after competitive guys that we can trust High basketball IQ a lot of experience that have done some winning that have accomplishing things um and sort of see who fits out of that group um but for slip to them obviously was a guy that was in The Green Room that everybody expected to be a top 25 pick for the most part um and they had done enough due diligence to say you know what he does fit what we want I mean he’s probably not going to be able to play immediately um but you know he’s a guy that has the sort of upside that fits I mean I thought you know a few things that were um interesting the Chad Buchanan mentioned but I think you you could also see looking at kind of his highlights and his shot profile um is a guy he’s a guy that moves without the ball pretty well um you know I think uh I checked out there’s a site called hoop math.com that sort of like kind of breaks down you know by uh it’s not super detailed but it’s it’s basically would you shoot at The Rim would you shoot from mid-range would you shoot from three um and he made about 80% of his shots at the rim and 75% of those were assisted so what that tells you obviously is he’s moving without the ball it’s not a scenario where he’s getting to the rim off the bounce a whole lot uh but he’s moving in such a way that guys can find him uh for easy buckets and obviously that man he was playing within obviously with a group of pretty established guys at Kansas I mean he certainly wasn’t the top option when you’re talk about you know Hunter Dickinson and Kevin mcculler and and you know uh it’s a Dewan Harris and there’s a guy I’m forgetting um but you know some really talented guys over at Kansas um and he is obviously was a priority as as kind of a blue trip chip freshman but not the guy and so he learned to kind of play Within that system you know get his shots where they came to him um and you know just had a pretty productive offensive season was was uh all Big 12 all rookie or Big 12 all rookie um and so you know I think Chad mentioned he sees a really good fit there in terms of how he’s able to move without the ball likes how he offensive rebounds also um you know talented kids 69ine obviously has to put some muscle on um you know I think Chad did a pretty good job of sort of uh keeping expectations low in terms of how much he’s going to play obviously they had a hard time of getting a lottery pick uh you know any minutes last year so certainly a guy who’s picked at 36 is not going to have a clear shot to anything but seemed to make it pretty clear that hey this is a guy that’s going to be developmental probably not going to get a whole bunch of minutes probably you know he didn’t say it but uh the indication I think was pretty clear that he’s going to get some mad an time whether he’s going to get a two-way contract or not it sounds like he wouldn’t it sounds like he’s going to get a full-time deal but simply be asked uh to spend some time with the matad ants um but it seems like that’s where he’s going to get a lot of minutes and a lot of development time this year as far as beyond that you know Tristan Newton and Enrique Freeman you know those guys obviously sort of fit uh what you thought they were for what you know both of those are fiveyear guys obviously Tristan Newton was most outsanding player of the tournament he’s the first team All-American um you know again not a super high ceiling guy doesn’t shoot the ball super well athleticism is just okay but is a winner uh you know obviously trist newon there just so many little things well um for that Connecticut team that won the championship and you just you you just imagine he’s gonna be a rick Carlo guy um you know just on the basis of what he was able to do uh for them you know he just he just seems like the sort of guy that that Rick’s going to be super thrilled about his ability to defend create rebound for guard play bigger than he is um is is going to be helpful and obviously I think when you’re looking for somebody who’s not going to get a clear uh spot to a rotation he’s a guy that can play you know two three positions I you can really play anywhere from one to three uh if you need him in a pinch and so you know I I don’t know that he’s gonna have much of an opportunity to even compete for a rotation spot but someone’s going to get hurt for at least a little bit you know even if they’re really lucky uh as far as injuries are concerned this year you know you’re going to have you know guys get an ankle tweak you know guys get uh you know guys get sick for a few games uh you know that stuff happens over the course of the season and having guy like Newton who can step in at a bunch of positions uh behind them is is really really helpful Freeman’s obviously an interesting story a guy who you know you can’t even call him a walk- on because I mean he like it’s not like he was a preferred walk-on like he went to campus you know somebody had to tell him hey you should probably try out um and he made the team that way and ended up being three time all Mac four-time Mack all defense ma Mac player of the year and the nation’s leading rebounder uh this year so you have to think there’s a spot for him if Jaylen Smith does in fact uh decline as player option that’s been reported but we haven’t been able to confirm that um at at this point you know if if Smith does ultimately move on uh there is some space behind Isaiah Jackson who’s obviously foul prone uh to get some minutes at the five so I guess um you know those two picks weren’t surprising in and of themselves but it was a little bit surprising that they made three picks uh that they ultimately didn’t try to either a trade one of those away sell them or go stash you know get somebody from overseas that you could stash someplace you know all these guys you know are are American you know American college players you know it’s not as easy to ship them somewhere um and so ultimately these are guys they’re gonna have to they’re gonna have to find roster space for between um the main roster and the two-ways and so you know it I was a little bit surprised that they filled all those spots um but they did fill all you know all those spots with guys could help them yeah the one thing I always think about during the draft process is when you look at the the probabilities outside the top 10 everything is a coin flip second round picks in the last 10 years the two best players picked at 36 are herb Jones and Xavier Tillman herb Jones obviously a very useful NBA player Xavier kman a useful NBA player now I’m o cherry picking my to my 10 years there because 11 years ago Draymond Green was taken with that pick um but basically there’s a 20% chance that these guys amount to anything and then on top of that what’s the odds that they amount to something with the team that drafted them um so I think people get all excited about this and thank God they do because then they come to us and they read the story so we like that exactly um but the idea that these guys are going to have an impact I mean is a long shot the other interesting thing to me is like I an anonio Davis was obviously a great second round pick by the Pacers a 100 years ago I’m not sure before Andrew nart they had had another second round pick amount to anything um I did I did some research on this a while back and I can’t remember it all now but I remember them being one of the worst franchises when it came to capitalizing on second round picks um you did the story on how they ended up with n hard and it seemed like they sort of revamped everything they’re doing and maybe they have a better idea of how to find players um in the second round I’m certainly not um saying these three players will not amount to anything the odds say they they won’t but that’s you know but but then you get a surprise and that’s great I thought it was interesting that they brought Fury in without having seen him at all at the same time I’m sure if they reached out to him he probably would have turned them down because he expect to go that low so I’m not that’s not criticism of the Pacers for not having seen him it’s just interesting that they would do that and as you said they certainly had plenty of uh uh they did their their due Ence and and heck I mean I just got done saying second round picks aren’t always worth that much if you think there’s a chance that you get a guy who’s a top 25 pick at 36 then what’s the risk you take him and you go from there um you know I think Newton’s interesting because I thought they could have used a point guard I mean when jerus Walker is playing point guard for you in uh in garbage time you probably need a fourth guy um they didn’t want to play Isaiah Wong in that spot for some reason I’m not sure why um and then uh Freeman’s a great story Greg Doyle our columnist has a great story on him um currently posted on nar.com about how uh um there’s a Pacers tie is the reason that uh he is now uh in the NBA um so that’s definitely worth uh reading but yeah he he grew four inches late um and they the coaching staff at akan had to like beg him to come try out for the team so as you said this is not like your typical this is a true walk- on as in he W you know no he wasn’t there to play basketball and they said hey why don’t you give it a try yeah so so I think you gotta be I mean again you know Fury also it seems like fits the the you know he’s an athletic guy as you noted versatile offensively so it seems like he could fit um but but if any of these three guys is playing significant minutes something probably went wrong for the Pacers in yeah this year yes this year certainly I mean I think to your point it you know like second round who makes it who doesn’t it’s just so much about opportunity um you know and you know a lot of these cases you’re not you don’t even really want to bring your second round pick on like you don’t even have roster space and obviously last year uh the Pacers trade had to trade down um you know uh Kevin Pritchard told us way back in January like pretty much unprompted um you know after the right after the Miles Turner signing we were just kind of you know doing some sort of stateof the Union discussion with him um and you know they had five picks at the time he’s like well you can’t pick five guys like we’re not going to pick Five Guys um and I don’t know if he laid too many cards out on the table at that point and made it harder to move um but ultimately I mean they did some trading back and like you know they picked Mojave King at at at you know uh at 40 and I don’t know where Mojave King is so you know I mean he he came back he was on the matad ANS roster for a little bit so I know he was in town so I don’t I don’t know what his next uh you know place is but obviously he was taken um he he had a pretty good combine um you know did did some good testing up there you know I think they like some some things that he did uh at his workout but ultimately he was taking over some other guys because they knew they didn’t actually have to bring him um you know basically they could find some else other place to put him without using you know one of the two-way contracts uh and and without you know actually putting him on the roster so you know that’s a lot of time what you run into with second round guys is you just never really get a chance um so maybe based on how they’re being picked the scenario they’re in maybe they get a better opportunity you know certainly uh you know Newton’s case just his versatility um you know might give him a chance you know if if there’s an injury if or or if if for whatever reason they part ways uh you know with one of those guards you know um there could be an opportunity for him to step up you know maybe if there’s minutes at the five uh for Enrique Freeman maybe he has to step in there and do something um I feel like there’s probably a lot of these guys that can do a job uh they get picked in the second round they just never get a chance because there’s just not uh the opportunity for them obviously you saw last season uh you know local tie you know Trace Jackson Davis there was a spot for him on the Warriors and he made a huge impact so I mean he’s practically you know like they treated him like a first round pick and so he got an opportunity and you know he’ll stick for at least a while um you know maybe they’ll maybe they’ll eventually draft over him um but you know next season in the season’s going in the immediate Seasons going forward you know he’s going to be a rotation guy for them so um you know you obviously can can can find very accomplished guys thought something Brad Stevens pointed out um in his press he had a press conference earlier this week when he was you talking about how um there are guys who aren’t in certain drafts because you know they’re sticking around for the Anil money I me you’re ultimately getting more than a two-way to stay in school but what that means is then the next year those guys are available and ultimately you’re you’re the guys that are around in the second round are a more experienced group guys that have won um you know guys that ultimately said okay I could stick I could leave now and go in the second round and get a two-way contract and just get out of here and start making money or like now I can keep making money in college and they’re more game ready you know when they come out you know four four years you four years in might give them a better chance to stick long term so we’ll see how that goes if if that ultimately changes the level of success that you get out of second round picks and it’s altogether possible that you do it’s always fascinating me and that I believe there is 20 25 guys I’m just making the number up whatever it is who are basically indistinguishable from one another these are people who are paid you know the scouts the teams are paid to know who can play and who can’t and out of that group of whatever it is 2025 whatever one of them’s gonna end up being a really good NBA player there’s probably two or three more that’ll have an NBA career there’s probably a handful more that will have Pro careers and nobody knows they literally can bring them in and say do exactly this and still nobody knows who those guys are going to be it’s always fascinating me about just how narrow the margins and it’s like and somewhat true it’s it’s like with Trace Jackson Davis you got to get in the right spot if he goes to another team maybe he’s you know maybe you know maybe he’s not looking like a a uh NBA uh you know you know a solid NBA player someone who’s gotta you know he’s gonna have to scrap and Claw and scratch to get a spot he doesn’t have to do that um so it’s always fascinated me about that it’s an opportunity it’s an opportunity League it really is I think even I was talking to John halberton about about just stuff in general he said you know like it’s an opportunity leag um and it’s just there there are like some guys who never get a shot um that that can hang athletically physically all those kinds of things it’s just opportunity when you get past there’s a certain amount of guys that obviously were going to get their opportunity no matter what that that are going to be stars that are this that higher Echelon um but kind of in the middle there you know in terms of who gets to be a really good role player um or or who gets to stick as you know maybe a second unit point guard like a lot of guys can do it it’s just you know like who gets a shot and who gets an opportunity to really develop uh and who doesn’t and just so much of it is about opportunity you know like getting on a team that needs you getting on a team that that you know is bad enough to let you develop um or or any number of those things you just never know what ultimately leads you know when you look at that kind of big mass in terms of media and NBA Talent the difference between who makes it and who doesn’t sometimes isn’t even up to the guy sometimes it is sometimes it isn’t so but it’s a lot about opportunity and chance uh you mentioned Jaylen Smith uh will’ll touch base on him as a lead into free agency um Michael Scot who uh works for Hoops height which is also owned by ganette as is indie star is reporting that he is going to decline the Pacers option you have not been able to confirm that yet nope it does mean it’s it’s doesn’t mean it’s not true it’s probably true almost certainly um but that’s where we’re at with that um if he does decline the option I mean I think that’s what’s best for the Pacers I think it’s also what’s best for Jaylen Smith um but what what are your thoughts on what’s next with Jaylen Smith since he’s fall sure yeah I mean again that’s really up in the air like this isn’t one where like you know um obviously certain guys report it you know it’s you know and I’m not casting as spion certainly Michael but you know um like there are you know in some cases you could say well that that must be the case but don’t know you know just talk talking to sources don’t have anything confirmed on that um you know no like people that have gotten back to me have not been able to confirm it um so so kind of waiting uh you know wait to see on that one but yeah obviously after the playoffs um you know he just he didn’t get a lot of playing time he’s certainly been locked into this back and forth with Isaiah Jackson for most of the last two seasons at the five obviously he’s had a few opportuni at the four um was you know anointed starting power forward going in uh to last season after he signed uh his three-year extension with this player option um and then this year when they kind of decided to really focus more on defense he he moved from backup center to power forward as they were kind of putting some emphasis on having size in the starting lineup and then when they they acquired Pascal se yakum he was back to the bench so um you know he had ultimately a really efficient year I mean he shot you know a Touch under 60% from the field uh 42.4% from three even though he kind of dragged toward the end of the year he was absurdly on fire uh to start the beginning of the Season obviously wasn’t shooting at high volumes but was at like 70% in like December uh or early January if I recall correctly and um but you know just for whatever reason just didn’t get much done in the playoffs especially game one against the bucks he was like minus 13 and 13 minutes just wasn’t doing a lot right and then didn’t get a lot of opportunities after that um they went more with Isaiah Jackson for kind of the energy obviously you’ve seen Smith be able to rebound and shoot the ball it’s he’s the the more skilled option between Smith and Jackson but Jackson has the more raw athleticism obviously is getting up there and finishing uh you know finishing lobs blocking shots they both grabbed rebounds pretty well um you know for backup fives but um you know just for whatever reason Jackson showed a lot more in the playoffs and so you’d have to think he’s kind of ahead of the game uh you know going into next season if they were going to both be there and if you’re Jaylen Smith you have to look around and say well there’s got to be a better option uh there there’s got to be a place where I’ve got a more uh a cleaner path uh to being a backup center and and having those minutes you know regularly um so you could obviously see a lot of reason why he’d want to walk um and you know kind of test the waters elsewhere I imagine there’s a lot of people that are willing to pay um you know seven or you know eight figure eight figures a year uh to get you know somebody like Jaylen Smith is their backup center and even a handful of places that wouldn’t mind having them as a starter um probably not as many of those um but you’d have to think there’s more of a place for him in a place where he get paid better so it would be the sensible option if he does it again don’t know for sure that he has yeah you got to think I think it was 5.4 million something like that that was the player option for the Pacers even if he’s giving away a little bit of that money for a chance to get you know to know he’s gonna play you gotta I mean I get it I mean I you got to understand why he might do that and as you know he could easily be getting more um than his player option and and just to be clear the Pacers would be better with Jaylen Smith because he’s a talented player he’s your third string Center you’re in a pretty good spot at center with that sure but F they probably could use the 5.4 millions and the roster Spot somewhere else more than that because Isaiah Jackson has proven that he can play it um you know the uh and then even Beyond Isaiah Jackson you’ve got sheway you’ve got uh you know you just took Enrique Freeman who’s under size but he can play center Obi toppen showed that he can play center he’s a restricted free agent you assume he’s coming back we don’t know that for sure he can play center um even SE yakum can play some small lineup Center it just seems like in terms of the resources uh Jaylen Smith the the Pacers are better without him than with him um but again that’s no reflection on him as a player he posted a story today on uh free agents the patients were uh could could Target um we were texting about this in which I don’t think they if I’m a free agent I don’t know if I who has been an NBA regular I don’t know that I would come to the Pacers without a serious you know without getting more money than I can get anywhere else just because I don’t think there a lot of playing time um but just sort of but then the flip side is do we want to put out a list of free possible free agents with with five names nobody’s ever heard of before so where do you what do you think is realistic for the Pacers and free agency this season yeah know me again just to to go over their cap situation uh you know they’re over the cap even before you get into Obi toppen and Jaylen Smith obviously because you know Tyrus Halle Burton’s um you know Mega Max Max contract kicks in um you know SE yakum obviously you know uh is intends to sign his so both of those guys will be making 30% of the cap which is 42.3 million each um so I think that puts them at 84.6 between the two of them and so again that’s that’s 60% of of the weight to 141 which is the salary cap so then you’ve got Miles Turner you know a tick under 20 um you’ve got Aaron n Smith’s three-year contract extension kicks in at 11 uh McConnell if he’s fully guaranteed which I think uh will you know presumably happen today um I think if he’s still on the roster after today that I think that automatically kicks um and obviously there’s a possibility that he signs something more lucrative uh you know more of an extension there um then that uh you know adds on a little bit more than that I mean he would be at 9.3 even if um and then you tack on just sort of all the rookie scales you know obviously Benedict maans and jarus Walkers are high because they were top 10 picks um you know still have Andrew neard in there um I’m trying to think you know obviously Isaiah Jackson somewhere around 4.4 um so you you tack all those together it’s about 149 um before you even get into Obie toppen and Jaylen Smith so what that means is you can’t just sign some somebody for anything they do have the they they do have the non they qualify for the non- taxpayer midlevel exception um so that doesn’t count against them in the cap um and they can they can you know pay somebody up to 12.8 million a year 12.8 something um you know there’s a few other uh numbers you know within those commas there um and so they um so they they can go at somebody at a midlevel you know rotation Fringe starter caliber guy uh you know more or less and you obviously not you can’t really swing big um in that case but there’s a handful of guys that are worth looking at um again they don’t have clear paths um you know to your point to a starting uh job I mean they can beat somebody out obviously what you’re you know really if you’re a wing you’re saying I’m you know I’m signing on and trusting myself that I could beat out Ben Shepard um and you know that’s not a sure thing at all but you know there are certain guys you have to look at yourself and say well you know I I trust myself to win that job you know I I looked the guys that I mentioned um the five players that I mentioned were um DeAnthony Melton um Gordon Hayward um Royce O’Neal Eric Gordon and Malik Beasley and so any of those guys obviously don’t know who’s you know Gordon hayward’s obviously gonna have to take a massive pay cut but I think he knows he does after what H happened in Oklahoma Oklahoma City I mean he just barely played in the playoffs at all he took I think three shots in the in the the entirety of the postseason and that’s a guy that was getting paid 33 million I think he’s fully aware that he’s not getting $33 million from anybody um but you know he’s obviously a local guy you could see an opportunity to to bring in another big Wing that certainly seems to be what everybody wants um even though you know again Aaron neith is still on the team benedi matheran still on the team uh you know if they bring back Obie toppen you know he’s still on the team and jarus Walker also um but you know that he’d be an option Royce O’Neil obviously is a is a you know reliable Defender um you know Malik Beasley is a movement shooter and they could maybe use that out to have it traded away buddy healed uh you know those guys do have a chance uh to play themselves into um you know bunch of those guys can beat out bench effort or at least should have a chance at least at least should be looked at uh and and you know given the opportunity to do so and so no guarantee that they’re going to try to do that or the Pacers even want to put somebody in the position to try to do that but if they do um you know you could see why somebody would say okay you know I trust myself enough uh to win that job and I will take 12 million to do it um so you know I I could see them looking into guys at that caliber and picking somebody out doesn’t mean that they they definitely will um and again Chad Buchan has given a lot of indication that he’s willing to run it back with this group um but uh those would be some options some Avenues they could take and there’s there’s others certainly you know if if Jaylen you know declines this player option then there could be some other fives you could look at there’s not as many of those I don’t think um but you know they can look in a bunch of different directions uh in in that case with that level uh of flexibility they don’t have a lot but they do have that yeah just to go over it real quick obviously Halbert and McConnell neard are point guards obviously nard plays a lot of uh two guard if there is such a thing anymore uh Shephard Maan nay Smith or other wings uh seak toppen Turner uh Jackson that’s 10 players right there that doesn’t include jerus Walker um now we’re at 11 no one’s playing 11 guys so anyone you bring in you know would you know again there could be an injury there could be any number of things sure um but it just doesn’t see I mean if I’m a free agent I’m looking at that roster and not thinking I mean who Am I who am I beating out from this team that just made the the Eastern Conference Finals all that being said of the guys that you listed anyone in particular you really like more than the others or fit think fits best or anything along those lines yeah I mean um you know Melton and O’Neal I think are two of the ones that I find the most interesting um you know I think uh Melton’s a guy who plays a little bit bigger is is a kind of pretty trustworthy Defender because he’s got a six six eight and a half wing span so he can get out there and guard twos and threes and and you like him on the ball uh and he’s a pretty good you know catch and shoot guy you’ve seen him kind of burn the paces on a couple occasions when he’s been able to you know certainly in that case there’s a lot of gravity on that team between Maxi uh and embiid but he’s been able to kind of you know sit out there and be one of those guys that embiid finds uh for three but obviously he had some issues he was going through there was a reason why they still felt the need to require but healed um so he’s a nice player but like just in terms of making up for the three-pointers uh lost in that deal you can’t expect for him to step in and be what but he was um you know and Neil just gives you some grit some toughness just just have a guy another guy out there uh that’s a a wing Defender option um you know that that’s you know in the a little bit in the nouth mold um nouth got a little bit more upside I think a little bit more ability to get to the rim uh you know might be a touch better NE nouth I think has more capacity to be a good shooter obviously O’Neal I think is 31 I want to say um and so I think n Smith has some room to grow as a as an offensive player and when he also probably is what he is um but you know the grip the muscle you know like that’s that’s still nice to have as much as again this is still not a very good defensive team and so even though there’s not necessarily a clear place for him to plug and play um just adding options adding guys that can be defensive weapons uh it’s not necessarily a bad idea if they play their way into a rotation spot they play their way into a rotation spot um so I think you know those guys would be worth looking at it does seem like O’Neal might sign uh an extension with the Suns so that he might not be easy to pry away those are numbers that stood out at me I mean like they get Eric Gordon for cheap um you know I don’t know they need him necessarily but you know obviously an Indiana guy um it’s still scoring he’s never you know he’s been in the league I think 16 years and he’s averaged double figures every year and you know he hits threes so can’t rule him out you know Beasley is not as good of a Defender but you know if they feel like they really needed a gravity movement three-point shooter he’s not a bad place to look either so uh you know all those guys are options again I’m sure there’s tons more than I’m not thinking of there’s probably some people that uh you know might be more willing to take a pay cut than I’m considering like a Gary Trent or somebody like that um but you know again they’re not necessarily I mean they’re not exactly necessary uh for the patients to go get yeah the only thing I thought that they might want is some kind of younger uh shooter who’s got other issues but I I I mean I don’t know that that guy I look at the free agent list I don’t think that guy exists um and probably because if you were younger and maybe a shooter uh you’re not going to become a free agent someone’s going to resign but uh right Luke Luke Canard is a guy that’s got a got a team option and that apparently that’s a big question mark over in Memphis as to whether or not they’re GNA keep him I mean like again like I don’t know if he’ll he’s making right around 14.1 million so he probably is gonna if if he’s let go like maybe he takes a step back but that’s no guarantee either um you know a pretty reliable three-pointer three-point shooter there so um you know that’s that’s a little bit on the younger side um but you again no no guarantee you’re GNA be able to keep him under that uh mid-level exception the other big news was the the Knicks trade um getting M bridges for five first round draft picks they also resigned OG an anobi at an enormous sum of money for a guy who only plays 50 games a year um obviously the Knicks are way better I think you would say the Knicks are better than the Pacers now I’ll be right up front with that in terms of everything else I’m going to say which um is more not critical but but more looking at this sort of Devil’s Advocate ways um at the same time I I don’t know that I’m as excited about this from the Nick standpoint as a lot of people are um number one you’re gonna have uh um diven senzo and uh Josh Hart coming off the bench I’m kind of curious how that goes after they were playing uh you know 50 minutes of 48 minute games um end of last season you have other other than Mitchell Robinson who’s also injury-prone you have no size um which I think or I shouldn’t say no size you you’re going to lose hartenstein because you can’t afford him anymore you don’t have they don’t have a clear big guy you know productive big guy after Mitchell Robinson which could be an issue um but you got aand is still on that team yeah is he a bit I mean I’m thinking more of a center he’s more of a uh I almost mentioned that but yeah certainly he’s he’s a he’s a guy in the middle but uh um where do you put them obviously they they added a significant amount of talent and you got to worry about that I mean do you think they’re the second best team in the East and um just where do you think they rank compared or the Pacers rank compared to the Knicks at this point yeah I mean I think um you have to say they are on paper um just because again like they you know they they they got to the Pacers you know got the Pacers to a game seven with you know basically without anobi for most of that Ser you know for most of that series after game two um you know without Randall and entirely um you know they had lost bonovich at that point um and so you almost have to you know like on paper you almost have to say that they are um and you know they still have some other pieces I really like you know M bride um you know and and maybe hard or whether you got when you got harder defense chinzo coming off the bench you’re like that’s really something the bench is a lot better will tiido play it is another question maybe they’ll play yeah maybe they won’t I mean like uh there were maybe he just plays the five best guys he’s got and it doesn’t matter who they are and who’s on the bench exactly and so if they would have like let Alec Burks actually play maybe they wouldn’t have found themselves in that position um because he’s not bad you know there’s a couple guys like Weir could get enough there wasn’t enough talk about that in my opinion now the other thing point you know going to what you say if nart does not make like a crazy shot at the end of game three the Pacers don’t win that series that literally came down to that sh I mean obviously comes down to a million things but he doesn’t make that shot they don’t win because they’re down three and they’re not even with everything the Knicks went through they’re not coming back from three 0 so no it was a massive shot was such a giant shot in a bad situation because like yeah you know halberton was cooked and he was just like oh my God just do something drew and and he did it I mean he just drove one um so yeah I think um you have to say on paper that you know that that they look better than the Pacers but again the Pacers got to the Eastern Conference Finals and they do have an additional as well you know with Benedict Ma and coming back um and you don’t know you know like I I was a little bit surprised for Buchanan to still volunteer the idea I I thought when he was asked uh if you’re willing to run it back that was kind of his way of just saying yeah sure in a way of saying anything could happen I’m committing nothing in any way shape or form when he said it the first time this time he kind of he volunteered it um so it is more of a driving force for their way of looking at this than I thought it seemed to me more like oh like yeah we’re comfortable with that but we’re also looking around you know we’re checking to see what’s available we’re making calls we’re you know if if something uh you know Falls in our lap we’re g to do it so I expected maybe a little bit more of him to say or at least indicate that there was a sense that the the ATI had been upped um a little bit when you you know again just the next becoming a more talented team and also um doing it in a way way that showed that they know how Boston won um basically to say all right like you know you need to be Wing heavy and you know you have to have their wings to counter their wings um basically to have guys you know really two-way guys that you can imagine them you know matching up uh against what Boston has you kind of have to set Boston as the St gold standard and say okay well what are you gonna do to beat them just think think about them and then everybody else will come come into place but like you’re not getting to the finals if you don’t beat them so what do you have to do to make that happen um so I thought that was like interesting on the next part but then the Pacers looking at it and saying you know they haven’t at least vocally come out and said okay well that means we have to go do this um but you know again at the same time like the Pacers aren’t out of that discussion like that doesn’t mean that the Pacers now cannot beat the Knicks in a in a you know best of seven series they ran it back uh you know with again you know with the Pacers healthy um you know with their guys back um and with the next guys back that doesn’t mean they can’t beat him doesn’t mean they can’t beat regular season game that doesn’t mean they can’t beat him in the best of seven series but if you’re just looking at you know who’s got more depth of Talent on paper right now I think you do have to go uh with the Knicks by by a little bit anyway um and you still have Milwaukee to worry about you know they’re still gonna have Giannis um you imagine basically I like like Philly is like the great unknown you know I mean like you you just have to imagine them just completely resetting themselves knowing that they’ll have you know Maxi and embiid as cornerstones um but you know we could be talking a week from now and looking at a tot different form of Philadelphia you know maybe they get a Paul George you know like maybe they they they get somebody else on a max deal um and you know it you end up getting three max contracts um and it’s not going to be a whole lot of flexibility but you know you might end up having that um you don’t know what they’re going to be with the rest of their pieces you know what they’re going to ultimately let walk and what they’re not but I mean there’s a lot of space there for the pce the 76 just to re uh invent themselves and we’ll see how they do it and you know again like we’re going to be considering Philadelphia in a totally different way a week from now than we do right now well interesting fact if the season started today Philadelphia would be in a lot of trouble because they only have three players and the track record of teams with three players in the NBA and no more is not good at all I mean leg they could threaten the despite as great as maxian embid are I think that would they win 10 games with only three players probably not you never check stat on that I’d like to see a print out that’s what references to how three man teams have done in the fiveman NBA the uh the other thing that this is uh Zack Lo has mentioned this at ESPN I think Brian wior hinted at it with the on the Pat McAfee show the other day the big thing to me is like the Pacers aren’t really getting where they need a they’re not quote unquote catching up to the Knicks or Celtics or whoever in free agency they’re not doing it with second round picks it’s going to be some kind if they’re GNA do that it would be some kind of trade and we touched on this last podcast they pieces to do it if Maan is not the guy that you need him to be he is a guy that you can build a trade around right and they’ve got plenty of other pieces I mean you know Walker’s a guy I I don’t want to see him trade Walker but they could but topen you could trade you know if you resign toppen he’d be an interesting trade piece they I think they’re just being really smart about this and saying we can go the best option right now just because the Avenues to improving themselves right now aren’t you know it’s just there’s not a lot of bang for your buck on that you start the season you let things play out for a bit and you see because even look back at last season I mean they were a really different team at the end than they were at the beginning and they were a better team than they were at the beginning um now again injuries happen maybe it hits the Pacers this time whatever but it just seems like they’re handling this um it just seems like they’re they’re handling this the right way in terms of just hey we don’t need to make every decision right now even though fan base every fan base wants that to be the case heck would love it if they’d make some big move because it’s a slow time and then we’d have something to write about that people would want to read about but that’s not the way they should go they have to uses to do to see how this plays out and in fact it’s probably not the smartest thing to do unless you get overwhelmed with an offer right now I mean they do have this you know the team building does not end with free agency no no I think I mean just the the first two guys you mentioned are really the the big key there is Walker and mathine and saying what do you really have you know and and like getting a real sense of it like what what do you think they can become and are they you know do you are you better keeping them are you better moving them you know like I think they’re valuable pieces either way you know like I I think they’re they’re going to be in a scenario where mid to end of this year there’ll still be valuable Assets in terms of if you want to move them um you know obviously like with mathine it’s not a case of Kenny play it’s a case of Kenny fit like you know can play you know you know he can score you know he has the athleticism you know he has the body you know he’s got to defend better but ultimately like you don’t look at him and say okay well there’s just a physical deficiency that he’s never going to um you know uh make up for you know again like defensive instincts need to be better but like you know this guy can put the ball in the bucket he’s a really good athlete and so you know again it’s a question of does he fit the way that these guys work do you have to put you know to really get the most out of him you have to put him in a position where he gets to ISO more and he gets to take the ball himself a lot more um and just really have the ball in his hands and and and be more of a driving force can he ever really be what he can be if you know you have halberton driving the train and the ball just finds him you know finds mathine from time to time is that um can you Maxim maximize his talent or not uh in that scenario and if you can’t uh like do you have a better chance of prying something away from somebody that would make you a lot better maybe make them a lot better um you know that’s a possibility I think you they still have to play that out I don’t think I don’t I don’t think um I think a lot of people might feel like the answer is clear at this point um not quite there yet and I again I just think he’s just so too talented a guy uh it’ just be really hard for me to walk away from Benedict Maan like yeah that’s yeah to be clear my point is not that we know whether Maan is that guy or not that exactly what you said he could be that guy and they’re gonna find out and and if he’s not that guy then it’s again like you say he’s still a talent um whatever else you want to say about him yes he’s got deficiencies but in a league where give a guy a ball give the guy the give a guy the ball and let him go get a basket is an important skill he’s that guy and they don’t have another guy like that not really um seak somewhat halberton somewhat but not like Maan so no no and that’s why why that’s why what exactly what I said why let’s find out you know two months into the season three months into the season trade deadline they’ll knew they’ll know way more about where they’re at and and heck we didn’t they didn’t make the they weren’t out of the playing game until the last day of the season and then they make the EAS Conference Finals so um it’s just going to be wild to watch now I can go the other way too someone gets hurt or they or maybe all these you know maybe um Giannis is healthy and embiid is healthy and the Knicks are way better and all of a sudden you know you’re the Orlando is much better all of a sudden you are the team in the East or the eighth best team um and you need to do something but again that’s my point they can do something if they feel like they need to or if something or if the right thing comes along so right yeah and to your to your point again like like two to eight from the east in the East is really tight you know like it was in terms of record last year it is in terms of talent like Boston has obviously the edge B Boston has a significant Edge on everybody else um but from you you know like New York Milwaukee Phil like Indiana Philly Orlando Cleveland Miami there is not a ton of Separation there you know yeah that’s and I don’t even mention Cleveland and Miami Cleveland won a playoff series in Miami is Miami which goes to show you just how how good the and again at some point maybe one of those teams separates themselves from the rest maybe there’s two tiers or whatever but we don’t know that yet and it’s crazy to try to uh Force something now when you don’t need to especially after the season the Pacers just had right exactly all right well we appreciate you uh listening Andor watching to uh the from way downtown Pacers podcast uh go to indystar.com um for everything Dustin’s done on the draft and we’ll have plenty more uh with free agency coming well we’ll have plenty more if the Pacers do much we’ll have plenty more on the team in general um as as we go along here so thank you for joining us
IndyStar Pacers Insider Dustin Dopirak and editor Nat Newell discuss the team drafting Johnny Furphy, Tristen Newton and Enrique Freeman, free agency and the New York Knicks’ offseason moves.
