The Atlanta Hawks Have the WORST Front Office in the NBA

The Atlanta Hawks Have the WORST Front Office in the NBA

What I really want to go on this conversation though is cuz a friend of the show Legend of winning posed this question he says that it’s just now hitting me that Indiana has done more for halberton in 18 months than Charlotte and Atlanta has done for Trey and lamelo in their entire careers

Charlotte’s not debate at Atlanta is a debate atanta is a debate Charlotte’s no debate Charlotte let me let me let me lead off let me lead this off and kind of paint the picture yeah Charlotte he’s right I think we got to start by looking at Indiana for the last 18 months so

He’s talking about a year and some change is that mathin and toen and uh that’s jarus Walker if I’m not mistaken um buddy uh uh um Tyrese himself if anything buddy right is that buddy Hill or buddy Hill was already there for a little while I think but he came with

Reese he came with Reese oh yeah he was in Sacramento yeah yeah uh Rick carile it’s in 18 months this is in this is about span I mean I would say well hold on now I’m not done I’m not done it’s his turn yeah it’s what skip

Say it’s my turn you you told me it was my turn trap card cause I gotta speak on my team right I let you speak on Anthony Davis when it’s your turn DMO it’s my turn I [ __ ] hate skill bro we traded five first round picks for

A guy who is is lighting up the trade talks right now de jonte Murray we were four years too late to realize that Kevin herder wasn’t it DeAndre bimy wasn’t it uh DeAndre Hunter isn’t it John Collins isn’t it Clint capella isn’t it coach after coach after coach isn’t

It it just seems so interesting to me now the Hawks have physically done stuff and I think you can make the case for the Hornets too they have done stuff no doubt about that when we talk about the impact of the move and the in the thought process behind the move I think

That’s where this conversation stems from so they’ve done stuff the Hawks have made a a lot of little transaction the [ __ ] is the impact of these transactions is the real question I place a card face down and I end my turn I feel like for Atlanta I mean

Y’all no I’m playing go ahead I didn’t even say anything Undisputed no I would say at least for Atlanta I would agree Indiana has done more I guess when you lay it out like that yes Indiana has done more than both of those situations but I do feel like

Grouping at Atlanta and Charlotte in the same is kind of disingenuous Atlantic hangs had on it built a situation where and anyone can say what they want about the Run they did get a convers finals you had a good team they have put they’ve put better players around Trey

Then Charlotte’s put around lamelo and situationally I feel like the situation around Trey is better than it is around lamelo I just feel like it’s kind of bad to put both of those teams in the same bubble a start yeah yes what wait what what was the uh conversation I’m taking

Notes of something what was the conversation say that again say exact point again he said that Atlanta has put better players around lamelo around Trey than Charlotte has lamelo I’mma let the cat out the bag I am actively going to help everyone find that out I was literally going through

Transaction history and noting it so continue I would I will argue Atlanta already there’s been no allar on the Hornets Lelo no Allstar did me last year so that’s one right there secondly a guy like Clint capella he trumps who the best center lamelo has played with to

This point is Mason plumbley Mark Williams Mark Williams maybe might be the best center he’s had so far in his career his young career um yeah because Dwight yeah Dwight was the Kima years so yeah um here okay he’s had Terry R here I just want to shout out Young gotov

We isn’t a 24 Point per game score this season that that’s what I really want to get but I no no no no I get that and I know he’s that level of a score but it’s crazy because no one expects Terry to be average of 24 when they hear her they’re

Like well that’s wild okay yeah sure you did T Roo I I feel it I know you did so you care about him 20 points per game last year that was the most oh my God I got my hand on the Trap car button cuz that’s Tomy poy last year

Last year he had two 20 point per game scores on his team and last year did Trey Young have two 20 point per game scores on his team to go right beside him survey says how much did bogy average be Souls 14 points I don’t know

Who you think I don’t know what you think these guys are I thought I thought he averag like 17 how many players aage on how many players in double digits for the Hornets that year that you’re referring to the Hornets last year wasn’t last year last year lamelo was hurt was he not

Games yeah that’s talent though you want me to go to hey you should have called it out earlier I don’t I think the year year before that was the planing year correct 21 no 21 they didn’t make the plan I’ll tell you how many I’ll tell

You how many that that year they had one two three four five six s and this is 2122 and then for the had seven yeah they had seven and then 2122 for the Hawks they had one two three four five six seven a this don’t count what do you

Mean it don’t count what don’t count cause Cameron Cameron Oliver played two games uh [ __ ] Oliver yeah that’s what I’m saying there some people on here what are you no no no it’s [ __ ] cam Oliver for total different reasons CH know you know cam reddish cam reddish

Played 34 games so he’s also in this conversation so he had Trey Trey had less if I count this right Les shut up SS Trey had had less Trey had less double digit in that there is one two with John Collins playing 54 games I think this

Might be the no that’s not the Year John tra three four five cam reddish would make six but he gets traded Dano ginar will be seven but he also I don’t think he he played there he played there he played there what we what are we doing okay then Clint capella makes

Eight so that’s that’s one more I’m trying to see how many wins do the Hawks have that year keep going though keep going keep going though keep going though because we stuck on this I want going what point I would just say I would just say that Atlanta is a better situation than

Charlotte has been throughout their career and it’s not like Trey Young’s been in the league since 2013 or some [ __ ] it’s only been probably two years before lamelo a year before lamelo two years this 2018 draft so I mean situationally Atlanta has always been a better destination than Charlotte

Charlotte’s just been a [ __ ] show like a legit [ __ ] show like at least the Hawks have certain Peaks they they still been a playoff team they still been a bit competitive charlott has been [ __ ] I don’t know man I think Atlanta’s front office gets too much slack man oh my God y

Hey CU I feel like sometimes in life right you just make certain moves that like oh it makes sense you know and I think everything has a certain probab uh probability to it certain chance of happening and I think some of the moves Atlanta made 70% chance hit rate name it

Name it name it you gotta name it the the jeon Murray trade how did that make sense um try they were looking for a two next to Trey young de M averaged like 28 and seven two steals the the year prior you know maybe Trey and uh he was also

Known as a Defender so Trey de jante together it made sense if you’re a paper Watcher you’re you’re specifically speaking from a paper Watcher perspective right um no not necessarily so from a film Watcher perspective I don’t think you would have thought that made sense and and to be quite Fair no

I’m not yeah actually doesn’t make sense well because they needed a secondary playmaker from my understanding right and and he was supposed to bolster their defense to a certain degree this isn’t even NE one of the worst moves to talk about in this thing so I don’t even want

To hold you on that point but if you were paper watching I guess that made sense what’s another move that made sense um I think acquiring Clint capella made sense I know that was after um not after 2021 but that made sense um paper watch okay again the the whole point is

Go ahead keep going okay John Collins I thought he was young H before Trey young okay um Kevin Kev uh drafting Kevin herder that’s part of the the front office drafting people DeAndre Hunter drafting him so what were these two coming out of college that made you that made you

Think that it made sense um Kevin nerle was known as a sharpshooter DeAndre Hunter was known as a or he was supposed to be like a a two-way dude going into the league am I wrong on that what were they supposed to be Kevin Kevin herder was a shooter but he was a

He was he was a zero on defense and then also so um DeAndre Hunter was a Team Defender but this is also somebody that we traded picks up to get so like moved around draft picks to make it work um and somebody that high you’re not

Drafting A Team Defender to to to be that fourth pick guy um and then Kevin herder if we’re supposed to be making a Warriors because that’s what they said at the time we’re supposed to making Warriors East to draft a zero on defense but not also an off ball guy that also doesn’t

Make any sense wasn’t an off ball guy my tripping not in Atlanta no all right even in college now not but essentially what I’m saying is I I just feel like there’s there’s not not to say that every move was just ah this was supposed to make sense it just didn’t

Hit but you know I feel like sometimes in life you just take certain risk and it’s a 70% chance it was going to make sense and be in your favor but you land all that 30 and you’re cooked you know so I just don’t think they’re that bad

That’s no no disrespect you don’t you don’t watch basket you don’t watch college basketball you don’t watch a lot of the teams that we’re talking about on a day-to-day basis either so like on paper a lot of these moves do make sense but that’s like the same thing that a

Lot of Lakers fans were saying yeah we need Deonte Murray he’s a Defender until somebody really pulls the film and shows y’all guys he’s not a Defender so I hear I hear you cuz on paper like oh he got an All-Star he’s a Defender that’s what

They told us but that’s what he never was again the the defense yeah get if you expected dejonte to be a DPI carry the defense type of player I thought you were bugging I never thought he was going to be that but he was still for a

Lot of people and I think it made sense a average at the very least to a slightly above average Defender am I wrong on that assessment when y’all traded for him have those expectations that’s what they thought and they thought he could guard twos and threes

He can’t guard twos and threes he can only guard ones so those are just wrong expectations to expect the SR to be in above okay that’s fine but even even even even from position on any other position that’s not a point guard yes okay and then from the secondary shot

Playmaking perspective did he not was that not also expected from it and did he not fulfill that role as well um that’s not a that wasn’t a bad expectation but it was also I guess you should have understood that those numbers were inflated because he was the only thing in San

Antonio okay that’s fair for for anybody who is uh undecided or anything like that I’ve written down the significant moves I’m G speedrun them since 201819 when Trey young was drafted they traded Justin Anderson they traded for Justin Anderson in the 2022 first um insignificant people we don’t

Need to talk about it uh they got Vince Carter and Alex Lynn that was the rookie season um in 2020 they get Cam reddish you know how that ended so make your determin make your opinion from there but they trade uh Jackson Hayes nikil Alexander Walker and a second for Hunter

That second round pick did end up becoming herb Jones and um they also acquire Clint capella um they draft Ona get sign Rondo sign bonovich sign Gallow and hire Nate McMillan The Following season I think that was in 2021 I want to say where they I think they made the

ACF that year double check that I always confuse that um the following draft they get Jaylen Johnson they sign Lou Williams extend John Collins um Delon Wright for Chris Dunn Bruno Fernando in a second they also signed bigs Jalil okaf for and Gori Jen and then the infamous dejonte Murray trade we were

Hinting to thus far and then currently this season they have obviously got AJ Griffin on roster Uh Kevin herder from o harkless uh no he know he still the league uh you’re right hardl holiday in 2024 Frank Kaminsky Sadi Bay Quinn Snider and John Collins for Rudy Gay in a second oh wait

That’s that’s last year this year my fault that that’s 2023 pardon me um this year they haven’t done [ __ ] and honestly it might it might even be a better move to look at the positive moves because a lot of them are [ __ ] but even I want to

Note right here even with the cam R and it what what I’m arguing for those that may have got lost in the weeds there’s no difference charlot and Atlanta are two sides of the same shitty coin it’s a it’s the Spider-Man meme pointing at each other only difference is Trey young

Is better than lamelo ball so therefore they’ve been able to ascend to higher Peaks and there’s been some opportunity there um in which they’ve been able to sneak into the playoff playin or whatever and then kind of Ascend there um and there’s like a little bit maturity more maturity on the Atlanta

Roster than the the jail Hornets um I just want to note here Tomo do you think cam R should have been drafted eight no you think he should have been drafted I’m trying I’m trying to think back to that draft was the camer draft the same as the DeAndre Hunter draft or

No cause I wanna because I want to say I’m gonna be honest I always said they messed up and everyone was going to call me crazy but anyone that knew me at the time knew I was pushing this agenda that DeAndre Hunter pick I swore up and down

Yo B B’s the missing piece get Bo bow on Atlanta Instead at this pick right here because they had two picks in the first round they had him getting uh the DeAndre Hunter and then who was the second pick that round that year uh they they got uh Dre DeAndre Hunter oh and

Then cam reddish but they so that was that year that was that year they drafted Jackson Hayes at eight and then DeAndre Hunter at or Cam reddish at 10 then I guess they did some maneuvering right because Jackson Hayes wasn’t on the team I always for

Hunter I always said hunter or Cam Rish one of those pick should have been boo so yeah I do think uh he shouldn’t have been picked eight and hell both of them but not even not even because you felt that way I’m really asking you because remember that Duke season how abysmal he

Was yes he looked way back he looked way worse um after like the high he was like the number one player in high school going um into college that year right he was number one uh was it him Zion and RJ like one two one two and three or all

Top five somewhere around there somewhere around there but the one that was supposed to have the most Talent best talent was the best player and drastically underperformed under aief shot abysmally um from everywhere on the court um Turned the ball over um couldn’t make plays terrible shot shot

Diet all that on a team that honestly he was getting the third most attention right just abysmal and they drafted him eight I just want to the Hawks make bad moves I feel you I feel you but if you start hearing the moves that the Hornets

Decide to make then you’ll be like oh it does get worse hey hey they listen this is not me caping for them this is just me saying that both of them make bad Mo both of them make shitty moves like terrible ter 100% 100% that’s why I said

Initially with low sweet he’s right the Pacers have done more than 18 months especially when you really lay it out there they have done that question without a doubt true statement no capping that I just felt there is a difference between how bad Atlanta’s doing and how bad Charlotte is and how

Bad they’re doing I do think it’s two different levels it could be [ __ ] tier F tier like don’t get me wrong it’s two bad situations I do think Charlotte is noticeably worse I will say I didn’t necessarily give my take this whole time because I was doing the research on it um looking

At the Pacers moves um and comparing them to the Hawks move now I’m comparing them laterally even even if I were to never have seen any of these guys play and I were to only have 2K knowledge n i I agree with the tweet I think the Pacers have

Certainly done more immediate they they immediately get Jaylen Smith they get n Smith they um they trade Brogden and they um they they what else they do they got they got Rick Carlow that’s what I was trying to mess up they got Rick carow and even if I were to just time

Skip to just this yakan thing I mean so serious those four moves are about as if not significantly more impact then essentially extending John Collins getting Clint capella and um drafting Hunter and cam in the same time I I think I think I’m actually go Indiana

Year it’s debatable but uh I got Indiana well let me let me ask y’all this to to add to the conversation because now we’re getting into the comparison of the point guards themselves do you think that it it is a situation of luck or whatever the case may be or do you think

It’s actually easier to to build around Rees than it is Trey and lamelo I don’t think it’s easier uh I think essentially they all have the same play style um willing passers who are also bucket Getters who also can go out for 30 40 50 points if they’re hot um

But still guys that are willing to pass now yes there is differences in shot selection uh shot timing shot confidence they’re all confident but I feel like lamelo feels like any shots a good shot for him and somehow Trey FS even more of that so it’s kind of I mean I don’t want

To call him shot Chuckers but in the sense of how these guys play as scoring guards same play style so I don’t think it is uh easier for one than the other I well for health I will put Trey and Reese over lamelo he’s been the least

Healthy and then I would say Trey young over ree because he’s been more healthy than Reese so far in Reese’s short career um that’s really the only difference other than that is straight management of assets and talent and assessing draft picks and trades and all

That [ __ ] yeah no I’m not giving I’m not giving the Hawks an excuse um both if not all three of these point guards you have to the I if you were to try to prove B Souls wrong or Becky Hammond wrong or any person that doesn’t have the point guards being successful thing

You would have to make teams with significant defense at two through five um and these teams have not well no outside of Indiana these teams just haven’t even attempted that at all the Haw Hawks especially they’ve doubled down on offense routinely um so no I

Don’t I don’t think it’s a matter of uh skill set especially when you consider the skill set of Trey young and Tyrese one’s just like taller if that makes them better to you then go for it but it’s not like Tyrese is locking up he only has more defensive potential due to

His height but that’s it it’s not like he’s a way better Defender yeah I think um the ceilings of teams led by these three they’re about the same the only difference makers would be like what dam said it would be a health conversation and you would have to like

Really Bank on a tangibles oh this guy really got the F Factor this guy doesn’t but um yeah know I don’t think one is significantly easier to build around compared to the other person I think and and part of the conversation to me I mean let me say

This I think that all of them have their faults like I think lamelo and I hate to sound like a old head here just doesn’t take the game ser seriously I don’t think does either like he just I been had that but I was called a hater but I

Was like yo I me he’ll get it one day oh no I did I watched the Hornets heat highlights the other day and it really wasn’t highlights it was all his shot attempts and I was just like I was not blown away but I was like man he plays

Like he’s still currently at Chino Hills um Trey young defense and you know uh uh um his involvement in the game sometimes um what’s it called the and then for Tyrese Halbert and the little no look passes I just said I’m tired of that but nonetheless

Um what I’m what I’m saying is I think that through all their flaws and all that stuff I think that this is more of a testament to the conversation that we were having a minute ago last part or whatever to what truly like a competent organization can do and will do versus

What an incompetent organization we we talked about the the trades and stuff that they made and the players and coaches and stuff that they’ve shuffled we also forgot about the organizational shifts that they’ve had Hawks have also ran through like want say three coaches no not coaches GMS oh yeah I think

That’s also true too they’ve gone through two three GMS since Trey’s been there I think I want to say ownership switched hands one time as well that they’ve gone they’ve gone through Executives like Landry Fields Nicks Landry Fields shooter three and D guy early 3 and D guy he’s our executive now

But that was off of um what’s buddy that was the um I see Travis and Landry yeah Travis and Landry you had two so he’s had two and he’s been in the league in what five years now uh Landry or Travis no Trey Trey tre’s been in League five

Years oh Tre yeah Trey been here five years you had three coaches to GS or two Executives that’s two different philosophies as to how to build a team what consistency what what direct like and it takes more than just that time in order to go forward with a plan

Especially when you’re talking about building a program and stuff like that the instability now and you got to make the right decision the the Pacers came in and and seemed to make the right decision the first time and it just just took off

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