EP. 424 – ‘24 Coach & Front Office Grades – Orlando Magic Podcast

EP. 424 – ‘24 Coach & Front Office Grades – Orlando Magic Podcast

this is the sixthman show an Orlando Magic podcast with your hosts Luke Sylvia and Jonathan Osborne covering all things Magic Basketball by fans for fans go [Music] magic what’s going on Orlando Magic fans you guys are back with the six-man show today is June 3rd 2024 Jonathan Osborne here joined by my co-host Luke Sylvia uh in an undisclosed location uh Luke what is going on man uh man um just moved into a house uh NCA football 25 Gameplay trailer uh released as well a lot of content that I’ve been watching there that’s I think July 19th is a release date for that so uh everything’s great man being a first-time homeowner and then everything else that is uh chaotic and exciting about that all is coming with her right now yeah I’m looking forward to college football 25 I know I’m not like the biggest college football fan as you know that like but the video game to me like I always played the NCAA football games as a kid so I’m looking forward to that release however when that releases I’m going to be like in the middle of a golf trip so like as much as I just want to be home like playing that game that day I won’t be able to play it until that Monday but thankfully I and like I always have the foresight to take off an extra day when I get back from vacation so that like you don’t get home and like oh my gosh I have to work the next day I always book that day after buffer like that is a a pro-life hack for vacationing so the 22nd that Monday I’ll just be able to spend the whole day playing college football 25 so that’ll be that’ll be good yeah it’ll be electric it looks great it looks fast and that’s what we need we need it to look fast like it used to needs to play at a faster Pace than Madden they they needed to make it as much as unlike Madden as possible and they did that like it looks awesome so it seems promising and Madden might be saying goodbye to a lot of their uh typical players for sure so I haven’t had the opportunity to watch you know that Gameplay trailer that came out yesterday or the day before whenever that was what what to you like were the highlights from that is there anything maybe missing from this game that you were hoping that they would include like what’s your takeaway so far the only the only thing that you could say that they’re missing is uh in Road to Glory so like basically if you’re familiar with 2K as listeners like it’s basically my player uh story line yeah Road to Glory typically like it used to include playing in high school uh like your senior year but they don’t have that this year at least as far as we know and I think might have been confirmed so there’s none of that and honestly that’s like if even if you’re nitpicking like that’s the only thing that you hear and you think like oh man maybe I wish they would have had that but on top of that man like they’ve got it nailed like like they’ve got uh basically badges that players have to kind of separate themselves from other players and as well as like it doesn’t it’s not like a game breaker it’s not like they can do no wrong from what I’ve heard like it doesn’t ruin the game it just makes them better in those areas but they’re not like a cheat code with those certain things I’m sure there’s going to be players that are cheat codes and that’s just part of the game there’s so many players it’s inevitable that there’s going to be some unbalanced players for sure but they nailed that like there’s a lot that more than they nailed than what I wish like that they would have added and I think that really like that’s just nitpicking as far as what they could have added but I mean it looks awesome the atmosphere looks awesome they’ve got traditions in the game from colleges and stuff I’m interested to see Florida fans will will know about this for sure but at the beginning of the fourth quarter they play Won’t Back Down by Tom Petty and the whole crowd sings it with their phone lights on I’m interested to see if that’s in the game because they have other cool traditions in the game and as a Gator fan I I would love to see that but uh we we’ll see we we’ll see what it looks like but man it’s man it’s going to be a lot of fun what’s going to be the first school that you fire up with the the dynasty mode have you already like made a decision or are you going to wait to see yeah the school that I always took to the promised land uh was the New Mexico uh State Lobos so New Mexico state that’s probably who we’re taking the promised land and uh and we’ll see what we can do it’s going to be interesting after after that are you moving you know are you are you leaving for Florida I think we got to I I got to I’ll probably set a precedent of how many national championships I have to win with them before I just jump ship and go to where all the the money is to recruit players and whatever else it’s that’s that’s an aspect that’s going to be a lot of fun to see the money aspect we’ll see if it ruins it but I think it’ll be fun you’ll get with your staff obviously you know you’ll you’ll talk to your family you know and you’ll make whatever decision you feel like is going to be best for you not only you but the future of both programs right yeah yeah yeah please respect my decision is what I’ll tell people for sure yeah all right yeah I’m looking forward to that looking forward to today’s episode the last uh few shows we spent uh going through the different player position groups we went through uh the guards first then the centers and then we talked about the forwards on the last episode only thing really left to do is just talk a little bit more about uh the magic staff we’re going to talk about Jamal Mosley uh and then we’ll talk just more generally about the you know the front office Jeff welman and Anthony Parker especially uh but just really talk about the the front office as a whole there U so yeah that’s what we’ll be doing today uh we’re going to again be talking about what we’re grading Jamal Mosley in the front office based off of sort of like what our expectations were going into the year let’s start with Jamal Mosley Luke and I I wanted to to list out uh some statistics here just to you know jog our memory a little bit you know it’s been you know almost about a month since the season ended now about four weeks from today as we’re recording this um so just wanted to go back and and Jog our memories a little bit in terms of like the Improvement that this magic team saw underneath Jamal Mosley this uh past season so compared to last year uh where the magic went 34 and 48 this year they finished 47 and 35 13- win Improvement on the year they went from 20 and 21 at home a season ago to 29 and 12 this year nine win Improvement there and they went from 14 and 27 on the road to 18 and 23 this season on the road so they didn’t see a really a big Improvement on the road like if you look at like oh my gosh 13- win Improvement right like they probably were quite a bit better at home and quite a bit better on the road they were just barely better on the road but they were just so much better at home this season uh taking a look at some of the advanced metrics you know all this stuff is rated per 100 possessions last year the magic were 26th in offensive rating they had an offensive rating of 111.3 now this year remember the magic lost L their lead assistant and like their most offensive-minded assistant Nate tibits to the WNBA he he left you know to to coaching the the WNBA really at the beginning of the season so without his lead assistant he went from 26 in offensive rating last year to this year 22nd in offensive rating with a offensive rating of 11 12.9 some of the personnel and like the internal improvements of the roster certainly helped uh in terms of Defense the magic were 18th in defensive rating last year with a defensive rating of 113.9 this year they were third in defensive rating with a defensive rating of 11.8 last season Luke to me the next few stats I’m going to go through are are really the most interesting last year they were 15 and 16 against teams below 500 this year they were 28-7 against teams below 500 just this year there was no messing around like you’re playing a bad team you’ve got to take care of business and and the magic overwhelmingly did that this season however they were 19-32 last year against teams above 500 this year they were 19 and 28 against teams above 500 so still not really being able to to to get to that next level I think getting to that next level you’re just going to have to start beating better teams you’re going to have to start beating really good teams uh but this year you the magic play who were in front of them and whether they’re at home or on the road or whatever took care of business against teams below 500 took care of home court if you want to take a a big step as a team that’s like one of the first things that you have to do you have to win at home you have to beat bad teams but they are still struggling against good teams and I think we realized that all throughout the season compared to last year where they were 19 and 25 in total clutch games so that’s what 44 clutch games this year they were 21 and 14 so they played in 35 clutch games this year so they played in less clutch games and they were better in clutch games as our friend Philip rosson Reich over at Orlando Magic daily.com and lock on Magic always says good teams don’t win close games they avoid them and the magic did a good job of you know improving avoiding those close games but they were also much better this year in those close games so this is just you know a ton of numbers I don’t think it tells the entire story on the job that Jamal Mosley did this past season but Luke what are your feelings of Jamal Mosley in and you compared to last year I I think just like the the roster rotation changes that Mosley had the boldness to to make this year really showed me that he’s settling into his role you first think of like regardless of the fact that it he reverted back right you think about Jonathan Isaac starting that final game starting in the playoff off the the first uh couple games and also having like the I don’t know if like humble is the word or whatever it might be but but but having the the boldness to start Jonathan Isaac and try something new in a pivotal time like the playoffs and the last game of the year which was essentially when or you go to the playin and then to backtrack and be like you know what that was wrong I’m going to go that that didn’t work maybe I maybe that wasn’t wrong is the wrong thing to say there but that didn’t work let me go back to to what we were doing right I think that was just one sign of the growth that Jamal Mosley has had as a coach and really finding himself really settling in with with Orlando and then on top of that comes also in the playoffs the way that he coached I think he absolutely out coached bigger staff in that series and I think it was very clear that he did that and and obviously whenn improvements year-over-year you can talk about that but for me it was just like how comfortable he was this year with making adjustments and being confident in those things now of course obviously leaves things to be desired but like doesn’t every coach that’s only a few years in and the growth that he has shown and the respect and being second Coach of the Year voting that’s that’s not obviously that’s not a small thing so for him to do that with this young of a team making more with less like during the injury stretch Anthony black goes into the starting lineup right that took a lot of boldness as well if we’re still talking in that vein and then and then for him to be like and regardless of what you think for him to be like okay we’re back to health full health AB you’re going back to basically not playing and you know that there was probably multiple conversations about should we just play Anthony black should be do this and just continue on with that because we’re getting pressure from whoever right the fan base maybe other coaches on staff maybe people in the front office about Anthony black but Jamal Mosley ultimately stuck to his guns there and and that you could argue that was a front office decision but then another thing you think about with googa obviously kind of same scenario as as ab and also Marquel fultz to ultimately decide it’s best if he just comes off the bench and to his credit Marquel folz was great in the playoffs in a bench roll so all of those things like the theme there is just that Jamal Mosley sticks to his guns what he thinks is right and what his team decides is right his assistant coaches that he’s got alongside him they they are confident in what they do and I just think that that is an area of growth or maybe just an opportunity that he was able to feel like okay I’m in a position to do this now I’m I’m I’m here a few years years in I’ve got the Reigns I’m fully trusted and I’m not going to get questioned about you know this or that from the front office or whoever it might be I just thought he showed a lot of poise this year yeah when you look at the big picture with Jamal going back to the beginning of the Season like losing your lead assistant right at the beginning of the year like that’s a massive blow and then you the the reason that I felt it was appropriate to put Jamal Mosley and the front office really in the same not the same conversation but like on the the same episode as we continue to grade these is because it’s really hard to evaluate one without the other like yeah oh the front office looks great because look at how the team improved but yeah you probably don’t get there without Jamal Mosley and his staff and the way that they’ve coached up everybody and then oh look at Jamal Mosley and and the way that he’s like you know playing and the playing these guys and you know you know pulling the different levers well you know the front office also constructed this team and and and gave him this roster so they sort of go hand in hand but when I sit down and and think about like what we expected from this team at the beginning of the year number one everybody would agree that this team like greatly exceeded expectations sure they ended up Fifth we were talking at the beginning of the season of oh it would be great for this team to reach the play and then we got to the point of oh it will be a disappointment if this team plays in the play and then with like you know 11 or 12 days to go in the regular season you had a real chance at being the the two or the three seed in the Eastern Conference so when you just look at like the expectations of the team obviously Jamal Mosley had a huge hand in that and what would I expect out of Jamal Mosley in terms of like growth like you expected him to be better with the with the rotations um you just expect him to continue to help these guys develop and we did see growth especially from guys like Paulo like Jaylen Suggs maybe we didn’t see as much as we wanted to from other guys maybe like a a fron arner to a certain extent with the shooting although like we talked about on the last episode almost everything else was much better than it was last year you look at a guy like Wendell Carter Jr Marquel folz those guys were dealing with injuries seemingly the entire season so there’s Nuance that needs to be mentioned in in these conversations that we you know we’re not making excuses for people but it just like it’s the reality of this situation it is what it is it’s not really fair to make blant statements without evaluating all of those other pieces but all in all I thought Jamal Mosley did a great job um contrary to what people believe like fison our guy you know writes you know for for the site and is one of the best follows on Orlando Magic Twitter who goes and like just pours over every ounce of film after each game contrary to what people believe like Jamal Mosley does run offense like he does run sets he runs a lot of sets trying to find ways to improve this team and improve the offense and it tries to be as C cretive as he can given the the you know the the roster and the the Personnel that’s currently on this team so overall when it when it comes to Jamal Mosley you mentioned finished second in Coach of the Year voting so everybody watching this league and going into this season with the expectations or lack thereof s looked at this guy and said this guy has absolutely been one of the very best coaches in the League this year gets this team to the playoffs was Jamal Mosley perfect at every juncture and every return this year no you know there are there were still questions that we had and and things that you know in the moment were probably fair you criticisms of in-game management and decisions towards the end of games he still has time to improve there but overall this year I was really impressed with Jamal Mosley I I wouldn’t I think I have him at like a B+ you can give your grade here but like Jamal Mosley in my opinion like I know we talked about this that the coach of the year award is like a one-year award but if you look at the work that he’s been doing over the last three years to me like the body of work is what has led up to this and the way that he’s been able to lead these guys the first couple of years the fact that like they had a big breakthrough although it was more than even the most optimistic magic fan thought was possible this was still a result of the work that he’s been putting in with these guys over the course of the past two years so I I wasn’t like blown away by my expectations like of Jamal Mosley this year because I I did think he was a good coach and this team was on the right track um so I I give Jamal Mosley Pro B+ probably isn’t even fair like maybe like an A or or a minus for Jamal yeah I was going to say a minus uh I my expectation it wasn’t just that we would take a win jump which I believe that I said 42 and 40 before the year started so he even exceeded that and even that some people outside of Orlando fans and the national media at that point would would have said that maybe that was a to that was too overzealous right Vegas had us at what like 36 and a half something like that so he overachieved even my expectations that were maybe you could have said optimistic but at the same time clearly they were realistic in hindsight for what this team did and how they improved so for me because Jamal Mosley even exceeded that with his with these guys with going on a niname win streak without a couple key guys on your team that early in the year is super impressive to go out and beat Denver and then the that next game to go out and beat Boston during that win streak it’s like that’s all in my opinion the the confidence and the things that were have been instilled in these players like yeah some of it what they brought in like their mentality is awesome and that probably obviously goes to credit to the front office but Jamal Mosley is constantly uplifting these guys we know he’s a players coach we know he cares about the people on that team on that roster not just what can they do for him and that all plays in to the to the fact that these guys overachieve this year this doesn’t happen without coach Jamal Mosley and because of that that’s absolutely why I’m landing on an A minus yeah just credit all the way around to Jamal you mentioned the fact that you know early in the season you lose guys put guys into the rotation seemed like the right button to push at that moment with ab and googa and then he has a difficult decision once Marquel once Wendell come back of hey what do I do with these other guys and make the the tough decision maybe we don’t necessarily agree with especially Anthony black being pushed back to the bench but with how good he was playing there’s no way that that could have been an easy decision for Jamal to say look man you stepped in you played really well stepped up for this team and delivered but this is just the way that that it is you’re going to go back to the bench and although like you know maybe you know if we’re arguing like did this team like squee squeeze every win out of this season that they could have I I think you could argue that with other choices when it comes to the rotation and and the guard rotation in certain games maybe things could have gone you know a different way in maybe a handful of games but that’s just like you said if you’re clearly nitpicking you know you can get upset about things like that um but Jamal Mosley and and really we’re talking about like the whole staff like they did an incredible job if you go back and you look at you know the the double overtime loss in Sacramento or the they win the next game in Denver like that stuff does not happen without good coaching and being able to coach guys up and always preaching that next man up mentality like guys go out in that Sacramento game you see chuma okk obviously step up in a big way in that game Caleb Houston and those guys again you know in that that game against Denver that stuff does not happen without good coaching right like you don’t you don’t you know hang in multiple games like that you know obviously that Sacramento game was really crazy from a offensive standpoint for both teams and then the next game you’re in Denver going against the reigning Champs you know missing like a a third or almost half of your roster and pulling out a big win like that it just doesn’t happen without the the culture in the expectation that this team is built and is you know set with these players so I thought Jamal mosy and his staff did an incredible job are there still areas of of growth like areas that we would like to see Improvement definitely right like it it’s sort of difficult because it did feel like in a way Jamal’s you know hands were sort of tied in certain situations like when it comes to Anthony black or or some of these you other guys and you have to wonder like if Jamal mosy could just I’m not and I’m not saying he wasn’t able to do this but I I do ask what would this team look like if Jamal mosy was just able to do whatever he wanted and didn’t have to worry about anything and it feels like we’re we’re getting to the point with this team and I guess this will be a good segue into the conversation about the front office in a minute but we should be getting to the point where like there aren’t really any any more excuses to be had right like this front office they get like they inherit this team right the the Frank vogley year they have a year of evaluating then they decide okay this guy probably isn’t the right guy they bring in Steve Clifford and then it seems like there is a mandate from you know either upper management or ownership that says hey we haven’t been to the playoffs in six seasons we’re tired of losing we need to go all in make a playoff run and the front office made moves to achieve that goal and then when even when they decide like hey we might be at our ceiling because of certain decision decisions that were made by the the previous front office regime their hands were still sort of tied to a certain aspect but they started to take this team and sort of mold it and make it their own and I I feel like this is the first off season which again this is going to be a good segue to talk about the front office but this is really the first off season where it’s like all right all bets are off we can really do what we need to do here and like previous mistakes or Decisions by the last regime like there’s no excuses at this point everything from here moving forward is going to be like hey like this is all you guys Luke I I don’t know if there’s anything that you want to add about Jamal before we take a quick break and talk about the front office but um I I do have that question still like hey what is this team going to look like where Jamal mosy is put in the absolute best position and is just told like don’t worry about anything but winning games because it does seem like maybe there were some other factors influencing some of the decisions that Jal Mosley had to make this year yeah nothing uh nothing else to add um valid point on your end and uh no that that’s it for me on most all right let’s take a quick break just to talk about our patrons uh they’re the folks that help keep the lights on help make each and every episode and every event that we do possible uh if you would like to join the patreon you want to help support the show you’ve been listening for a while um um and you want to be a part of the community part of our our Discord Community as well uh with certain uh tiers that we have available there you get access to our Discord Channel if you would like to learn more or potentially join the patreon you can find us at patreon.com theix man show we give a very special shout out to our Elite tier patrons and Hall of Fame tier patrons each and every episode so let’s go ahead and start with court cousins Drew Gooden Armen Carson tulo Ellis Jonathan borgers normal magic player history Gabe gains Whiffle Michael Martin Jamal Miller Michael salop Donkey Punch Dave Pao and Frances Warth Pier a Dylan Holden Mr Mikey danal Bobby Skinner goie 93 Teddy Sylvia Dak Lopez fuchsia Bill Folton Emon lagone josea squealing C cayb Pete cannibalism time Mr TV ESPN really sucks gear 95 shred Junior Bruce half Rin shahan 177 BBY the dawn himo banro RM improv 221 Ray Pastrana Magic Kid 714 mysterious Mosley Irish Magic Mike Austin lampy random hustle only France Maria Keith W Fritz BR sou Case green salty Leon Kane Eckler the distract of ma timsa chantu Tom Gadson dead air Richard Tuttle Jeremiah cantero Debo 1980 magic Matt Michael Thompson Mama Richmond next snappa what’s up playoffs 2024 Dylan Fay David Duppy Smith CHS Bueno time stano 1995 Suggs mugs Derek Smith Daniel Anderson Barry and Mel canny a big shout out to all of our patrons you can find us at patreon.com theix man show now on to the front office Luke um obviously Jeff welman been at the helm for quite some time now the beginning of this season John Hammond is transitioning more into like a senior advisory role Anthony Parker was promoted to to general manager and then I just thought it would be helpful to really go through the list of transactions that the magic made this year and then we’ll also mention a couple of transactions that the magic didn’t make cuz those factor into this as well uh dra drafted Anthony black with the sixth pick in last June’s draft drafted jet Howard 11th overall in last year’s draft uh the magic traded the 36th pick in this draft which turned out to be Andre Jackson Jr uh they exercise the club option for Goa baz back in June they declined a club option for Michael Carter Williams uh they declined a team option for Admiral scoffield in June but then they signed him to a two-way contract in July uh signed jet Howard and Anthony black to their rookie scale contracts we talked about Anthony Parker um being promoted to General Manager they signed Mo Vagner to a two-year $16 million uh deal which includes a team option for this upcoming season they signed Joe Engles which was sort of an unexpected uh uh deal right there at the beginning of free agency they signed Joe Engles to a two-year $22 million contract which includes the team option for this upcoming season here signed a slew of G guys to exhibit 10 contracts most notably mck mclung and travell and queen those guys obviously travel and queen spent some time with the Orlando Magic M McClung ended up being the g-league MVP this past year Nob brainer but the exercised the uh 20124 2025 12.16 million option for Palo banero duh of course uh the exercise Jaylen Suggs n 9.19 million option for next year as well and exercise fron vogner $7 million option for next year signed Cole Anthony to a three-year 39 million doll rookie contract extension just before the season started um that’s really a two-year deal and then the third year is a team option uh that extension does not start until next season however so when you’re like oh that’s four seasons from now that’s why because the extension hasn’t kicked in just yet um and then in March just you know couple of weeks before the regular season ended uh they signed Jamal Mosley to a four-year contract extension couple of things that they did not do they uh have not not at least not yet uh extended Gary Harris Marquel folz or chuma okk chuma okk is set to be a restricted free agent this off season and then Gary Harris and Marquel folz are both going to be unrestricted free agents this year Luke what is your evaluation of the front office this year well I I mean it’s it’s hard like you said the coach and the front office often go hand inand and and the success is reflected on each other so you if you know if you’re thinking about the front office they’ve already got a leg up because the magic finished well above expectation and if we’re talking the last calendar year uh in the last year and what they’ve done since basically like the last off season you you brought in Joe Eng Les who despite postseason and contributions there you can absolutely say Joe Engles was a positive addition to this team like he might at this point be a regular season player and then you have his leadership in the playoffs because that has been very made very know well known and very apparent that Joe Eng Les is very vocal and brings guys under his wing and it’s just a allaround great dude to have on the roster so that alone like that that was a good signing by all accounts by this front office and really got this whole thing started for the upcoming you know for this past season and then you just look at like looking you go I I guess I fast forward there to the deadline this comes maybe my only like real critique of the front office in this last last year where I’m thinking we should have we should have done this right we we we should have made a move for a point guard say I don’t know Tai Jones and uh maybe you guys have heard of him but I was hoping that that they would do that move and I totally like I get it uh you know coming up you have another shot at TI Jones this offseason but and part of me does Wonder like was there not really much interest from tus Jones camp and that’s why this trade didn’t happen and the magic front office kind of backed off if that’s it then then it is what it is and we’ll find out this summer right if the magicar do offer Ty Jones or whatever it might be or he signs whatever I just think that making that trade would have guaranteed a magic first round win you were that piece away this season from from winning that round I think so that’s my only real critique for this front office this year and you’re going into this like into this offseason in an incredible spot you’re in every conversation for basically anybody that’s a free agent like these guys are linking you to everybody and so for me it’s hard to really grade this this front office negatively I don’t know how you really can and as a result I I probably for the front office I’m going to be giving them an a like the the the trade and what I wish happened at the deadline really is kind of nitpicking and you go from there you see what they do this offseason but if you’re talking about setting yourself up for Success it it happened right like they set us up for Success even down to call Anthony’s thirdd year on that extension being a a club option they are so good about that they earn the players trust as well that like they’re going to be treated fairly come that time it’s going to be a fair decision it’s a business decision but it’ll be fair and they’re not just going to screw these guys so for me it’s front office that gets an a for me see I I disagree just slightly I I don’t feel like talking about the trade deadline is nitpicking and this is why it’s the front office’s job to maximize every asset possible and it’s not so much about what you didn’t get in like a maybe a tus Jones or whoever the or a buddy heal or like whoever whatever name is at the top of your head for me it’s just more about like you’re getting nothing for Marquel folon and and Gary Harris and it’s quite possible that a guy like Marquel folz just maybe wasn’t really valued that much around the league and you couldn’t get much for him Gary Harris on the other hand like I have to think that you you could have gotten something in return for Gary Harris and sure you could be like okay well if they let’s say the best you could get was like a second round pick for Gary Harris like okay I I can understand the thinking of not making that move but ultimately right we all went into this season with the understanding of hey this season really isn’t about this season this season is about setting this team up for future seasons and in that regard it does feel like you this team left a little bit on the table right like you talk about tus Jones if you make that move potentially that ends up in a first round you series Victory I don’t know that it gets you there but I could see how that could have helped right like I think a big problem in that series was at times the magic just did not have a lead guard and another guy to take the offensive pressure off of a guy like pal vano and then you know fron vogner played really well in some games didn’t play well in others Jaylen Suggs really the same thing Cole Anthony the same thing Mark like you go up and down the roster it’s like hey like sure you you showed up in this game but hey this other game when Paulo needed anybody to help nobody could really step up and and try to get this team over the hump so I I do think there’s something to that thinking of like by not pulling the trigger on a guy you know to to move off of Gary Harris or Marquel folz or whoever it is is to try to improve this team in the middle of the Season it felt like you left left a little bit you know on on the bone there and what does that do you know in free agency if you are able to pull off a a first round you know up uh upset are even more team like guys maybe that aren’t even free agents guys that are just thinking about getting out of whatever situation that they’re in all of a sudden does Orlando become a a more appealing Des destination so maybe is there an element of picking to that when like relative to the way that the team outperformed their expectations and um just the overall the way that the team performed this year yes but the front office’s job is to squeeze like every ounce of juice out of every asset that they possibly can and in two Assets in particular Markel folz and Gary Harris it looks like you’re going to lose those guys for nothing so in a a certain respect maybe they sacrificed the you know the immediate future maybe not like this season immediate future but maybe the start of next season immediate future for trying to make sure that you made the playoffs this year and I it’s a it’s a Nuance thing right because like there are pros and cons to both sides of things there but if somebody was going to criticize the front office and say like yeah they did a great job but like now you’re not going to get anything from Marquel you’re not going to get anything from Gary I do see that so for me I I give the front office like a solid b or or or a B+ CU I do think that is the one thing that you could criticize the front office for is is sort of sitting on those assets to be fair we have decided Gary Harris and fultz are gone right true so so who know like who knows maybe if those guys come back then first of all if one of those guys comes back we’re we’re really going to have an issue I think on our hands but like I I’ll just say if Gary comes back at a relatively low number then it’s like okay I understand why you didn’t move Gary we’ve already seen Gary come back right right we’ve already seen him say and then even his exit interviews like there’s nothing he said there there’s a lot of we talk yeah yeah so I think it’s possible that he comes back as like a just strictly benched guy and to be honest that’s that’ be okay with me like I know that that would rub maybe some people the wrong way maybe take minutes away from younger guys and you can argue that whatever right but that’s my point we have said that we think Gary and fultz are gone we AB yes I obviously I Echo your sentiment on on that if if you if you were a betting man MH yeah are they are they gone they’re gone yeah but but why did this front office not move off of them for a second round pick then if they’re gone to squeeze it and the other option is that they ultimately were undecided about what they’re going to do with those guys they’re like let’s just St Pat see how the rest of the year plays out and if we could listen man that would be concerning to me though sure but you’re talking about trading them for a second round pick but also like these guys don’t care about a second round pick yeah I I I get they’ got Capital they’ve got Capital they don’t need a couple more second round picks you know what I mean so so we will see how it plays out I won’t be shocked if either of them walk or both of them walk uh because the front office allows them to and I won’t be shocked if Gary Harris comes back and Mark El folz is gone I will be shocked I will be irritated if both comeback because then you really are taking away from younger players right so you can’t bring both of them back and I I don’t know but but Playing devil’s advocate yeah we don’t really know for certain where they’re at or where they were at around deadline time and and I still wouldn’t be super shocked if yeah like I said if Gary’s back on like a bench rooll veteran basis and that’s what you’re looking at so yeah we’ll we’ll see what happens but I don’t that’s why I called it nitpicking of the deadline because I don’t know where their head’s at really quickly I want to ask you what what you think this team does MO Vagner is $8 million team option this year pick up or decline pick up Joe Eng Les $1 million team option dud gone renounced so do you this Kevin and I talked about this on the last episode but what I would like to see is them decline that team option and sign him to like a twoyear $12 million kind or even like a oneyear $6 million deal like like the dude’s 37 years old I don’t like you’re going to have a 39y old on this roster in a couple of years I I have some some real you know doubts about that but yeah I I don’t think that that would be Outlanders to think that Joe Engles is cool with that Joe’s played at the highest levels right like he he has played on on big stages I don’t Joe also just like yeah I he’s good right like he can ride off into the sunset in beautiful sunny Florida with no state income tax he tends to I think he from what we’ve seen he likes Florida so I wouldn’t be shocked if that does happen and then he plays one more year with the magic maybe goes and retires with a team that he you know with it whether it’s Utah or whatever or if he just simply rides off to the sunset retires as the magic I wouldn’t be shocked if he plays one more one more season two more seasons I’d probably say one more season and then he’s he’s probably retiring and he has literally said like hey if Jamal decides he doesn’t want me like next year I’ll be playing for aola so so it those are his words verbatim so what I wouldn’t hate is Joe Eng Les plays another year retires and then accept some kind of like advisory or like assistant you know coach role you know if he still wants to be around the team still wants to travel a little bit you know make a a decent living for himself all that kind of stuff and then um let’s just put it all out you know on the table here what do you what do you think that we it’s so hard to predict like who did the magic go out and sign what do you expect us to do with like the guys that are on the roster like guys that are eligible for you know extensions or or or are going to be free agents talking about like Goa you who is an unrestricted free agent uh marel unrestricted free agent Gary unrestricted free agent fron vogner extension eligible jayen Suggs extension eligible chuma okk restricted free agent what do you think we do with those guys the the biggest pieces to me are Jonathan Isaac and and fultz like those are your biggest things because ultimately those are what are going to determine cap space for you this off season so for me I I you said think not want is that correct you could give me either you could give me both I think uh I obviously you keep ji okay I I thought this episode was really about to go off the r here you SC I wasn’t even thinking about Jonathan Isaac the fact that his $17.4 million are not fully guaranteed yet yeah I’m pulling up the the uh the the the due date on that essentially it becomes fully guaranteed um not until January 10th but yeah yeah ultimately like uh thinking about Keith Smith a tweet that he put out less than a month ago talking about like what you know here are the primary cap situation for Orlando the wave Isaac renounce fults option could get you about 65.8 million there’s just there there’s no point in having that much cap space this year yeah there’s no point in having that much cap space like we we know that like there’s free agency class just isn’t that strong no matter who you’re interested in unless you’re going to do something irresponsible but like I I think to that point like you’re you’re definitely keeping Isaac I’m going to say that you renounce faults I think that’s both what I would like and what the front office will do uh Mo Vagner I think you keep Goa it depends on that Center position what what this front office does I think if you’re keeping Dell around and you’re signing a center you could put Dell on the bench and in a center whoever that is whether that’s Haren Stein or or Claxton or whoever at starting center and then you could let go go walk like but there is part of me with Wendell being like how how much will he be available would it be nice to have a third string guy but then you have Mo Vagner so it’s like in the regular season in most games Mo Vagner would be fine in that role so I do think that Goa could be gone um can you list a couple more of those no um chuma okk fron voder Jaylen Suggs I mean yeah you’re doing whatever with with with fron I think you’re giving him the the max there obviously and with chuma I mean probably gone like it’s been made clear he’s he’s done as far as actions that we’ve seen such as chuma not playing uh so yeah from those standpoints those are those are kind of my my takes on those yeah I think the only one like like Jaylen like I obviously you’re going to extend Jaylen I wouldn’t be shocked to see him come at you know like around 20 million a year somewhere in that ballpark I’ve talked about obviously your maxing France chuma is gone Goa is an interesting one just because I feel like he’s a guy that could be in line for a pay raise from another team given the way that he performed when Wendell was out and the way that the magic played when Wendell was out with go in the lineup so he might just be looking for hey like I I want to be a legitimate backup or I don’t think a team is going to pay him a starting salary but if he’s sold that other another team is like hey you’re going to be our full-time backup five and and we’re gonna you know pay you $8 million a year or whatever the case may be like if a team can give him that and guarantee him that that’s not something I think the magic can guarantee him because if you do go out and you upgrade it Center well then you still have Wendell and Mo vogner and even if you stick with Wendell you’re not going to just completely sit Mo Vagner like that’s not going to happen so I think Goa is is most likely gone yeah yeah no absolutely yeah I think that ultimately I don’t know if this is like ego driven to say this or or just there’s confidence in it I think like what I expect and what I want this front office to do kind of a line with with like those moves that we just talked about I think they do go after with the cap space that they’re going to likely have I think they do go after a starting center and I think they do go after a like a point guard that can as Pao stated himself want someone that can set the table I think they’re going to do it and I dude tus Jones is the most obvious signing that that that we could have like can shoot the ball like 41% last year on like four attempts a game or something and can set the table seven assists one turnover I’m at the point where I’ve looked at this dude’s basketball reference so many times think I could could say it in my sleep but like seven assists one turnover led the league and assisted turnover again and again and what he drops off defensively for you he’s going to give you productivity wise and the fact that he had the those assistance turnover ratios on the freaking Wizards and some instances made this made those guys look good that’s a hard thing to do that’s a that’s a really bad team in Washington and he was able to do that and not turn the ball over not get sloppy and at how fast-paced that team plays Super impressive all the way around I understand defensively he leaves a lot to be desired but it all goes back to what JJ reic said about the magic and adding an offensive Talent at some point you’re going to have to add a guy offensively where you lose things defensively you’re going to have to sacrifice on the defensive end and I think the identity is established enough that you go out and you get Ty Jones so I know that I have said tyus Jones name on this podcast probably 70 times in the last six months but get used to it you guys got me till July and I’m going to talk about tus Jones until he’s on the in Orlando Magic it just makes sense so I think yes ultimately we’ve gotten a little bit off track here but like Ty Jones or alike right there’s some talk with D’Angelo Russell I don’t know that I love it but if he got signed D’Angelo Russell like I get it like people love to hate D’Angelo Russell but you talk about a scoring guard like he he can do it and uh and and yeah I don’t know it’d be one of those things where let’s he’s on the level of Klay Thompson so don’t get it twisted but I talked about a few episodes ago like hey I don’t really want Klay Thompson but if he were to sign and I was to get that notification that like the magic sign Kay Thompson would I be excited absolutely it feels kind of the same with D’Angelo Russell where like I don’t really want it but if it happens there’s obviously like there’s going to be a part of me that just reads out I’m like whoa well I think what you get excited about is like okay okay what does the best case scenario look like with this signing and that’s what gets you excited but like unfortunately reality is so is going to be somewhere in between best and worst case scenario with those guys and that’s why for me like they’re they’re staya aways the last thing that I want to add is we’ve talked about Isaiah hartenstein Nick claxon those being some of the you know big names in terms of the the Center Market in this year’s free agency class reports have come out for both of those guys that they’re looking you know anywhere from like 18 to 25 million per year and I understand why on its face like why that value scares people for me if if I’m convinced that you know those guys are are going to work out here and there are going to be good fits and so on and so forth when you look at what the cap is going to be doing over the next couple of years like three years from now the cap is going to raise like $40 million and within the next like six or seven years the cap is going to raise by like a100 million it’s going to be like almost $250 million like six or seven seasons from now and when you look at like what some of these contract like comparisons are going to be in the next four to five years like $20 million is going to be the new like $12 million like that’s how much the cap is going to raise so if the magic sign one of these guys and especially if they’re able to like frontload these deals and you get hartenstein for like four years 80 million I I understand on its face it sounds crazy but when you look at one the amount of cap room that the magic have all of their upcoming deals they’re going to be able to have bird rights for Jaylen sugs for pao for fron those extensions aren’t going to you know kick in especially pao’s extension isn’t going to kick in for another three years from now so when you look at all of that like signing a a big deal at this point for guys like that especially if you’re expecting the guys to be starters right it it’s really not that bad like I don’t want anybody you know getting their Pitchfork and torches out if the magic sign Isaiah hartenstein to like a fouryear $80 million even like a fiveyear hundred million deal I think it I think it could be like 4 for 90 so like that would be that would be great but I’m I’m just saying like if if you see that number don’t all of a sudden freak out like keep in mind the financial flexibility that we will still have in place but also the way that the cap is going to rise over the next several years it’s it’s like we’re going to be seeing hundred million contracts in like the next a year like a year hundred million contracts within the next like 10 to 12 years like that is going to happen so so stup just keep that in mind that’s so much money it’s a lot of money yeah no that’s but yeah so front office great job a on my end and you’ve given us a reason to be excited this offseason so please don’t disappoint us I would agree with that so all right I think that’s going to do it for this one I know we’ve been talking about this but our next episode we’re really going to start diving more into the draft draft is coming up now in uh just over you know three weeks three and a half weeks something like that so we’ll start taking a look at the prospects that are you know expected to be in the the Magic’s range there we’ve already seen the New Orleans Pelicans who were owed a firstr draft pick by the Los Angeles Lakers due to the Anthony Davis trade they’re like nah we’re going to defer that to next year so there’s been a lot of talk about this draft that it might not be so great some people think it’s pretty good but not spectacular some people like the New Orleans Pelicans they might just think that this draft absolutely sucks they would rather have a first round pick in next year’s draft it’s probably happened before I don’t recall a team being owed a first round draft pick that has deferred it to another year I don’t remember that ever happening in the moment I was like wait they’re going to do what it’s like man this they must really think that this draft sucks so but we’re going to dive more into that we’ll talk more about that on the next episode we’ll get some guests in here get their opinions as well Luke that’s it for me I don’t know if you have any additional thoughts before we wrap this one up no go magic go magic as always uh for Luke syia this has been Jonathan Osborne you all have been listening to the six-man show and we will catch you guys next time see you thanks for listening to the Sixth Man Show be sure to subscribe on iTunes and Spotify to get new episodes downloaded directly to your phone if you enjoyed the show please take a minute to give us a five-star rating and a review it helps out the show a lot follow us on Twitter Instagram and Facebook @ 6man show we’ll catch you guys next time go magic let go go let’s go

Finishing our grades series with Head Coach Jamahl Mosley and the Orlando Magic front office. We discuss the progress Coach Mose has made, evaluate the moves the front office did & did not make this season, and look ahead to an offseason full of decisions.

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0:00 – Intro
6:09 – Coach Mosley Grades
25:15 – Patreon
26:56 – Front Office Grades
37:38 – Offseason Decisions

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