Can The Phoenix Suns Actually Trade Grayson Allen?

Can The Phoenix Suns Actually Trade Grayson Allen?

[Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] MCO happy trade machine Tuesday to all of you who celebrate and welcome in to another episode of The ph& X Sons podcast I’m Lindsay that’s Saul that’s Gerald that’s espo how you guys doing today good doing great hanging in there getting through excited for another episode of trade machine Tuesday apparently mentally not because I keep thinking it’s Wednesday so that’s fair listen I don’t blame you well we’re going to start Today’s Show not off with trade machine Tuesday but with a little story time from our dearest espo because on This Day in 1976 we got the shot heard around the world and ESO wants to take us back a little bit is that right so it’s one of the greatest moments in Sun’s history and if you don’t know about it triple overtime game in Boston Garden Sun Celtics in the finals this the Suns team shouldn’t have made the finals they were 41 and 41 they were a hot mess most of the regular season cot fire had to go up against the vaunted Celtics uh this game is insane it’s in the old Boston Garden it’s humid it’s hot it’s disgusting they uh they get into overtime and the Celtics hit a shot John havich hits it and they think the Celtics win right uh they the buzzer goes off final buzzer over uh fans rush the court uh start fighting the Suns they punch uh referee Ricky powers in the face and so they’re trying to clear the Corpus there’s still two seconds left on the clock but suns are down one and they have to take the ball under the basket Paul Westfall uh the great guard there is smart enough to understand the rule book that even though they don’t have a timeout if he calls timeout the Celtics get a free throw but the Suns get to advance the ball so Celtics hit the free throw Suns inbound the ball and gar herd hits of the greatest shots ever greatest shots ever in NBA history in finals history it was unbelievable they call it the shot call heard around the world and we have Al McCoy’s call of it one second remaining in the second overtime here’s Perry the gar herd here’s the jump shot good it’s good it counts gar herd Ty it we’ll go to the third overtime I got to take a breather I want to tell you something somebody up there is on our side oh and so much like every Suns fan who thinks that they weren’t the Suns wind up losing in overtime but it was still one of the great moments when you look at it the one of the great calls in Suns history and Al McCoy told me a story uh when I worked there he called me up to his office because he knew he was a big son’s history fan he pulls out this scorebook it’s the actual score sheet he kept from that game and he’s telling me as gar herd hit gets the ball a Celtics fan uh they’re right on top of you in the old Garden he passes out because the guy’s been drinking for four hours there he passes out across Al’s lap and he has to shove him off so he can stand see and make that call which is one I think that’s almost as good as the shot right you gotta throw a drunk Bostonian off your lap to make that call I loved it got a chance years later to meet all these guys and I have a record uh in my office that was from That season the co signed by most of the major players including gar herd and that so I wanted to share a little history where 48 years removed but it’s still one of the greatest uh things in Sun’s history to happen so I feel like I need more information about this random fan passing out on Al like what he literally sitting like this he was he was so drunk and there was no air conditioning in the Boston Garden it’s it’s in the 90s it’s 100% humidity it’s disgusting in there right and so he just passes out right on Al’s lap because they were that close this building was a dump I went there when I was like 11 before they tore it down and the building was a dump uh and you know and it was for all those years too it wasn’t as if it was just from Decay uh yeah it was just disgusting and he passed out and Al shoved him off his lap and made one of the greatest calls ever so that’s like an N1 in broadcasting right took the contact made the call good to keep to keep you focus enough to then make that call kudos to you all I love it well that’s a little story time with espo about an on this day Suns topic but we do have some Suns topics to get into here first and foremost yesterday we did get a little bit of an update from Brian windhorse that said that these Sons will resign Royce O’Neal and yes yes they will not only because the player but also because it’s the only option and the Suns have to create a little bit more flexibility for themselves down the road which we’ve been telling you guys uh for a little while here but if you didn’t want to believe us you can believe Brian whorse it’s happening because nothing else makes sense exactly I don’t even think that was sourced reporting I just he was like Source Common Sense come on he basically just said they’re gonna get it done which is what we’ve been saying they’re gonna resign him because it doesn’t make sense to let him walk they have no choice there you go but I mean it’s it’s true I mean I we could break that down a little bit more just to kind of give some context like obviously bringing Rey back he’s going to be a good asset for this team but as far as flexibility down the road and keep this in mind too Royce O’Neal is gonna get paid more than you think that Royce O’Neal should be paid but when you see that announcement come across your Twitter feed don’t freak out because the sons are going to overpay him so that they can potentially utilize him later on down the road if they feel so NE it’s it’s necessary for them to get better but you’re going to want to pay them a little bit more than whatever the mle is this year so you can trade for a guy potentially on that same type of money level contract because the Suns can send out somebody but they have to match um salaries like 100% to the dollar or less so that’s why he’s going to make more money then maybe you can bring in somebody who makes a little more money who’s maybe a little bit better that’s too logical I’m just saying 35 million for one year trade him with all the draft picks and get what you need now you’re getting a little too crazy over here whatever it takes I mean if he’s probably going to come in at like 13 to 15 million annually because like Lindsay mentioned that non-t taxpayer mle is going to be at about 12.9 million in salary for next season so if you have it a little bit higher that means that any player that signed for the mle this upcoming offseason once they become trade eligible then Royce O’Neal is a contract that you can trade for that player um so don’t be surprised if you here 3 years 39 million or 3 years 45 million or something like that um because it opens up trade flexibility later on down the line also they don’t get any cap space if they let him walk so letting him walk serves you you’re not going to get a player better than Royce O’Neal on a vet minimum so resigning him is quite literally the only thing they should do as the second tax apron team do you really see them going over two years though because of the cap space that you’re hoping you have in that 26 off season to me two years at an escalated price where you’re like look man nobody else is going to pay you this over the next two years uh that feels like the sweet spot for me I mean it is I’m just giving an example like it it it’s probably going to be somewhere in the two to three year range probably annually 133 to 15 million something like that that would be my guess and then he becomes if you keep that 2031 pick he becomes the the cost of doing business then for that pick all right so now that that’s off the table uh do want to remind you guys that we have some really cool events coming up here at phnx over the next couple of months first and foremost we’ve got Mercury takeovers happening this summer and the first one is on June 13th the second one is August 26 and just like the Suns takeovers you get a ticket to the game pregame party with food and drink included these are lower level tickets by the way uh and these tickets are flying so make sure you get yourself ATT ticket while you can over at go.com takeovers are always so much fun and I’m so glad that we’re finally being able to do some Mercury tickets as well also if you’re a Die Hard you do get a discount on all of our events so now is a great time to become a die hard and take advantage of that discount as well we also have the phnx Cardinals trip to Miami just around the corner happening in October you don’t want to miss out on this one so make sure again head on over to go phx.com to get all the information on all the upcoming events that we’ll be hosting because there’s even more than just these two I’m telling you about right now fun fact you go to the Mercury takeover I will foul you hard so you get the true W experience oh boy oh boy uh you you have to opt in for that one just so you 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talk about the disclaimer bonus bets expire in 7 days one new customer offer only gambling problem call 18800 gamble available in the US call 8778 Hopey 467 369 New York call 18800 32755 massachusett 21 plus only please gamble respons call 1800 Next Step Arizona 1800 bets off Iowa 18800 98123 Rico first bet offer for new customers only subject to eligibility requirements bonus bets are non-withdrawable in partnership with Kansas Crossing Casino and Hotel see bgm.com for terms us promotional offers not available in New York Nevada North Carolina Ontario or Puerto Rico get stuffed onario look uh one of my favorite bands Lawrence is dropping a new album here this month and I want to see them badly they’re coming to town in October and I think I’m going to use my friends over at game time to find some cheap tickets there usually I I like to buy my tickets in advance but I found when using game time I actually am better when I procrastinate because I can save up to 60% on those tickets for last minute deals and I also know that if I inevitably get fired here they’re going to protect me and my purchase by giving me my money back so if I get cancelled for something stupid on this show I still get my money back for my tickets I don’t have to worry about that I love that but I also love we call it teaser yeah I also love The Flash Deals that they have have that where tickets can go on sale at any time and get even lower prices or their Zone deals where you pick where you’re going to sit and then they’ll give you the seats that they think are best it’s kind of like playing a a a version of Russian roulette with your seats and I love it I I think it’s a fun way except for it’s a win-win all I mean it is yeah I’m not yeah it’s a much better result you’re get the other way but I love there’s a little excitement with buying my tickets more so than the regular so it’s fun but I got a great deal for you they’re going to take care of you when you sign up today they’re going to take the guest work out of buying your tickets and they’re also going to give you $20 off your first purchase when you download the app and create an account using that code pH andx terms apply as with all this stuff we know how that goes again though create that account and redeem the code phnx for $20 off download game time today last minute tickets lowest prices guaranteed all right Eric hit it trade machine Tuesday trade machine Tuesday train machine [Music] Tuesday now that Espo’s got his vetman Monday thing that he stole from me with the Applause at the end I feel like this kind of weak we need a revamped version I’m not but is it I don’t know am I just feeling some type of way or does it really need to be you’re jealous you don’t have Applause yeah he’s a one uper yeah I didn’t make it Eric made it well I mean especially considering like I was like hey let’s do vetman Monday and then was like yes let me make the build on each other they’re like Bosom Buddies over here and I’m just like uh okay oh no they are like the very best friends in the world those two think is thieves these two hit it V minim Monday V minimum Monday V minim Monday V minimum [Music] Monday so goddamn extra right Happ now ouring is off hit the trade machine Tuesday again trade machine Tuesday TR all right it is Tuesday so we are talking trades and today we’re gonna dive into trades around Grayson Allen now first and foremost the biggest disclaimer of them all Grayson Allen cannot be traded until mid- October so all of these hypothetical trades are about to go through would have to happen later on that’s the biggest disclaimer what is the biggest disclaimer is we don’t want Grayson Allen to be traded just so you all know that we’re just throwing some thoughts out there for you all that’s all well I feel like shoot at this rate we need to go through a whole laundry list of disclaimers um Gerald why don’t you go ahead and list off yours the first it’s the first half of his article I know all the disclaimers I’m getting exhausted um yeah like Saul said this is not us saying that they should trade Grayson Allen or that they’re even thinking about it right now but there has been a lot of talk about needing an upgrade at Wing needing to upgrade your Center rotation uh and Grayson Allen might be your best Avenue to doing that even if you have to wait until October that does take a lot of this year’s draft picks off the table obviously the Suns would not be able to trade their number 22 overall pick in any Grayson Allen deal that we’re talking about because by then they would have used that pick or traded it or something like that so we’re looking at things we’re trying to project forward to October teams that still might need shooting um players that might be available at that point in time and again this is not an exercise in this is what the Suns should or shouldn’t do this is an exercise in here’s what they could do here’s what is allowed under the new CBA as a second tax apron team and part of what makes this difficult is that there are some teams that are not currently in the second tax apron that could very easily get there in free agency at which point these would need to be three team deals and that further complicates things because as we know a second tax team cannot take back a single extra dollar than they’re sending out they cannot aggregate outgoing salaries so we’re going to come to a point here pretty soon in the NBA off season where off Seasons trade deadlines are not as exciting because there’s going to be a lot of teams that are in this tax apron territory that don’t have a ton of flexibility to make moves anymore boo CJ Mulla Bo damn you Players Association our our whole trade Shenanigans our offseason fun come on you know what I love is how different the chat is from when we traded for Grayson Allen to now why did we trade for Grayson Allen and now it’s do not trade Grayson Allen and I love it because again we don’t want to but the reality of these situations is you got to give up something to get something and if you want to try to improve this team you have to do these thought experiments to figure out what’s the best uh way to do it and Within These thought experiments too there will be times where you can look at a guy and say I don’t know if I’m willing to move Grayson Allen for that person which we might um see quite a bit so to start things off here we’ll just roll through Grayson Allen stats from this season 13.5 points per game 3.9 rebounds three assists 49.9% from the field 46.1% from Deep on 5.9 attempts per game okay so there’s just kind of your Baseline of where to start but we’ll dive into uh Trading Grayson Allen for some bigs shall we first on the list Mitchell Robinson he’s 26 years old averaged 5.6 points per game 8.5 rebounds per game6 assists per game but in only 31 games this season uh and also toss in there a 2025 first round pick as well which might end up being more valuable than Mitchell Robinson himself yes because he’s always hurt yes and like he gives you great production down low he’s gives you a lot of effort he’s strong defensively down low on the perimeter he’s a little weaker um has he struggled especially in space out there on the perimeter so you kind of run into some of the same issues in terms of you know what you’re going to try and do um at that Center position to try and match up with teams that try to spread you out but um he’s a good player he’s just his health history has not been the greatest yeah I I think this is too risky for me like that 2025 first round pick it would be a top four protected pick coming from the Milwaukee Bucks and you know the Bucks are not the title Contender that we thought they would probably be but they’re not going to be bad enough to where that pick is like a valuable pick by any means I like Robinson like defensively he blocks a lot of shots he’s also a beast on the offensive glass he’s one of the best offensive rebounders and putb guys in the league but he’s not very efficient around the rim and he kind of chases blocks quite a bit uh this stat blew my mind a little bit opponent shot 5.4% better at The Rim when Mitchell Robinson was contesting than they would normally shoot which is not exactly defensive anchor material I think only playing 31 games might have played into that number a little bit but he he’s just not healthy enough for me to feel like I can trade a starting caliber guy who led the league in three-point percentage and be comfortable with getting him back could you imagine could you imagine nerk eight Miss free layups at The Rim Here Comes Mitchell Robinson eight more Miss layups at The Rim like oh my God continuity baby consistency we all wanted it James Joe has got a type look I look at this like okay Grayson Allen’s the old way Chipotle used to fill fill your bowl and this trade is the new way where you get like half of what you used to get in it and I’m supposed to feel like good about that no I just there this to me doesn’t improve the Suns I think it’s a okay you get a little bit of draft Capital but that doesn’t interest me all that much because you’re all in right now I I say I say no to this pretty quick yeah yeah this one is a hard pass for me but the next one maybe you think is a little bit better we’ve got Grayson Allen in exchange for Wendell Carter Jr uh so he is 25 years old also averaged 11 points per game 6.9 rebounds per game 1. 1.7 assists shot 37.4% from Deep while attempting 3.1 threes a game so that is an aspect of of his game that is valuable to the Suns team yeah he he doesn’t take a ton of Threes but he shot them pretty efficiently he’s worked pretty well uh to improve that area of his game recently so he provides more of a floor spacing component that the sun’s currently don’t have and something that Mike buen holer has had uh in his last two stops in Atlanta and Milwaukee my thing is he’s kind of got some similar concerns in terms of like the health Factor um I think he’s only played what was it 62 games in a season that’s his career high so far he missed 27 last year so he’s a good big he’s a better defensive big um he actually did hold opponents to wor shooting at The Rim which is a good thing and he was unlike Mitchell Robinson a really good finisher around the basket I think he shot 73% at The Rim this year which is really really good that would be an improvement from nerk but um again I I don’t I don’t know if this moves the needle far enough this is one of the bigs that I like the most out of the list that kind of fit within his contract um and the magic could use shooting still right now but will they still need shooting come October are you look are you looking at Carter to be that that backup center or are you starting power forward I would probably look at him as the starting center to be honest with you or at least the backup center who then probably becomes the starting center depending on the playoff matchup um but but is it worth giving up Grayson for a backup SL starting this is the closest I think I’ll get um with all the proposals because I think Grayson Allen just provides you so much consistency um and the ball handling uh when we saw that you know this team could struggle uh once KD book or Beal were not on the court so I what are you replacing with that you’re replacing him with uh again things that they need they need length they need athleticism they need younger players like and I think he definitely checks those boxes though there are concerns of his I think he’s a good solid allaround player so could be convinced to like this trade I think this is the closest I would get but um yeah I mean I think every single one of these guys has concerns yeah hell even Grayson when he came here we had concerns about him but they all seem to work out I think there’s two contingencies on this right Orlando doesn’t get the shooter they want in in the off season right and the Suns move nerk and get guys that solidify other areas but they don’t feel confident come octob and training camp or preseason time where they’re at at the center position and then you can might have to consider a deal like this right where you don’t necessarily want to give up Grayson but you understand roster construction might require you two if you’re not feeling confident where you are but I really would prefer they didn’t put themselves in a situation where an October you’re like well I don’t really trust what we did from a big man perspective you know because then and I saw somebody online saying this do you wind up trading your point guard issues if you get a point guard for just a giant hole at Center where you’re trying to do the same thing so yeah maybe you’re considering this in October but I think that would mean you’ve done some things uh June through you know through September that might not have put you in the best position and that that’s kind of the conclusion I’ve been coming to with the trades for nasier little the trades for Usef nerkish now for Grayson Allen this week for the people that are asking asking in the chat what we’re doing here because these players are worse than Grayson well if the disclaimers didn’t spell it out for you here it is this team is going to have to struggle to improve their roster there are not a lot of moves out there that you’re going to make that are home run moves that you’re like oh yeah that definitely was a good move you’re probably if you are going to make moves you’re going to have to make a second subsequent move to address whatever position of need you now have after that trade like these second tax apron restrictions really limit what you can do and trust me I’m trying like I’ve gone through all 30 teams cap sheet to figure out which salaries match and which ones work there’s not a lot of good options out here so that’s kind of the point of this whole thought exercise like you’re not going to get that much better with a Grayson Allen trade but these are some options that might put you close so you’re our Matt tellum just looking at everything trying I’m sure I’m sure he’s probably got better ideas but there’s really not a lot you can do here guys well and it also just kind of sets the stage that if and likely when the Suns do kind of run things back in a similar way obviously you’re going to Tinker around the margins and different vet minimum contracts in here and you’re maybe frustrated towards the beginning of the Season like why didn’t we do anything right because we couldn’t do a whole lot that would actually make a big difference because this is the type of stuff you’d be able to do but then you have to give up something for that and we don’t have a lot of assets to be able to give up no um and the ones that we do we don’t really really want to yep so you know what I mean I’m just saying uh at 25 though there’s room to grow potentially there maybe yeah and everyone does say they want us to get pretty young or they want us to get younger instead of older I mean he’s he’s more athletic he’s more of what you’re kind of looking for in that big man spot he’s not perfect by any means and the injury stuff is a little concerning so I I get it’s not an overwhelming trade scenario for sure yes all right next up we’ve got graceon Allen for Jen Nick Richards and Trey man as well as a 2027 first round pick so Richards averaged 9.7 points per game eight rebounds point8 assists and 1.1 blocks per game man averaged 9.3 points per game 3.6 rebounds four assists shot 45.9% from the field and 37.3% from Deep this deal feels like if you completely struck out in the off season and in October you’re like well [ __ ] this is exactly the same team we came into training camp with last year and I don’t feel very good about that uh let’s add a few other pieces Trey man’s interesting you would get draft Capital we’ve talked about Nick Richards and and what he could be potentially as a backup center but again is is sending a guy who obviously is more talented uh than those two out and hoping the potential of those those two guys can help fill enough of the holes that you have to make up for it worth it I I don’t think so but you know honestly it really depends on what do your vet minimums look like you know do you believe you’ve gotten better in those places or are you literally you know running it back with those guys that came back because of their player options with maybe one or two other vet minimum guys that weren’t here last year yeah I mean Nick Richards keeps coming up he’s come up in every trade machine Tuesday that we’ve done so far and it’s for a reason because he brings things to the table that the Suns could need he’s an elite screen Setter in terms of screen assists and that was playing with a Charlotte Hornets team that didn’t have a lot of great scores or ball handlers there um he was third in the NBA in screen assists per 75 possessions which is really good and he was in the 99th percentile in points per possession as a rle man so he brings a lot of Bounce a lot of athleticism a lot of finishing ability around the basket which would pair well with the Suns big three in the pick and roll my concern is that maybe those skills don’t translate quite as well to a more competitive team like was he putting up good numbers on a bad team or was he flashing real things that he could bring to an actual Contender that’s kind of my struggle with him and and kind of same with Trey man honestly just had a different position I I thought he played really well for Charlotte when he came there but you know is he starting caliber is Nick Richards starting caliber would you trade a you know League leader in three-point percentage for two backups and a 2027 pick I I don’t know if that’s enough value you’d be taking a swing for sure hell no he just gonna hang on to Grayson you pass on this one no nope I’m yeah I’m holding on Grayson for dear life on that one there’s no way I just I think there’s just too much unpredictability with those two yeah um for a team that’s trying to win a championship I I know they’re far away from but still like you can’t go backwards and bringing these guys in they could work out they could not work out they kind of feel like honestly they kind of feel like a different version of at minimum guys that we brought in last year and you hope it works I don’t know if it will yeah I I wonder though if you look at it is it easier to find a guy that can hit threes at a decent clip or is it easier to find that Rim rolling big and a backup point guard and does that start to come in to it do you feel a rim rolling big can actually to your point make things easier on the big three potentially make it where the the offense makes a little bit more sense for these guys and maybe you take a five percentage Point hit on who’s shooting those threes you know but you know but does that make them better these are the kind of things that they’re going to be asking themselves in the room knowing that they have so few options and have to explore this but the great thing about this though because of the scenario that Grayson is in and the fact that he can’t be traded until October is you have plenty of time in the offseason to find you know maybe that Rim running big if you can get them in the draft or maybe there’s a you know some other smaller trade that can that can happen to Shore that up or a three-point shooter either one of those two and so I think you have plenty of time to identify what you’re really going to need by the time you get to a scenario if this ever presented itself in real life uh to trade Grayson Allen I just don’t see it because what you when what you’re losing in in Grayson is not just the three-point shooting he’s such a good all-around player too I think we we kind of you know we didn’t we didn’t really understand that that’s what we were getting when we got him last year and then he surprised us all with with his with his level of play so you know Nick Richards I don’t feel like would be a good tradeoff um I don’t think both of them would so you I think you bring up a good point though because if you find a guy that you feel really good about from a three-point shooting perspective or a couple guys in other moves maybe you do that point explore in October or at the trade deadline or whenever options with with Allen to not that you want to but if you feel like there are still problems you know that you’re trying to fix I would say that if I had to replace one or the other or if I wanted to find one or the other I would more at want to find the rim running big than I would the perimeter shooter because I I feel like um if you’re going with the rim running big that frees up the perimeter and obviously the other parts of book KD Beal’s game that you want to be freed up and we didn’t really have that last year they tried to make Drew Eubanks that guy but he just wasn’t so I think and I think that’s a little bit more reliable at The Rim than a perimeter shooter especially once you get the playoff time I mean youve seen Lively is just going crazy but they’re [ __ ] all dunks you know I mean like it’s not like they’re asking them to shoot whereas you know you start having to come up with those clutch buckets and and you know crunch time changes the narrative a little bit when you’re shooting from 30 feet out so you bring up Lively the afro buzz in the chat said we don’t need uh to make moves per se Eubanks can do what Lively does if we build some chemistry do you feel like Eubanks could be closer to that Eubanks has got good athleticism but he’s not nearly the the standing ver type of dude that Derek Lively is plus he’s not as tall as him and he’s not as long as him either those two factors matter he gets about another foot advantage over Drew Eubanks uh than than Drew has so I think that’s a big difference there and I do I do agree that like this is a roster that you don’t need to make a drastic move I think if you Tinker around the margins like we’ve identified they need bigger more defensive minded wings um you know upgrade the center rotation that doesn’t necessarily mean replacing nerk but it does mean having more alternatives for those playoff series where nurk can’t stay on the floor backup point guard like two of those three things I think you can get most of what you need on at the center spot and backup point guard spot with that minimums it’s the defensive minded wings that if you’re looking for starting caliber or even playoff rotation caliber wings like those are probably the ones that you’re hoping you can trade for but again like a lot of these options are pretty limited teams aren’t just going to give up starting caliber wings uh even with Grayson you know being in the mix if if that’s what we’re talking about here yeah and the toughest thing too is you don’t know what impact who hoer is going to have how much does he fix in what you had last year there’s so many question marks about about all this that that I think that adds a level of a degree of difficulty this off season because you really don’t know with him how much it’s going to affect so how much do you change uh you know and and how much can that impact all of it yeah all right last one from The Bigs group plus an extra uh we’ve got Grayson Allen for Larry Nance Jr Jose Alvarado and a 2026 first round pick so this is not going to be great for the people who want us to get younger because Grayson is 28 Jose is 29 Larry Nance is 31 Nance averaged 5.7 points five rebounds and 1.9 assists per game this season Alvarado averaged 7.1 points 2.3 rebounds 2.1 assists shot 41.2% from the field and 37.7% from d I mean listen we know what Alvarado brings and we know we could use that on this team but do you like Larry n Jr I don’t think you were fair about the age thing that 20 26 pick is 16 right now I mean you’re right I’m sorry I totally forgot about that no I this doesn’t make you better this is a feels like a trade to make a trade because you hope the depth does something and I just and you’re helping you’re helping New Orleans get better which in any of these moves you can’t make one of these teams that’s right there in the west with you any better because you’re shooting yourself in the foot so yeah and and like the 2026 pick it would be swap rights with Milwaukee so it’s not like an outright first pick either so this this deal is I think like you said you’re trading a the best player for two depth pieces like we know the Suns need a backup point guard we know they need a point of attack Defender Al can do that Larry Nance offers you a different look at Center he can play the four he can play small ball five um and he’s he’s actually a really good screen Setter and finisher around the rim as well but like you’re still giving up the best player in the trade and that’s where I have a hard time with this is are you giving up Talent just to address positions of need when you could try to address those with slightly lesser players in free agency that’s kind of where I struggle with it yeah no I’m good I don’t like either one of these players I I I I like Alvarado like if he was on my team I’d really love him but I don’t no I’m good with this trade again Grayson I think is just too valuable yeah uh Grayson is just what can we say he’s a part of our Inner Circle we don’t want to let him go because he brings so much joy and benefits to our lives the same way being a part of Circle K’s free membership program also brings so much joy and benefit to our lives if you have not signed up sign up today first and foremost upon signing up you save 25 cents per gallon on your first five fill-ups you save three three cents per gallon every single day and you get member exclusive deals in the Circle K app as well like every six free on a selection of Circle K products Polar Pops and frosters right now through September 3rd are just. 79 but if you are an inner circle member that drops down to just 69 nice plus you’ll get even more deals and coupons when you are a part of the free membership program Inner Circle so don’t wait join Inner Circle for free by downloading the Circle K app today terms and conditions apply at participating locations visit Circle k.com for all the details um just as a quick reminder in case you need an extra treat for today uh I told you this multiple times but the dark chocolate covered almonds at Circle K are some of the best dark chocolate covered almonds I’ve had in a minute okay and they’re super affordable cuz usually they’re so expensive these are bomb and really affordable so just a little Pro tip for you Gerald you I have a bone to pick with you yeah what’s that uh I received a cease and desist letter afterno from the h you didn’t company because you tweeted at them so now I have to come up with new voices to torture you and today I will be doing the next day the devil you know is better than the devil you don’t I’m sorry I’m sorry guys kind of guy that Gerald likes so yes Four Peaks we’re talking about them the best beer in Arizona in the country based on analytics I’m done with that what that it’s just a nerd I just thought I’d throw that out there uh now look I love Four Peaks and if you’re not a nerd like Gerald and you just want a good beer they’ve got you covered and Gerald likes a good beer too uh I’m a big fan of the wow wheat Jerald what do you like I like thebody cares what you like that’s rights unnecessary the Suns Brew is fantastic as is the kiltlifter but right now on a bad birdie juicy gold nail kick uh it’s a collab between bad birdie uh and and our friends at Four Peaks I drink it on the golf course you can drink it at the Race Street Pub or wherever you want so if you want to find where you can get great Four Peaks beer and enjoy it you can find it at for peaks.com slator and make sure to check him out on social Four Peaks Brew or at Four Peaks Pub to keep up the latest at Arizona’s Hometown Brewery must be 21 or older to drink Four Peaks and please enjoy responsibly all right a couple super chats before we continue on and talk about some more trades involving Grayson Allen Saint ship bag sent us one and they said love being a die hard love everything you guys do appreciate your hard work my favorite site thing about being a Die Hard is getting to beat Saul in fantasy football you you let somebody beat you wow I took a lot of L’s this year wow he let everybody in the building beat him too w wow are you going to Waffle House yeah oh man oh shoot you’re doing the 24-hour Waffle House challenge oh that’s rough we’re have to live stream that yeah but you see but you see people co-signing on [ __ ] that they didn’t even participate in like come on now I want to see you go to The Waffle House I didn’t participate in fantasy football I still want to see it but thank you Saint we appreciate you um if you want to sign up to be a Die Hard go to go phx.com uh see why not 100 sent us one and they said the Clippers trying to get off the second apron with the renegotiation of Paul George and James Harden contracts do you think if they start moving contracts do you think there’s a chance to get a guy like coffee or man um for Grayson or just in general for in general might be in general but it might be for Grayson I don’t know I it kind of of depends on what they’re doing because if Paul George and James Harden walk yes you’re under the second apron but that team is in a new arena with an aggressive owner who’s willing to spend and they still have kawhai and they just signed tyo to an extension they want to keep ibots around so like what is their plan I don’t know if they would ship off like you know decent Talent on really nice Team friendly contracts it would depend on what they’re looking for so it’s hard to project that forward without knowing okay what direction are they going to Pivot in even tougher because you’re doing it with an Inc conference rival somebody that’s like right there neck and neck with you and I just don’t see that happening yeah if Harden or or PG go They’re Gonna Be star hunting like because Balmer wants to make a giant Splash in that market with this new building uh with everything they’re doing the Rebrand new jerseys he doesn’t want to roll out there with PG and a bunch of guys that look like they should have been on the 2018 Suns right he wants to make a giant Splash so he’ll be he’ll be looking at bigger names if those guys walk or even if if they renegotiate they’re going to be looking for for other guys that can help them win now yeah all right next up we’ve got Alex Caruso and Tory Craig come on down we’re back so Caruso average 10.1 points per game 3.8 rebounds 3.5 assists shot 46.8% from the field 40.8% from Deep on 4.7 seven attempts and Tory Craig Love Of Our Lives average 5.7 points per game 4.1 rebounds and 1.1 assist yes I’ve seen this movie before I I don’t know a I don’t know that the Bulls do it in general because nobody knows what the Bulls are right now nobody can figure figure out what they’re trying to do or accomplish right at this point but Caruso May sense helps would help this team in a lot of areas again H what how you feeling the role though to sa’s point you need guys that are that are hitting from Deep on a regular basis we know what Grayson Allen can be Tory Craig is your 11th guy like he’s not he’s not making an impact as much as we’d love to have you back in the valley Tor but yeah I again it’s a lateral move to me at best you know yeah I think it it hand your point of attack Defender because this guy is backto back all defensive team honors like I I don’t want to overlook that and unlike a lot of the defensive minded guys we’ve had over the last couple years he can shoot like he can stay on the floor offensively double digit score last year but you’re right like you’re trading a high volume shooter really efficient best in the league shooter for a shooter who’s good on middle to lower volume but not to Grayson’s extent and like you said Tory Craig is not your starting Wing by any means he’s a he’s another bench piece so and and like like the Bulls we don’t know what they’re doing but if they are going to do anything it’s not going to be taking on a win now piece when they’re in this state of turmoil where they don’t know where they’re going true do you think they could get more potentially well they always think that they could get more but I honestly think they might be able to get a little bit more like a Grayson Allen type plus a little bit of draft I don’t know if I don’t know if they’ll get more in terms of player they trying to weren’t they asking for yeah they were they were asking for the sun and the moon for Zack LaVine and look what they’re doing now they’re like [ __ ] we’ll give them awayo anybody want them you wait too long I mean Chicago is not gonna do better playerwise I think than Grayson Allen but draft pickwise like assetwise I think they’ll be targeting more future assets and with where they’re at what do they value more right well but that’s the I mean they could surprise everybody and still be trying to win like and which would be crazy mind numbing everybody but dear de rozan they’re going to put the whole franchise on his back at 37 let’s go that would be wild um so this next one would be wonderful uh to an extent obviously we would Miss Grayson Allen of course but we would get KOB sound it doesn’t sound like return uh this is great for all those people who want us to get younger he’s 24 years old averaged 19.1 points per game 5.1 assists 4.5 rebounds shot 44.7% from the field 37.6% from Deep on seven attempts per game wow wow wow that’s love bro that’s love plus you get Robin Lopez’s hair back in a better player so that too the Bulls would never do this no they get so much more if they decided to so if they did offer this then yes you take it you run you run as fast as you can to the bank but yeah immediately there’s no way they’re doing this see this is the hardest part though about this whole entire exercise because there’s another one that we have coming up here in just a minute is that like some of these younger guys who you can who can be super valuable to you for a really long time are almost impossible to actually acquire via trades because why on Earth would somebody give them up you know what I mean so realistically if you want to get younger which I know is a huge thing for us at this point you only really have the draft or hope that you can find guys we talked about with Derrick Jones Jr a little bit yesterday which he’s not super super young but like somebody that a team has already quote unquote given up on but a lot of a lot of teams especially if you have cap I’m not going to give up on you because it’s not hurting me to keep you around and see if we can help continue to to develop you and see what you can turn into with a little bit more time under your belt so you’re saying they should go after Dereck Williams is what you’re saying drick Jones no Derrick Williams der Williams number three pick someone who’s everyone given up he just needs a second chance he’s only 35 right now only 35 still young I got a point guard that dominated in Arizona high school basketball and has some records he’s only 44 that could that deserves a chance again too so I’ll be your agent Mike Biby is pretty pretty available he’s available he’s too jacked for that now that’s true I don’t know if he can shoot look I I think we are we’re all in agreement the Bulls are never doing this trade it makes sense he was second and most improv player voting this year um but he’s a good example of guys that can change their entire perception in a year because last year it was kind of feeling like okay what are the Bulls going to do with this guy he’s like a backup point guard he’s very inefficient he’s not like the best but this year he put up 195 and five took seven threes a night and shot 38% on those threes and winds up second and most improved player like this is kind of you need to Target youth for reason and understand that maybe for the first three or four years they’re going to put up inflated stats where they’re not going to look that great but it can come together and suddenly we’re talking about Kobe white as a guy that oh yeah the Bulls would never trade that guy so it is interesting that over the course of a year how much one good season can change a player’s perception like we’re talking about with Grayson Allen too because at the start of this season a lot of people were against it not everyone but a lot of people were against it and now we’re talking about him like nah why would we trade him we just extended him and he led the league in three-point percentage true um same same situation with this next guy so we’ve got Grayson Allen for Denny AA 23 years old average 14.7 points per game 7.2 rebounds 3.8 assists shot 50.6% from the field 37.4% from Deep on 3.1 attempts per game what why would Washington let him go because they owe us they owe us after last season he took the worst contract in the NBA off their hands stop he is not Jordan BL they owe us they owe us he is not Jordan PA you will take this deal and you will like it oh man that is not not remotely true but uh no I mean if you need a wing who can defend who can do a little playm who shot the ball really well from three Denny abdia checks all of those boxes he’s younger he’s only 23 years old like Lindsay said it was 157 and4 on 50% shooting 37% from three and he’s a really good Defender he’s 6′ n he’s got length he’s a he’s a well-rounded player the problem is like Lindsay alluded to the Wizards are all in on like a long-term rebuild or they should be so giving up Denny for a more of a win now 28-year-old like Grayson they would be really really dumb if they did that yeah yeah but they are dumb they are a dumb organization maybe they decided hey just kidding we do want to win now I don’t think maybe we could get lucky I mean listen and they could just turn things around I mean Landrew shamet is the future of that franchise moving on come on come on I mean hey hello said it best he said without shamet we didn’t go as far you know what I I forgot they did take shamet so I take back you owe us part you already did your your service for us oh man all right next we’ve got Grace and Allen heading out for Josh giddy Kendrick Williams and a 2025 first round pick is this a swap too jald um or just a pick I think it was a swap let me I think it might have been a pick through Philly yeah it’s a Philly pick that’s protected in the top eight I believe top six top six okay you could just spin a wheel and pick any of the million picks that right they have they have plenty to choose from so but a pick nonetheless yes how much how much Grayson make uh 15.6 million works in the giddy machine so oh come on so Josh giddy’s 21 Kendrick Williams 29 giddy averaged 12.3 points per game 6.4 rebounds uh 4.8 assists shot 47.5% from the field 33.7 from Deep Williams averaged 4.7 points three rebounds 1.3 assist shot 46.8 from the field and 39.7 from Deep with two attemp times per game yes no maybe even if you ignore all the kind of icky offc court stuff in the investigation there like I I don’t think that giddy makes you better like yes he is a six foot eight point forward so he checks that box on paper but the lack of three-point shooting will matter at some point even playing with the big three around him and like I I love Kenny Hustle but he’s a backup player he lost minutes in the playoffs he barely played for the Thunder same with Josh giddy like if you’re looking at guys who can actually be in a playoff rotation on a good team I don’t know that either of these guys are there yet maybe this is a time to buy low on a guy like giddy just from a basketball perspective but it’s hard to do that and I I don’t know I don’t know that they bring exactly what you need yeah I mean I think if you’re gonna find some young guy that could lived up live up to potential you’re going to have to buy a distressed asset and now I’m not I’m not saying gidy that guy but that’s what you’re going to have to look for and hope a team just wants to get off the contract and and they want they want a fresh start they want that guy to have a fresh start but in the immediate I don’t know that this actually would put you any closer to a title and that’s what this team as much as people want to say Well they’re not a title Contender that’s what this front office what this team is still thinking and looking at at least for this year so you’re going to make moves with that thought in mind and I don’t think this is one that puts you closer to that goal yeah I I want to stay as far away from this as possible that’s fair so our consensus is we’re gonna just hang on that would be the sensible thing but I I will say like we’re g to re revisit all of these trade scenarios whoever’s on the team come October come December when a lot of these recently signed guys over the summer become trade eligible but for the time being it’s hard to project that far forward and this is kind of the drill like this is what we’re doing every week we’ve only got seven players under contract so we’re going through every single one of them uh even if they don’t feel realistic or like they make the Suns better that’s kind of the point of the exercise can I one other thing with Grayson though are is anybody afraid that we saw the best of what you’re going to get and that there is a a fallback you know next year for Grayson and are you in a situation where you can sell at the peak and get more than say if he regresses next year all of a sudden to more of who he’s been uh is that potentially why you would consider making a move because if you’re just looking last season versus last season with guys a lot of these you go yeah I wouldn’t but if you go if I feel like Grayson might regress is this guy a better solution for the upcoming season and into the future as well because he’s another guy you had to resign right you had no choice but like we talk about with Royce O’Neal was that done in part because you wanted the flexibility to potentially make a move if you don’t think he really is that guy long I don’t think that I’m not so afraid that Grayson he might not hit the percentages that he did this year especially from three next year but if he’s anywhere around that 40% clip then that’s better than most of the league anyway and for what this team does and the identity that they’re trying to to have you need good players that are willing to defer to the other three and Grayson is obviously shown that in Spades this season while also knowing when he can step up and hit shots um and I thought he did that very well yeah he disappeared in the playoffs but so did most of the team like like it’s not a big deal that he disappeared in the playoffs I think he’s going to be fine and I think that he is a valuable player more than just three-point shooting I just think that he does a lot of little things out there on the court that make a difference and it’s not necessarily just in the statistical uh categories either I also think you have to take into consideration that Grayson was hurt in the playoffs you what I mean I understand that you’re frustrated as a whole with the playoffs not you but just in general um but like if anyone could get a little bit of a pass I feel like it’s the guy who is genuinely injured and playing through it as best as could have for the team he played like four quarters in that whole series and it was because he had two fluke in it wasn’t like he was hurt all year and dealt with this injury he landed on his ankle wrong twice in back-to-back games and had to leave both those G like saying Grayson Allen did nothing in the playoffs okay did you watch the playoffs because he wasn’t out there he hurt his ankle twice um but yeah I I think it’s an interesting question to ask though about like would they be selling High uh and I think there’s a case to be made like he’s not going to shoot 46% from three again but he was a really nice F he might he might but he was a really nice fit next to the big three and I don’t think you trade that unless you are sure you’re getting something that makes you better Kevin in the chat along along the vein of what Saul said said on the flip side what if he shoots better next year from you know I assume he’s meeting from three good Lord Kev I’m gonna I’m gonna make a deal with you uh if he shoots better next year then than he did this year from deep I will buy you a Grayson Allen Jersey because I do not believe that that is is likely or even really in the realm of possibility for how well he shot last year at 46% CP it Kev and kill killer Rex said uh earlier uh said bro was injured a lot too this season and and in the playoffs I mean he was injured in the playoffs he miss two games that that’s true but he played 75 games this season it’s not he was not injured a lot I didn’t I don’t know I don’t know what a lot is it was one of our healthiest players yeah he was out there as consistent as anybody else so I don’t know what to tell you uh there are more trades we didn’t go through all of them there are more in Gerald’s article 5,000 more in his article go check it out so if you hated these ones go see if any of those ones might uh make you feel better and if not don’t tweet about it what’s awesome too is you can print out the whole PDF and you can use it as wallpaper for your entire house for the entire house oh boy it’s pretty dope I and and they I did to my bathroom they all work together so like our previous trade machines and our future ones they all they’re all it’s like a continuation so it’s it’s like a monthlong project you you sit in the like public stalls and you look around on the [ __ ] that people were WR around it’s like that for your for your own house you can put it in the room that you go sit in when you’re really sad and depressed about the SS I call it my hello darkness my old friend room really glad my writing brings such Joy to the World you have an impact Gerald a negative one but an impact nonetheless by the way Brian I did wear the Ewok costume last year on the show it was kind of weak because it was technically like a sweatshirt it was such a find it I couldn’t I’m just GNA say this I’m GNA go to Wala house for 24 hours it would be cool to see an actual Ewok show up at some point during that 24hour per really walk I’ll get working on that for you yeah find us one I think they have them at um that place in California if you just go like put one in your bag steal one go steal it just borrow for a few days I didn’t think costume shops he could have got one at a costume shops no I actually tried a costume shop if he had no one had an Ewok that’s surprising Eric was the only guy that had anything resembling an Ewok that that I could find so challenge accepted okay well maybe one day you’ll see espa Dred up dressed up like a real Ewok but maybe not I wouldn’t hold your breath on that for joining us clipped the Clippers show I can’t wait oh God Clippers drama that starts starts tonight I’m watching on Hulu tomorrow the Clippers drama where about how uh Sterling and the whole thing went down they did it I think lawence Fishburn is do it’s like a like a Time Life movie kind of thing oh yeah it’s like what they did with winning time but much much worse but yeah Accord to the y”s thoughts on the trailer I don’t know I feel like this could be fun oh I’m I’m all all the way out Gerald it looks awful give it a chance that’s why I’m watch don’t judge a book by its cover okay don’t judge a show by its trailer watch I’m good Ed Ed O’Neal as Donald Sterling Lawrence Fishburn as Doc Rivers I’m in I’m sh I love Lauren’s Fishburn it looks terrible I’m sorry hater all right well thank you all for joining us we appreciate you if you’re here on YouTube hit that Thumbs Up Button we appreciate it somebody in the chat I forgot what his name was but he said that uh he lost he was 215 pounds started watching our show and now he’s 177 I don’t know if that’s our fault or to say congratulations but cool we’ll take credit for it we lost Journey nice job yriy well job I found all of it yo Drizzy so thanks thanks for the assist here you killed linday all right um like I was saying hit that Thumbs Up Button if you’re here on YouTube rate review And subscribe wherever you get your podcast and of course give the show a follow on social at phnx Suns you can also follow me at lindsy Smith a follow s sore Bookman you can follow Gerald Gerald Bor and you can follow espo espo espo take us home a big shout out to my guy Malik the freak happy 22nd birthday I’ll talk to you soon a Hoy hoy [Music] [Applause] we all sitting like the May

The Phoenix Suns might be limited with the trades they can make to bolster their team but they are not without options. On today’s PHNX Suns Podcast we’ll look at trades that involve Grayson Allen. Allen can’t be traded until until mid-October but it’s never too early to start looking at moves the Suns could make.

Join us for the latest around the Suns and don’t forget to follow the show on social @PHNX_Suns

0:00 Intro and story time with Espo
5:00 An update on Royce O’Neale
13:00 Trade Machine Tuesday: Grayson Allen Edition pt.1 (Bigs)
39:00 Trade Machine Tuesday: Grayson Allen Edition pt.2 (Guards/Wings)

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