Phoenix Suns Fire Frank Vogel, Mike Budenholzer Next Up? More Changes Coming?

Phoenix Suns Fire Frank Vogel, Mike Budenholzer Next Up? More Changes Coming?

the Phoenix Suns have fired Frank vogle after just one season as head coach on today’s episode of Locked on suns why this was a logical first step toward fixing whatever might have screwed up this sun season but certainly not a Band-Aid for everything going wrong with this team let’s go you are locked on suns your daily Phoenix Suns podcast part of the locked on podcast Network your team every day and we’re back this is lockon Phoenix Suns we are part of the lockon podcast Network I’m your host Brendan clean a credential media member covering the Suns for the past seven seasons the host of the just basketball show wherever you get your podcast thank you for making locked on suns your first listen after Frank vogel’s dismissal two straight Summers where the sons have fired a coach giving us a lot to discuss we are free and available everywhere including YouTube so hit that follow or subscribe button wherever you’re getting this show get a new episode in your feet every single Monday through Friday throughout the offseason and Beyond as we break down what should be an eventful summer here in the valley be part of this community become an every day or get locked on to the Phoenix Suns all right today’s episode guys a lot to sift through as the Suns move on from vogle with Mike buen holer firmly in their sites according to Adrien wowski and John gambadoro today’s episode is brought to you by priz piix the easiest most exciting way to play daily fantasy sports go to prize.com lockon NBA use the code locked on NBA for a first deposit match up to $100 when I think about why the Suns made this move got rid of vogle there’s a lot of answers right I’ll start with the obvious I’ll start with the most embarrassing maybe the final straw the last Domino that athletic article that came out right it Illustrated the two primary things that I think have to be held against vogul if only because there’s nobody else to hold them against the locker room did not seem to be galvanized around him to say the very least right and the offensive end of the floor never quite got to a point of the dominance that we would expect and I would say it wasn’t greater than the sum of its parts it may have even been worse than the talent that they had on that side of the court right even if you go after Christmas when Bradley Beal got back they were the seventh offense in the NBA is that good enough well this move would signal maybe not and of course the athletic article indicating that for Kevin Durant in particular it was not suiting him like he would prefer so leadership was not quite there and the offense was not quite there basketball-wise this team did not do what a Frank Vogal team has typically done they did not protect the rim at an elite level they did not create turnovers at an elite level their transition defense was inconsistent and they didn’t have the toughness and force and physicality that have been a uh no matter who he’s coaching have been there on Vogal te so those those aspects of the Suns this year left a lot to be desired and they were things that you would expect to get from vogle that you did not get but here’s why I don’t fully put the blame of this season on vogle right and I don’t even put the blame of those things not coming together fully on the coach’s plate right vogle thought he was coaching a very different team than he ended up coaching I go back to me uh his his introductory press conference he said of DeAndre Aon that the defensive scheme starts with him he can be one of the best centers in the league and he’s shown that I’m intent on really connecting with him and restoring him to an Allstar level player I have a scheme that I believe is the best in the league at tailoring those strengths into the group vogle even said of Cameron pay that he will be in the mix as a potential starter he said we also want to see how the rest of the roster shakes out see if we add a point guard campaign will be in the mix all of that will play out in Camp he said that back on June 29th that was before they traded him to the San Antonio where he was eventually cut now of course the Eon side of that probably bigger than the pain side of that but it speaks to the obvious holes that this Sun’s roster had at Center especially backup center and and a an archetype of a center in terms of an athletic finishing Rim protecting transition scoring screen setting option that Drew Eubanks never turned into and a playmaking option a point of attack defensive option which Payne could have at least been part of helping out at the same time obviously the same detriments and obstacles that got in the way of the Suns being what they wanted to be as a team that the players felt those were there for the coach as well now I’m not going to go into that indepth injuries to numerous players in most specifically Beal the roster and the the bench players that they tried to add last summer not panning out all of that look that’s true for a lot of coaches things don’t go as they’re supposed to on paper but that’s there they did not set him up to succeed that’s not an excuse very few coaches get every single thing that they want you know not everybody’s Luke Walton with the Warriors for instance where the talent is so great that it can mask what you are as a coach but I think we can all agree this was far from an from an ideal situation for anybody involved on top of the short Runway with a wholly new roster and a new coaching staff and a relationship he had to form with Kevin young and all those things they also went up and changed the roster on him okay so this is not the job he necessarily signed up for he was not necessarily set up to succeed and the way that the Sun Season played out was not fully on vogel’s shoulders that being said given the significant challenges to changing what this roster looks like it’s not just the whole oh the coach is the easy guy to put blame on it’s really not even about blame it’s about what can you change you can change the seventh eighth ninth man on this team you can replace Kevin young I think the Suns made a determination that changing the head coach position bringing somebody in to replace Frank vogle was the one of the biggest things that they could do at the top level to put themselves in a better position to win a championship next season but let’s go back to the losing the locker room side of this right we know that based on the 36 unbothered tweet from Deon Booker and Kevin Durant last year or from Devon Booker referring to himself and Kevin Durant that the coaching that that the players probably had a say in Monty’s dismissal last year we assumed Kevin young was Booker’s pre preference at head coach last year whereas vogul was more of ishbia preference did that lead to where this all played out too is that another example of something where there was a fracturing of what this team wanted to be between ownership management coaching staff and players where vogle had to come in and win over a group that he never won over or was there buy an originally and something changed was there agreement on how to play what the team was going to look like what the ENC Court style was going to be that changed I asked that question because all of this will affect how successful this change can actually be right it may be that firing the coach bringing somebody new in was the most impactful single decision that the Suns could make this offse but it’s not going to work no matter who’s there whether there is unless there is an alignment more than there was this season across all those levels of the organization and the roster and the mindset of the star players is pointing the same direction as whatever this next hedge coach will be on that note Mike buholzer appears to be the front runner for the job does he make more sense and what do the sons need in order to make this move count coming up next first Today’s Show brought to you by prize picks who have come in 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your number one rid or die you’ll always find exactly what you’re looking for with eBay is guaranteed fit your part is guaranteed to fit your ride every time or your money back cuz with eBay Motors you’re burning rubber not cash with all the parts you need at the prices you want it’s easy to make your car the MVP and bring home huge wins keep your ride or die alive at ebaymotors.com eligible items only exclusions apply eBay guaranteed fit only available to us customers keeping the show rolling here let’s talk Bud let’s talk coach Bud all right because very quickly Mike bu uh Adrien wowski and John gadoro so the local and the national both pinpointed B buen holer as a strong option here um I think wo’s very cryptic wording was that Mike buen holer is expected to be a prominent part of the search or something like that gambo said there will be only two to three options buen holer is the most likely and a decision will be quick as quick as soon as next week according to gambo okay so the timeline and the buen Holzer mentions here I would not be surprised if Mike buher was the head coach of the Suns as soon as you know a week from today or something as of right now that seems like where we are headed but uh I’ll have some lingering questions suround out the show as far as are there others that could pop up and what other changes could be Brewing but what’s interesting to me about Mike buher even if it’s not him the fact that his name came up first the fact that as I told you guys you know this week I expected the the the pause the delay here on the part of ishbia and the sons to come from the fact that they wanted to Canvas the market they wanted to say if we’re firing vogle what else are we getting who else are we getting and so the fact that it took this entire week basically until Thursday afternoon and that they did make the change leads me to believe that they’ve probably been talking to Mike buholzer right but again what’s interesting and kind of uh ironic about that to me is that some of Mike buher strengths or what he likes to do especially on the defensive end of the Court are not that different from what foko likes to do right I mean think about the Mike budenholzer defense in particular drop de drop big man in the pick and roll Brook Lopez won I think he won a defensive player of the year he was considered one of the best defensive players in the NBA once he got to Milwaukee and he’s at the foul line playing defense in that drop coverage and then they use their length and point of attack defense to basically just force opposing offenses into the types of shots that the Bucks wanted to give them you know that’s why Chris Paul had a great finals in 2021 and Devin Booker was able to to to be pretty effective and and everything else those when they were reigning threes in those first two games of the finals in 2021 and the Suns won those games right now some of the things are different you know he’s not as aggressive right so forcing turnovers and some of the way that we saw especially the Suns use nurkic in the playoffs maybe with that extended out onto the perimeter as a big man type of coverage maybe there’s going to be less of that but at the base you know protecting the rim cleaning up the paint defending in transition contesting threes the basic principles are pretty similar so where I think this has to be coming from given that again he seems to be the early front runner already is a belief that buen holzer’s I guess you know similar level of experience right you’re not taking a step down to some kind of newcomer so you have that experience still you have the winning pedigree the championship bonafides but the offensive end of the Court must be must be the point must be the difference that ishbia and maybe James Jones and potentially the players see here right a five out offense where Brook Lopez the other development added to his game in addition to ratcheting up his defensive impact over time in his career was that he became a great three-point shooter and a high volume three-point shooter somebody who could shoot it not just in the corner but out on the wing out at the top of the arc right buer is big on crashing the offensive glass it’s one of the things that he was you know a little bit ahead of the curve on as a head coach in the NBA seeing the value of those second possessions and not getting too fatuated solely with the idea of we are going to you know shoot a bunch of Threes right not a not an elite every single season offensive rebounding team maybe somewhat inconsistent in terms of where they might have landed in uh in all of that but over time seem to embrace that a little bit more and I think you would hope with maybe a best player a primary playmaker who’s not a big man like the Suns or like the Bucks had with Giannis he can get that even up into the higher uh into the higher levels the question would remain though is this offense is this roster set up to put out onto the court the type of offense that buen holer wants to run more than what the Suns just went through where there was that again that misalignment and not setting the table for everything to fire on all cylinders coaching staff wants to do one thing or even assistant versus head coach want to do one thing players want to do another thing management sees a different kind of thing we’ll know that more in time we don’t fully know what this roster is but if we’re just looking at the starting five which James Jones and mbia both seem to agree should stay the same I actually have a little bit of optimism there because one I think buen Holzer has been it helps to have Giannis onto TMO right but buer has been has emphasized playing quickly so that’s good you know so did vogle but I guess you would say buen holer has a a better track record of having that pan out with the spacing and the rotation and the the Personnel that he puts out on the court and just the emphasis on you know early offense not just turning defense into offense because he his teams didn’t force a ton of turnovers that’s one thing that again Boler teams don’t try to do they want to contest and and limit threes without fouling and without forcing turnovers um so they did that on offense without getting the easy looks from just getting Steals and blocks but more importantly than that whether you’re talking about Atlanta prior to the buck stop or even in Milwaukee Jeff Teague Drew holiday those guys are not pure point guards those guys are not you know Chris Paul Mike Conley even Kyle or any any of the guys we think of as kind of johnar for for all you know we can say or Darius Garland to pick younger dudes no Teague was a scoring guard holiday is a you know kind of Reckless offensive player at times if we’re being honest but he was able to construct an egalitarian balanced offense where guys like Al Horford Paul Milsap Chris Middleton Giannis were able to be part of the playmaking the passing the balance that the offense had that sounds like what the Suns should be trying to do with pieces like nurkic Beal Booker how do you make a group without a pure primary playmaker which even if the Suns get a point guard in the offseason is not going to be the caliber of player the caliber of point guard that is going to take the ball out of Booker and Beal’s hands to an extreme degree how do you meld that into something that maximizes all of those players and makes them better than the sum of their parts buen holer has shown you how with a variety of different setups and rosters and I think that has to be the driving force between why he is being considered time will tell what that roster actually looks like we’re very early days he’s not even the head coach yet but that tells us a lot about what the suns are looking for and why he might make sense there could be more changes on the horizon and there could be more candidates who pop up what might all of that look like coming up next first Today’s Show 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got the Net’s job or Kevin young himself they opted toward you know it seems like Doc Rivers was frankly second on their list and vogle ends up getting the job so if they’re leaning experience there’s not a lot of options out there you know Kenny ainson would be one name but he his experience is relatively limited All Things Considered and as a head coach and we know that you know Kyrie and KD may not have seen eye to eye with him and he left the team before Durant ever debuted as a net one name I would look at though is one name I would look at is chony BBS it sounds as if they are sort of trying to Force Philips out or get him to quit I’m not sure they fired his brother who was on the coaching staff and Sports Illustrated and some local writers have reported recently that there is some smoke around the Billups situation as far as if he could leave now I know what you’re thinking Mike buer much more accomplished much more experienced much more of a winning pedigree as a head coach than chony bips all I’m saying is that’s a name that maybe isn’t out there yet that could be and he does have some of the ingredients that could be appealing he’s built a decent enough defense given that they are basically tanking we know he had the respect of Dame and we know he was a candidate after leaving ESPN as an analyst for jobs as an executive once upon a time so that’s a pretty solid candidate in a in a in a vacuum but more than anything the reason I bring Billups up isn’t even so much that I know anything about his connection to this job but more so to say what if the players get involved because that’s when I could see a person like bips getting a leg up now that wge and gambo have put out there that bud is the front runner what if ishbia and Jones have not been in consistent communication with Durant and Booker and Beal or what if those guys are aware but not fully on the same page and and loving it or they maybe knew vogle was out but didn’t know who the replacement might be and what if they’re not big fans of the of the bud concept I think that’s where things could get interesting in bips being a former Championship player a longtime veteran in the NBA who plays point guard and has the cerebral defensive tenacity and playmaking and Leadership qualities that you would want what if that matters what if that becomes a factor and somebody like him gets an advantage last but not least other changes where else can you look the roster is of course going to be open to adjustments but the front office and this comes from Mike uh from Mike buher from John gambadoro locally here as well which is that he said he expects vogle to not be the only change we see in Phoenix this offseason but that from all accounts he could see front office adjustments as well not James Jones being fired again James Jones has the quote in the press release announcing vogel’s departure which you do not do unless ishia has given him the green light that his job is safe what I will remind everybody of though when it comes to Jones is he was given a promotion during the time where Robert Sarver was on Hiatus uh suspension whatever and that promotion made him president of basketball operations and general manager of the team that’s nice if you remember the the conversation even the little press conference that he did at that time that was strange situation I the way he talked about it was that it was sort of just a title thing to give him a little bit more responsibility during a time of uncertainty when Sarver was not around maybe that came with a little bit of RA of a raise maybe not but it kind of felt like a more of a formality I could easily see ishbia saying either James Jones is only our general manager and I’m going to put somebody in place that is a president above him and kind of demote Jones or say okay Jones you’re more of a senior strategy guy I’m going to bring in a general manager or a senior vice president or a vice president or whatever to be more of the Hands-On person dayto day than than we’ve had before I I far be it for me to guess who those types of people might be I’m not you know some kind of Insider here of the best Scout and Personnel guy in Houston or something but those those people are out there that’s what I would expect we see gambo said not isaah Thomas I think it would be a PR Nightmare and a pretty dumb move given that is that it hasn’t been in the NBA as an executive for I guess his nick name is not it it’s Zeke has not been around for more than a decade now um but somebody could easily fill that void and and provide a new voice A New Perspective some new uh blood and leadership in that front office and put a little pressure on Jones which if you’re going to keep him you got to manufacture some kind of urgency and and adjustment of vision given that at the end of the day the main thing I would blame Jones for is a lot of those minimum signings he struck he he swung on last last summer he struck out on so even if you think the Durant move wasn’t fully on him or the be move and and isbi was kind of pushing for that stuff you got to nail those moves on the margins the best teams do it Jones has not done it frequently enough his draft history since cam Johnson is abysmal and if the suns are going to extend this window and have a chance to get closer that’s going to matter matter too that’s the other stuff in addition to the head coaching change that can change this summer Beyond The Big Three staying put Beyond even maybe the the starters all five staying put is those other guys that’ll wrap us up more to come throughout the weekend into next week as the coaching search continues on hit follow subscribe so you don’t miss an episode and I will talk to you guys next time

Frank Vogel is out as Phoenix Suns head coach with Mike Budenholzer already reportedly the front runner to take the job.

Brendon Kleen of @justbasketballfans breaks down why the Suns moved on from Vogel, what the Budenholzer rumors tells us about this search, and what other changes could be looming in Phoenix.

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