The Pistons Pulse: Ron Holland in Detroit

The Pistons Pulse: Ron Holland in Detroit

[Music] [Applause] hello and welcome to your go-to Detroit Pistons podcast the Pistons pulse co-hosted by me Bryce Simon of Motor City Hoops a former D1 Hooper and current teacher husband and father of three amazing kids and I’m Omari Sanko for the second Pistons beat riter for the Detroit Free Press and of course we’re always blessed to be joined by our producer West Davenport if you guys did not join their live stream over on dbb last night it’s over there still go to the YouTube channel even if you don’t want to watch them covering the other 29 picks which they did and you should you can watch them as they cover the Pistons selecting Ron Halland number five overall and was over on Game Theory with San Vini same thing we have it all chaptered out you can watch just the Pistons one or whatever picks you want to see our live reactions to real quick before we get started Omari let give my little man a shout out he turned five today so happy birthday to Royce who is happy birthday Roy he is dealing with me going on I just got off the radio now I’m doing this I got to cover the second round live this afternoon so he is dealing with me doing NBA draft stuff on his birthday but wanted to give my little man a shout out I’m happy for race 5 years old is a big age that’s like he’s like like he’s in a stage of life where he’s like just becoming cognizant of everything around him you know like two years ago did he know what the NBA draft was he still doesn’t know what the NBA draft was like he he has no idea what’s going on it’s yeah it’s it’s I love doing this here’s what’s funny one of I think Ro asked me the other day like Dad are the Pistons ever going to be good and I’m like man son you you are Pistons fan already and you don’t even know it so God bless you br was Bor what year uh bro is nine he will turn 10 in October so yeah I was like so he’s like since 2015 like he you know like he was born on like the tail end of like the anre drumond era and like he has no simol inside off like a good piston steam which is interesting maybe that’ll change we’ll see yeah we’ll see hopefully they can grow up and see here’s the thing Rowan has gotten Chief’s success so I he’s already spoiled is all get out because of that so he’s Rowan is doing five whenever it fine whenever it comes to his Sports yeah fandom I’m always jealous of kids who get born with like good football teams because I got to wait till I was almost 30 for that yeah so and that’s what I did not get that as a cheese fan I had to live through a lot of struggling years and heartbreaks and all of that so yeah God bless Rowan it’s close enough YouTube user it’s with an e but close enough um so appreciate you guys I’m already losing I’m scared Omari for the second round this afternoon I could feel my voice going last night at the tail end of the first round and then knowing what we had today and how excited I get I’m excited about the second round but I’m really nervous that my voice is gonna go about halfway through the live stream this afternoon but here we’re talking about Ron Holland we’re talking about the number five pick here’s how we’re gonna do this guys we are gonna talk just about Ron Holland as a player with no Detroit Pistons context to start this off because once we get into that it’s going to get convoluted into what does it mean for Jay Ivy what does it mean for assar what does it mean for traan langon what does it mean for Fred Vincent and I just don’t want us to get down those rabbit holes immediately before we just talk about who Ron Holland is as a prospect as a player so Amari I’ll let you start and then we’ll just riff back and forth how we look at him and how we evaluated him coming into this yeah I feel like I’ve always been pretty transparent that like I’m a Ron Holland fan I like his game I didn’t really quite understand why he was uh in mik drafts which some of that was just workout related but I didn’t see him going five uh you know and I think that that was probably the first big surprise of the night but just on Holland as a player like I think he’s the exact type of guy you take a swing on in this draft if the plan is to take a swing in this draft and the reality is that he pretty much has everything you want in a modern Wing except the shooting aspect uh he what he averaged 19 a game two and a half steals about seven rebounds he moves the ball I don’t think think he’s like a primary initiator type guy but he you know he he moves the ball like in transition you could trust him like f you know the cutter or somebody spotting up but he’s just super super athletic like I think he has a very natural handle and I think he just gets to the rim with ease like he could finish through contact he can finish around people he can finish through people uh he’s kind of wiry strong uh I just like he’s 18 like he’s still 18 on draft night like you know like I like young prospects in their upside and yeah like he can’t shoot and I think that that’s obviously the big if like it’s a a wing who has everything but the shooting and we see so many of these guys go top 10 every single year and a lot of them never really figure the shooting out but Ry like this is a guy that came in with like a sterling reputation like he won in high school like he was seen as a potential number one pick and he just happened to be stuck with the worst g-league ignite team of all time which there’s only been like three or four ignite team so it’s not like that’s like a huge accomplishment but they went two and 32 so it is a huge accomplishment in that sense but I like Ron I think he’s a great upside swing I think he has everything you want in the wing and I’m curious to see uh just sort of how he settles in to this roster uh Bryce I’m curious to see how you feel about Ron as a prospect because I know we’ve talked a lot about it in like a piston sense but just overall do you see him as like a valid top five pick in this type of draft because I do yeah I I do I don’t think the value here is wrong by any means we’ll talk about the fit a little bit later and I think it’s a it’s a real conversation I don’t want people to think we’re going to to dodge the fit conversation and the floor spacing conversation and what does it mean for Ivy and assar I don’t want to dodge that stuff because it’s real it’s part of where we’re at right now in this draft but I had Ron Holland very high on my board at times throughout this process and I’ve said over and over that if you ask me for a two-way Wing which is an insane archetype for the NBA for the NBA today you look for wings can play both sides of the floor he’s not a three and D wi obviously the the shooting is one of the biggest concerns I just saw somebody make a comment that the Phi maybe the biggest I think I may agree with that that he the f is a real concern even more maybe than the shooting but he defends on the other end and we’ll break this down in even more detail because I have some questions about the defense also but if you ask for the archetype that may be the most important in the NBA I think a lot of people would tell you a two-way wing and I think Ron Holland at the top had the best chance of hitting that let’s just get this out of the way actually no we we’ll save the comp stuff for a second I I’m just going to really quickly read my scouting report for his archetype potential role athletic and explosive Wing I don’t think he’s a forward who has the potential to be a high volume scorer and defensive playmaker I do believe he’ll be mostly off the- player who you want to create Advantage for and then allow him to attack those opportunities so that’s where we’ll talk about what he can do with the ball in his hand will get the reputation as a quote unquote selfish player based on the assist to turnover numers but I believe that to be misleading in terms of that I think it’s more of his feel for the game defensively he’s a player that will make plays and be disruptive but will need to work on the fundamentals of this end to simply be more solid in situations that they ask for so one other quick caveat Mari before I let you kind of respond to that when you look at Ron Holland’s stats specifically on real GM make make sure you scroll to the part that says full season stats because what real GM does is you have their regular season and your g-league showcase cup separated out and then the third one is full season stats so for the full season he was 46 24 73% from the free throw line almost four free throw attempts a game and an important caveat with that Omari because I know this is big for you how he pressures the rim they only shoot one free throw attempt in the g-league games and so those free throw attempt numbers are somewhat skewed because of how they do that no doubt and that’s I think really is probably the aspect of his game that hasn’t been discussed enough is that this guy was really Elite at getting to the line in his L season with the knite and that’s a skill that really tends to translate you know for a lot of young prospects and tends to be correlated with you know being those types of go-to scorers in the NBA uh like guys like Jimmy Butler there like you know Tatum Brown uh most of the good Wings in the NBA get to the line at least at a decent rate and for I think Holland to show that at 18 is is very very promising but the other thing I really like about Holland is that he is just he has an endless motor like he dies for every loose ball like he’s just like the ultimate hustle guy and I’m gonna try to find the stats uh you know when I end it back to to you Bryce but that’s another thing that’s really correlated with stardom like you look at like just NBA hust stats and you’ll see some surprising names at the top for like diving for loose balls and things like that but those are just things that stars tend to do like they’re very high effort instinctual players and I think if Ron Holland had played for like a duke or Kentucky or somewhere else and maybe that raw fism you know against guys his own age and that grown men shine a bit more he would have been in that number one conversation from the jump you know because you look at his profile and I think he has all the indicators you would want in a young who can eventually hit that next level well I think what’s important to note here and one thing that was screamed about with the ignite going back to even before the season started they didn’t have a real point guard they didn’t have a table setter so Ron Holland is going from that to playing with a like if we believe in Kade Cunningham and what he is he is going to be awesome for Ron Holland in terms of setting him up and the things he can do so again I think when you’re looking at a potential two-way Wing this is the ultimate answer in the draft and so you laid out the stats the numbers and what he was able to do in that League still or with that team he has real twitch and explosion I think he is one of the more athletic guys especially in the top 10 explosing in transition I will say this uh something I didn’t necessarily have in my notes but Ron or S Vini actually made the comment last night he thinks Ron Holland may have be the one of the best off the- ball Cutters in the draft we were talking about Tristan Silva and he you know made that comment that actually he thinks Ron Holland is he thinks the Silva is the best cutter in the draft but that Ron Holland would also be right there so that plays into kind of his ability to play off the ball and the value he provides I think he could be a menace on the offensive boards I think that’s something he could do very well also we’ll get to his defense in a second because I do want to talk about that I want to ask you Amari what do you think about just the jumper and the way it looks because even my notes going back to the high school film is I didn’t think it looked bad I thought the arm mechanics and the follow-through looked okay to me I I thought it looked good with the ignite it just the numbers didn’t really back it up I thought he showed touch around the rim whenever he drove to the paint so I do have a little bit of hope that again we won’t fully get into the Fred Vincent conversation yet but that he is going to be able to improve his shooting I think so his Miss like I’m sorry his bakes look pretty good like when you see him make a shot like it’s like okay like those are workable mechanics and he could definitely replicate this at the next level as long as he tightens up just his consistency and his mechanics his misses look pretty bad and I think a lot of yes y you know and I think a lot of it with him is just mechanical you know it’s just uh you know B like it’s stuff that’s correctable like when I watch his shooting I don’t think oh this is going to be like a two threeyear project like realistically he could go into his second year shooting 34 35% I think and that’s like an 11% Improvement but again he had to create so many threes just playing with the ignite and in the NBA you’re not going to ask him like Hey you’re going to take side steps uh step backs like you’re not going to have to do that as much with the Pistons or I would assume that their next coaching staff won ask him to do that as much it’s going to be much more uh you know getting him good clean spot up attempts you know off both feet and if you can build that consistent base then you that’s probably going to work out pretty well for him going forward I don’t know if he’s going to become like a 38 39 40% guy but I I watch him shoot I look at his makes and I think this guy can get to 35 36% in a reasonable amount of time and I actually feel better about his shooting I want say I feel better about it like him and B buellis I don’t think are that far apart as Shooters like bz’s shot looks good too he didn’t shoot it that much better but I I think both those guys have correctable jumpers long we we’ll get into that we when we get to the second segment we’ll definitely talk about that because I want to talk about the other options that were there I want to sit right here on this question question from Willie what’s his immediate role going to look like and I think this is what’s interesting about Ron Holland is because let’s just get into the comp stuff that we are talking about so there’s going to be a lot of people that look at Ron Holland and they say he’s gonna have the hamedo Dio career where athletic you know all of those things but doesn’t really figure it out the Field’s not great and he ends up you know a few years in the NBA and then he’s gone I think the median outcome that I kind of like I’m not saying it’s one toone with this player but is the role that we saw from Derrik Jones Jr where athletic makes enough threes disruptive defensively those type of things I think maybe that’s the role you see from him maybe in his rookie season with the Pistons and listen people are going to freak out here I get it I’m not saying he’s going to become this but the ceiling and put whatever percent you want on it maybe it’s 1% maybe it’s 10% but the ceiling is going to to me is Jaylen Brown like that’s the archetype of a two-way Wing that could potentially be there for Ron Holland if everything hits right so yes and like they’re there it’s a little bit better than Hami I’m just I’m not comping guys I’m not saying these are onetoone comps every player has a floor in a ceiling so but there’s a percentage that goes with each of those so that’s kind of where I’m at so for me Omari going back to the question is what do we see early I don’t think they put him in like a Jaylen Brown role right like not to be this awesome two-way offensive like I think it’s more of a little bit of a Derek Jonesy type of role that we saw with the Mavs this past season I definitely think it’s more Derek Jones junor and I got of made this point last night where you know people were comparing him to assar and I’m like well I think Ron has more guard skills than assar like he can make some things happen with the in with the Bon signs a little bit more and I think it gets downhill a little bit easier which for me like h i mean and we’re not doing direct comps obviously but Hami is like the absolute floor because I think coming out he could probably be a little bit better than that um but you talk about J Jaylen Brown and like long long term he does have a lot of those same indicators that make you think well he has a liit to his game every summer by year four he’s gonna pop yeah listen I see people are really pushing back on this yet Ron does but there are there’s real feel questions and and the reason Ham’s not in the league has a lot to do with with ph and not being able to shoot so if Ron really isn’t able to shoot and he does not have good feel if that doesn’t come around if that was a real thing and again I’m not saying it is then there is you know there’s real questions of what the value ends up being offensively just like the Jaylen Brown percentage outcome is pretty low I think the Hamad Dio outcome that I’m throwing here is pretty low as well most likely it hits somewhere in the middle I I would like to think think that the Jaylen Brown okay let’s talk about the defense because Theo played no defense here’s what I’ll say about Ron Holland on the defensive end I think he plays extremely extremely hard and I think he can be real disruptive I think there are some fundamental things that he has to get better at there is he got labeled as like this an elite defensive player coming out of high school I don’t agree with that I don’t think he stayed in front of guys as well as that title would make you think I don’t think he did it as well in the g-league as what it would make you think he just got beat off the bounce a little bit more but he does give great effort I think he’ll be with his athleticism I think he will be disruptive I do think there is just if if we’re expecting him to come in and just lock down on the ball I I don’t know that that’s what he’s immediately going to do I think there is some see I I would disagree with this I don’t think he’s the best on ball defender in the class I I don’t agree with that I don’t think that’s what he is initially and I also had some questions like I have multiple notes of he him not boxing out and really rebounding and missing rotations and some of those things on the weak side this is all stuff he can grow and learn Amari okay he absolutely can I’m just giving my Scout on him and where I think he’s at yeah I think he has one of the best onb upsides but in a draft where you have Devin Carter Ryan Dunn uh like some guys who are coming in and could just truly be like Elite Guys cast like Steph Castle uh like this is a pretty solid draft for defensive wings so I wouldn’t give Ron Holland that but I think if you talk about long-term upside he could absolutely get there 100% yeah I’m gonna read this real quick just to get back to about loose boss stats and some of this is going to be correlated just because these guys play a lot but in order here are the leaders for total loose bosss recovered last season and I read this because Ron Holland might be the best loose ball guy in this draft like that’s a stat that matters Kawhi Leonard led the pack with 81 loose balls recovered after that it’s Austin Reeves Josh Hart Luca Anthony Davis Jaylen Brown Alex Caruso Anthony Edwards Kobe white sabonis fox if you keep going you get KY ree Shay Devin Booker Zion Denis shooter like a lot of names you wouldn’t necessarily expect yeah I would not have yeah but one thing that really correlates just with being a high effort player is loose balls recovered like all the stars recover loose balls you look at it like Steph Curry is in there he had 50 five last season like he would not expect lot of these guys to be in there but they just play a maximum effort all the time and that’s Ron Holland like that’s it’s not like a massive stat right like lose B recover you don’t think about it but you look at the guys up there and you do see a lot of toolsy wings who came in with sort of Ron Holland reputation and ended up developing other aspects of their game and I think that’s what really gives you more confidence with Ron is you talk to people like just the way he played his voter is unbelievable he might have one of the best voters in the draft that’s one thing you can not teach that’s indicator that makes you feel a lot better about his long-term outcome like this guy is going to work non-stop this he gets there yes I agree with that 100% And that’s I’m just giving where I think he is right now that’s what like I’m all I’m trying to do is give that context I don’t mean to push back as much as I am Bobby bucket says Bryce compared to assar he’s a level below that then I had a lot of these same concerns I feel like I was saying the same thing defensively about assar and quite frankly guys I was a little bit wrong like I think assar came in and was able to be better defensively and more impactful and more solid than what I thought he was going to be so yes great comment here from YouTube user Ron andar are both good character guys who work hard I agree 100% with that so I I think Ron will get there I just I don’t think like there’s a lot of these herb Jones Jaden McDaniels I love those comps and I don’t know maybe those guys I’m sure they struggled as rookies too defensively I just don’t think he’s quite there yet in regards to a few of these things um I also I want to keep this conversation going Omari just about him as a player and then we can get to the other stuff real quick before we go to the break we mentioned the Jaylen Brown thing Wes dropped it so this is why he’s the best in the business Jaylen Brown rookie stats just 20 games started 6.6 points less than an assist just under three rebounds 6 stocks which is kind of crazy I think Ron Holland will at least do that on 4534 469 and 17 minutes per game so just a little bit of okay guys I did not call him Hamad Doo so please please stop yelling at me for saying he’s gonna be trying to avoid getting yelled at on Twitter I just like I didn’t call him Jaylen Brown I didn’t call him Hamad Doo every single player has a floor and a ceiling all I’m saying is if all of these if he doesn’t figure out fundamentally the defensive side if he doesn’t find the field and he doesn’t find the jumper there is a world where this doesn’t work out very well that’s my only point so all right the and it’s only because how he played for the Pistons and he’s like a goto that you could like you know people I liked homie too that’s the thing I I I said on this podcast like hey man somebody should when he figured out he was like this smaller forward type of archetype like I was like I kind of like this I was surprised that maybe he didn’t figure it out so um I’m also like running on very little sleep it was a long night so I’m a little more temperamental than I KNE it’s to two days like I like okay I have mixed feelings in a two-day format on one hand I got home like 11: pm. last night because we were at the PPC that’s where we talk to Lon and we had a conference call with Ron and I’m like typically like you know especially when they have like pick 53 you’re up till you know maybe like 1 1:30 in the morning two working just because you don’t know what’s going to happen like it might be another deal or whatnot and when the first round ended I’m like there’s nothing else that’s going to happen tonight like we’re done like I walked outside and like the birds were tpping it was like 11: p.m. but like it was just like this joying the air and I realized oh okay like now this takes care of Thursday too I don’t know that I could have done it last night am Mario I was I was gassed by the end of the first round if we I I hope these second round picks this is a different topic I hope they give their due because these there’s some real prospects here second round still on the board maybe we can talk about that at the end because maybe they could make a move and get and grab one of these guys but yeah it’ll it’ll be interesting I know people want some of the other stuff so let’s go to break and if if you have some more Ron Holland stuff we can do that or we can we can start to get into some of the other stuff all right we are back with segment two and we can start to dive into the Pistons stuff a little bit like we’re starting to talk about Ron as a a player but let’s just go ahead and dive into the elephant in the room which is that the Pistons have a team full of guys who need to be taught how to shoot uh in Ron really does duplicate some of the things I already had like I still think I like I like the pick I want to emphasize again I like the pick I think it makes sense 14 te I just won 14 games but with that and Ron does have about a 61 611 wingspan for those who are wondering his wingspan is around 611 I think it was like 6.7 75 or something like that but overall uh when you look at a team I already has jayen Ivy you have a star and this and that I think naturally people say like all these guys can’t play the together they’re going how to shoot this and that and that’s true but I also think it goes back to what we’ve talked about on and off since essentially last summer which is at the pistol off so of the young guys that you can’t commit to all of them anyway like it may not be this summer where you start to part with guys but over the next three seasons you’re gonna have to really make some tough decisions as far as who do be prioritize going forward especially with K more likely like he’s going to sign that Max extension this summer and then you have Ivy and Duran due next summer so you’re not gonna be able to keep all these guys so that’s kind of how I look at it right if you look at this as a fiveyear plan uh you know you can’t keep everybody so you might as well just take as many upside swings as you can but I guess to what extent does Ron Holland just not necessarily addressing needs right now sort of knock this pick back for you compared to maybe you know some other directions like a connect or some of the other guys there yeah so real quick we have a somebody joining live from Poland so we appreciate and guys we appreciate everybody in the chat I love how active is everybody’s being pretty congenial here this morning differing opinions but you know everybody’s being polite so I appreciate everybody we love you hit the like subscribe if you’re listening on podcast after the fact all the same stuff as normal so thank you guys so much um you know for for tuning in and being there here’s something that was really interesting so I had somebody really come and talk to me about who were the Pistons G to take it five that fix the floor spacing so Reay is gone sar’s gone she sheard’s gone Castle’s gone right so at five does kingan fix the floor spacing Amari maybe in you know eight years but he he Brook Lopez ceiling but no no does buellis no does topic no does tjon Salon no does Cody Williams possibly but probably no low volume yeah low volume right so there’s questions there I’ve even had people push back to me that Devin Carter was you know was is is he a real floor spacer because we’ve only seen one year of it and when I suggested that they yelled at me yeah no people hated it so and here’s the thing I had dton connect High I was obviously wrong because he lasted all the way to 17 which is an absolute steal for Lakers that’s like that’s actually I feel like the league just had a collective like why did we let them get dots and connect but yeah yeah so and I agree but people are talking about drafting Holland at five and not trading back I mean this we wouldn’t have known it if they would have but I wonder if there wasn’t the trade there that’s something we’ll talk about in a second so the guys we’re talking about is connect who ended up going 17 Jared McCain who ended up going 16 jacobe Walter who went 19 the Silva who went 18 and so I think if you were my point here is this is a long way of getting to who is the guy you could have taken at five that people would have been excited about that actually fixed the floor spacing issues and here’s the other thing then we would be having a conversation today if they take Dalton connect of what Omari who is this team going to defend right and Jared McCain we’d be having the conversation of he’s small jacobe Walter there’s some defensive concerns as well so at the very end of the day I don’t know that they were going to solve shooting and floor spacing with this pick anyway so why not take the two-way upside swing that we’ve talking about and I made that point on Twitter last night because the main issue that kept coming up with Ron Holland was that we took another guy that can’t shoot on a team of guys that can’t shoot and it’s like that’s valid but you’re going to say that about oppos anybody they’re going to take it as spot like V zalis not a great shooter uh Cody Williams not a great shooter like in this draft if you want a shooter you either want a top three pick or like pick 15 you don’t want to be in like that Wasteland between like four and like 12 or 13 or whatever but you have all these you know essentially various level of project guys who need to be taught uh so that was kind of my thing it’s like okay like I think that’s a valid complaint but then people are talking about buellis and Cody Williams and these other guys and it’s like well they had the same downside so really you’re telling me the person should have traded down to 14 or 15 and just took a connect or the Silva or Carter and one of these guys who are way more proven Shooters which also would have been a valid outcome I’m not saying that that’s wrong I’m just saying I cannot knock the Ron Holland pick specifically for shooting when the Pistons were going to take an upside Wing that has shooting issues regardless of who they went to with in that spot except Dawson connect and then it’s like well who’s playing defense and it’s like like I think D connects a fine pick at five it’s just if you’re like banking on the upside I like Ron Holland over the next five years way more than all like connect it’s not even close like I don’t even know connect on a good team as a full-time starter which if you do want to be a good team then you know if your fifth pick’s like a pretty good bench guy like that’s fine I mean you still need those types of guys but you know it’s probably a little bit more upside with going with a guy like Aon Holland so I just I just don’t put much stocking so that he can’t shoot criticism at all because that was just going to be whoever they picked at this spot like he weren’t going to get around that and that was going to be a free agency fixed I think more often than not even with connect you’re still GNA get shooting in free agency because he’s not g to single-handedly fix it so I don’t think that’s as big a deal in the gr game so this was again this was from Trader cause on Twitter and he hit me up and it really made me think because in the moment I think YouTube user tweeted or mentioned this in the comments earlier my reaction wasn’t necessarily great live on the stream but it was just because it was really the fit stuff and we do need to talk about like can him like you can’t play him ji assar and Duren together as much as it would be great to see those five on the floor together that’s we and we’ll talk about Fred Vincent in a second but the more I’ve looked at it and what they potentially could do there and maybe this is the transition into the trade back stuff why they didn’t do it and all of that so we’ll go there in a second but I love our running joke here Amari it’s 11:00 a.m. in Brazil just saying from our guy Matthews so I still don’t believe that like it’s 10 a here how’s it 11 a Brazil like I still think you guys are lying to me we are not lying to you my gu so um all right trade back because here’s the thing I wonder how people would feel about this if the move would have been made to trade back with the Grizzlies if if Memphis you know kingan was there the the scenario played out that a lot of us thought would play out to allow Detroit to trade back and I don’t my assumption is Memphis was just fine whether it was kingan or Edie and so they just stayed put where they were at why do you think there wasn’t a trade back you know what what trades did we end up get we got the big Minnesota trade but if that one was complet San Antonio got out completely that was a that was a future asset I’d be fascin fascinated to know if fans would have liked the idea of doing that but other than that what other trade-ups did we get was there any other major ones into there was discussion like I think probably we got the most traction was just Memphis moving up but but even that like that was just like discussion like I don’t know if that really got to the point to where like when the Pistons just hook holling and we like yeah we keeping holling like you know I think the cost just kind of fell off at that point if you’re going to trade back the pick would have had to have been clinging because that’s the guy that everybody was willing to trade up for which end up not even happening which is funny when you look back like he just went seven and like that was that but if the Pistons wanted to trade back like I think Clan is the only guy that would have had any sort of weight as far as getting back and picking up an asset and retire yeah that’s what it just it seemed like maybe that stuff didn’t materialize I felt like teams would pinpoint their guys and move up to get them and instead they were able to just sit where they were at and get the guys they wanted to because I mean I I would love to tune into a Charlotte Hornets podcast this morning Wes probably did I’m sure Wes is a Hornets fan now he probably is leaving pissing yeah aggregate if you’re gonna aggregate anything I say on this podcast aggregate that the real West D3 at the real West D3 is no longer a Pistons fan he is now a Charlotte Hornets fan and I’m only doing this because Wes can’t defend himself right now um for anybody who doesn’t understand they took jjon Salon who Wes hey Wes called it though the fact he went six that’s justification for Wes in terms of How High he had salon so shout out you for that so we talked about the other floor spacing options what there was was not the tradeback I just don’t think it material let’s talk about the roster here um and this will lead into the Fred Vincent conversation as well how does this play out Hal was over on The Game Theory stream the last night and he mentioned you don’t have to play all these guys together and I agree with Hal my counter is though you kind of have four four guys right now that you want to play that can’t shoot and two that are complete non-shooters as it stands and the other two are bad Shooters at best I was even going through a scenario Amari where okay let’s take ji and Ron and put them in the second unit but then you still have assar and Duran in the first unit and then and then even if you want to stagger stuff there’s always got to be two of them so do you think it’s a bet on Fred Vincent or is you alluded to earlier do you think it ends up being some sort of move where maybe one of these guys gets moved on and then they fill out the roster with Shooters in a different way you know like I get more and more of the sense that they’re going to go into the season with most of not all of the young guys like you know Tran hasn’t shied away from talking about specific fits uh after his press conference last Friday he mentioned that Ivy he thinks Ivy and um well last night for one he said that he thinks Ron Holland and assar could play together like eventually obviously one of those guys we have to learn how to shoot but he didn’t shly away from that and then last week he talked about Ivy and Kate playing together in the upside there so he’s clearly already looking at these combinations and you thinking well how could this work or how could that work but again he’s also putting a lot of faith into Fred Vincent as a shot developer and I think that that’s really the key in all of this is that you know like Pistons like they talking about a shot doctor for so long right like even on on Twitter like I like the main conversation has been went up to P gonna hire a shot doctor this and that and now they have one and he’s gonna like he’s gonna earn his salary you know like I don’t know what the timeline is for these guys becoming Shooters but like I will say like when it comes to fit like if any of these guys could shoot I think you just stop talking about it because you can play any Shooters together pretty much so I’m looking at next season as almost like a halfway season between like let’s move this thing forward and like get some good players but like let’s also evaluate what we have and figure out where we should invest and yeah the Fred Vincent key in that is really going to be important like uh like uh the Aaron Gordon talk here like that’s been a a big comparison Point like you have a guy that’s an athlete great instincts just see some how to shoot and then you’ll be okay so I’m curious how these fit issues like play out long term we be have some ugly lineups next year but as they make those decisions I think it’ll even out because I don’t think tradon is going to longterm try to build a roster that can’t shoot he’s the greatest shooter in Duke history besides JJ reic like I don’t think that he’s gonna build a roster that can’t shoot like he knows how important it is yeah I mean I hope listen I don’t know how to evaluate Fred vincon because I haven’t been there’re a part of it people tell me it’s real so I’ll just take people’s word for it he doesn’t have to fix all four of them that’s the other thing we say like oh there’s four non-shooter listen I don’t care if Jaylen Duran shoots go be really good defensively I could care less if Jaylen durren ever makes a three-pointer in his career I don’t need to see any of the other offensive stuff go be a rim protector if he gets Holland and Ivy to like ride around average NBA catch and shoot guys and if he can get assar maybe respect respectable even just from the corner this is a completely different conversation if you get the other guys around them that are high volume quality three-point Shooters another one here is where was it at Patrick says how much can they get into transition versus scheme and seems like they can play very aggressive defensively try to be a Havoc team stay out of the half court on offense as much as possible I love this idea I don’t know how much that fits Cade I’d have to think about that a little bit more but in general the idea like if there’s one thing jadeen Ivy might do well defensively it might be that I think that’s absolutely something that Ron Holland does early in his career as he develops the more solid foundational things we know assar can do it and then could you imagine ji Holland assar getting out in transition with the ball in Kade Cunningham’s hands like that’s the one time on the floor where the spacing isn’t quite as big of an issue so the one thing you have to get with that though is a coach that buys into that vision and right now obviously the Pistons we we have no idea in regards to that so I do think it’s interesting I I will say this Amari I know they can go get floor spacing in free agency the trades whatever but then at some point like they have nine dudes now that I think they would want to give minutes to right so at some point like something has to give if you add three floors spacers I I give me a second here yeah not good I didn’t want to interrupt your point no you can take off I was good yeah but if you have three floor spacers then obviously that opens things up a lot uh you look at all those guys are plus athletes for one like I think we talked about the athleticism aspect for the pisses for a long time and assar Ivy Ron Holland all these guys are going to be the best athletes on the floor to some extent whether it’s Ivy and his speed or just assar and Holland with their leaping ability but if two of those guys could shoot and I’ll also add that I do think that traent is still very much figuring out his roster as well like I asked him during the press conference last week like this what your initial assessment and he was honest he was like I was in the Western Conference you know we were in the playoff hunt figuring things out and I didn’t get to watch this team as much I think he’s still evaluating those aspects as well which is why I think the trade deadline could be very interesting for the Pistons once you have a 45 50 game sample size but again like you have all these young athletes you get some of these guys could shoot you’re going to have a lot of positional advantages just off of that and I think again like don’t look at next season just sort of look over the next two or three seasons and just sort of see the outline of what they’re trying to get going here yeah Bob Bobby bucket says dad duties never stop I’m sorry guys I apologize In fairness to him it is his bedroom and it is his birthday so I I assume this would happen uh we get a comment here please don’t overanalyze like we’re literally paid to over analy guys like this is what we’re going to do um we try to do as levelheaded as possible I know sometimes I get worked up Amari is the most levelheaded person I’ve ever been around like he never gets up or down or whatever my my thoughts are always all over the place so let’s do this Omari I would like to talk about some second round names at least we don’t have to get in depth I just want to drop some names that are still available at the top and then some guys that may be there at 53 for the Pistons and then we’ll try to answer some questions and close it out after that so we’ll go to a short break here and then we’ll finish it off with those things all right we’re back with segment three and as Bryce alluded to there are some interesting names in the second round like I don’t know if any of these guys would be there at 53 but you look at Johnny Fury and yep Kyle filipowski like these guys who had clear first round Talent that’s L for whatever reason uh you know I guess West your what’s your take on the second round quality right now and like let’s talk about names that could fit as a ho like they have picked 53 but there may be some movement there if you really like a guy yeah so I would say Philip howski Tyler Smith Tyler KCK Johnny Fury those are the big names for me that made it out of the first round and it was guys like Dylan Jones getting into the first round Aj Johnson pakum daier teren Shannon Jr getting into the first round that bumped those guys I I would love if Detroit was able to go up and get I think filipowski would make sense on this team as a foring big be interesting Tyler Smith again a floor spacing forward slash big a little bit more forward but I would like that kic would be a backup point guard if you think they needed that Fury obviously makes sense some other guys like I don’t know the range for these guys but I’ll give you some of the wings that I like Justin Edwards who was a big-time High School recruit and it just didn’t hit but really kind of embraced a three and D archetype at Kentucky Bobby Clinton Melvin uh I think cam chrisy is going to go before they get there I was going to ask about him yeah yeah listen I drafted him drafted him in my most recent mock with Mavs draft I don’t think he gets to 53 but you talk about floor spacing uh Kad Johnson is a guy like Jaylen Bridges Antonio Reeves is a real bucket doesn’t defend but he’s a bucket Quinton post is a guy I sneaky kind of like because he’s an older Prospect he’s massive and he spaces the floor he’s of the names I’ve dropped so far I think he’s the most realistic to be there at 53 and I would love to see Detroit either draft him or get him in as an undrafted free agent no doubt you saw have some interesting guys down there uh like I’d be curious to see if a guy like a cam Christie does end up falling a bit just because he still is a really y really really raw really young Prospect and I’m curious to see if teams are more like we want him as like a a a two-way guy you know we want to bring him in as like you know this or that like I do wonder if his Ron is there will will kick in like how how confident do you feel and it’s the second round so obviously there’s not much confidence especially that late that you could get somebody but are there like back of the second round Nam specifically that you think could be there whether it’s a guy who could sign a two-way go undrafted or it’s just very firmly like in that back half yeah like I think there’s G to be some names I I brought up Quinton post um PJ Hall is another guy that theoretic spaces the floor people have brought up Enrique Freeman that’s an interesting name Isaiah Crawford there’s some names I just don’t know second round gets so crazy right because it’s just do they draft to stash guys do they draft guys because they know they’re gonna take two ways those type of things so uh somebody asked about in R Freeman insane Intel on who this kid is as a person so you want to keep adding like workers um he’s a little bit smaller a little bit under size for what he is but he’s a rebounding machine um he showed some potential to space the floor um I think it was in the game against kraton in the C tournament he really showed that ability so I I have some questions about how he’s gonna score the basketball but he he has really good practical and play strength really physical box out rebounder which I always love may have some versatility as a Defender so there’s some names here Amari I just have no understanding of of where guys are gonna actually go yeah cam Spencer I mean listen Vini loves cam Spencer if he goes to 53 to Detroit I think he would love that so um it will be real interesting yeah I see some Isaiah Crawford fans in the chat so there’s some names here uh I know people love to throw out bronny James like bronny James I feel like he’s going to the Lakers at 55 like that just seems like the most obvious pick that’s going to happen there but yeah I’m excited for this second round and even undrafted free agency for the Pistons Anton Watson is a guy that I like Zion Poland is a guy like I’m definitely talking undrafted free agents now Rees beakman is interesting um I’m trying to think some other guys that just really shoot the ball those those would be some names there as undrafted free agents let’s talk about this real quick and then we can get some questions uh one thing I’m curious about with the new regime is how they use motorc City creu the pist has invested a lot into it I don’t know how much they’ve gotten out of it as far as just an oncourt value standpoint for the Pistons specifically uh just when you look at who they’ve had as you know two-way guys and none of those guys are really establish themselves as NBA guys quite yet um I know we had a question like do you think Ron will play for the cruise next season this and that like I have no idea I have no idea what their plan for the cruise will be but how how many of these guy like but do you feel like this is a a draft you could probably emerge with you know maybe you know a couple two-way guys and uh that they have the tools to really F fill in I guess what’s the Baseline for them compared to like the average draft where you feel like there’s some guys that could really develop in the crews if they go that route yeah I think this thing falls off pretty strongly at a certain point for me and so again it depends on how many of these guys that are ranked a little lower go in the second round because whatever for whatever the reason is or some draft and stash guys that maybe I don’t have ranked as high and do these guys end up falling into undrafted free agency so I think that’s what it’ll really come down to there are going to be interesting names but the other thing is like you have to the player has to want to come to Detroit like I hate to bring up this wound but Austin Reeves literally said no do not draft me in the second round I want to go be undrafted and play for the Lakers on a two-way or start his career on a two-way so there’s a lot of those there’s a lot of those conversations and so it’s just about those connections there and what you’re willing to give and those type of things so I I think there are potential names I just don’t know the mechanisms and how easy it is for trasan and the Pistons to execute those things and that’s why today will be very interesting if they are able to land some of the names I brought up and just because I like them obviously doesn’t mean anything but it would be pretty cool if they landed Akisha Johnson at 50 3 and then got Quinton Post in un you know undrafted free agency or something like that I I would really like you know some of those names if it ended up there so no doubt we’ll get to some questions I always like talking about the late second round guys because that’s just like we could just call that the bright side Simon segment honestly like you know and check out still check out his draft stuff if you haven’t because I know he’s got a lot of second round stuff to inform you uh for you know I’m excited for today like straight up again like I don’t know if my voice is going to hold out or not I am Juiced to do the second round live stream so if you guys don’t have anything going on I don’t believe dbb is going live today Wes thumbs up thumbs down they’re not so no competition here today I can just promote Game Theory come over and watch the second round with Sam and I it’ll be a lot of fun no doubt uh we have about 13 minutes we could dive into yeah some of the questions here uh starting off with YouTube user toping Holland signal that it is more likely to trade some of the young Weaver picks at the deadline does it also signal that Lon is into a slower rebuild basically tank again this year I think there’s a lot we don’t know just given that we got to see how free agency plays out like I’m curious to see who they prioritize in free agency like there’s a lot of Tobias Harris smoke obviously they’re going to go after shooting um I think it’s too early to say at this point I think a lot of that really just comes down to how will guys develop next season how they start and just where the team is looking at the deadline uh but with that like I don’t think Lon is looking at this process like we got to get better immediately like if that’s your priority then you don’t take Ron Holland you take connect or um you know even like a Rob Dillingham or some other guy that’s going to come in with immediate utility as a shooter I mean I don’t think dillingham’s a great fit just because he’s so small and you have so many guards anyway but still like this draft was not a uh we’re going to speak this thinging up draft to me this was a we’re looking at this like a three four five year project so I think next season really is going to set the expectation for the next four years like I think he’s coming in with only so much understanding of the current roster and uh there’s going to be a lot of evaluation a lot of research a lot of learning through the first half of next year uh but I think that deadline will be some sort of pivot I won’t say pivot point I will say at that point he will know sort of what he’s working with and at that point you probably will see more of a willingness to sort of part ways with what was already built here when he came in I will also say just on the Rob Dillingham front I think that’s a great landing spot for him personally I think going to the Timberwolves and being insulated by that trade yeah like I love that trade I still have to figure out the value okay the value of some of this stuff is the the Denny trade value I love Denny i’ be interested to see what Wes thought about the value of that I know he’s a Denny guy um I’m surprised they got two seconds and two first you would think the two first would have sufficed you know yeah it just it seemed but I thought the Mel Bridges trade was so I think what I need to learn is this is a premium right now for sellers in terms of the draft Capital people are getting back um what what I like that for Dillingham is they have the wing Defenders and the rim protector to insulate him on the defensive end so I think he ended up in a good spot if he is gonna succeed to this I’m gonna give West credit because this is not my original idea I’m stealing it from him on Twitter I think that this does signal that maybe they’re not GNA go out and try to get that number two guy like Brandon Ingram or some of the people we’ve talked about that they do fill this out with role players because if you’re D drafting Ron Holland to be a number two next to Cade I don’t know why you’re drafting him like that should be the ultimate thing I don’t know exactly how Wes worded it in his tweet I think he said the moving forward it’s kind of hitch to Kade and Ron or that’s what they’re building around sorry Wes I’m getting your words confused here you may type it into the chat but I think everybody gets the idea and I do think I agree with that if you’re taking Ron Holland at five it’s because obviously you think that higher end outcome is much more more likely than the lower end outcome and if he could be a number two then you don’t want to try to suppress that by bringing in a bi and having to extend him for $45 million a year for the next four years so I I think what this shows is maybe not all the young guys Amari but it’s still G to be the young guys and then hopefully hopefully some real vets who make a lot of sense to insulate and surround them that’s my sense as well you have 64 million in cap space and you could just go so many different ways with that like you could still you know throw 20 million a year at somebody if you want and still have you know 40 plus to maybe take on a bad contract you know maybe sign another you know Wing who could really shoot like you have a lot of flexibility with that 64 million you can go so many different directions with that like Naj Marshall like that’s another I mean obviously Lang is very familiar with him right we love it yeah um you know I like sticking to the long-term plan uh Patrick says like I think you have to after four SE win season you can’t come in like you’re going to win 40 year like that’s just like not only is that mathematically improbable that also I think P puts puts you into a corner if you could overcommit to certain guys early and now you’re kind of stuck in this in like in this hole so I would expect them to slow roll it to the extent that they reasonably can yeah I agree and at the end of the day you we’ve talked about this you can still improve a little bit but set yourself up somewhat for Cooper flag Ace Bailey and some of these guys in the 2025 draft YouTube user ask about badge contracts they could go after I need to go through I just need to go through the league I haven’t got there yet in terms of we we’re not going to talk about this right now because we’re gonna get yelled at um but somebody brought up uh Andrew Wiggins and yeah we’re not gonna talk about that right now uh if we’re calling Holland an upside swing what does it mean for our immediate future okay so we just kind of answered that one as well can Ron play number two next to Kade if we add shooting at forwards or is it more close to a four so I assume he’s saying positionally not roll terms of number one option two option three option I would say yes he’s I think he’s a three I think he’s a wing that would move closer to a guard than a wing that’s gonna move to a forward The more I’ve kind of evaluated and watched him would would you agree Amari I agree but how would you compare that to assar so last I think assar is a forward okay yes we’re like aligned in that last night I’m like I think assar is much more of a forward like an off ball type wing and I see Ron as much more of like a two three hybrid on ball type wing and I would compare him being PA with Kate to like you get Tatum you know Tatum in some capacity is going to be a leite guy for you they take a swing on to Jaylen Brown that could essentially do a lot of the same stuff but some different stuff as well because he’s more athletic and more of an upside swing uh so like we get into position and all that and I think the reality is like you know I don’t know how much the positions really matter you want a protecting big you want two to three guys in the middle who can shoot and defend that you want your playmaker who is Kate and you know I think whether it’s two three four like all that’s really just match up to dependent but in general I think all those guys can be pretty malleable depending on who you put next to them on the floor but I think me and Bryce agree that Ron’s probably more two3 and aar’s probably more 34 in the hierarchy yeah I we may have talked about this you just laid it out but it’s kind of like a one31 roster construction of you have your primary on ball guy you have three whether you want to call them off ball guards wings for whatever you want to call them those three like let’s just call them wings for the sake of Simplicity and then you have the big big man and ideally like you said my favorite archetype is a rim protector and stretch but hopefully he at least protects the rim and there could be some more Nuance than this but Holland definitely fits into just that Wing as you mentioned so does assar but if you really wanted to get into a three or a four whatever I think there is some difference between those guys can we talk about Kaden how much they flesh out this roster to get him some Shooters yeah like it they have to like it didn’t we’ve talked about this they weren’t going to do it in just the draft so I agree here Nick they have to put some floor spacing around Cade and hopefully they’re able to do I would love I I wish I could find the big man that spaces the floor I just haven’t been able to find it in free agency maybe there’s a trade those guys are hard to come by um but yeah if they that Wing forward if they can add some shooting that would be huge um what vets could help us win games with the current roster Naji Marshall is a name that we’ve talked about quite a bit uh let me pull up do you have any other names straight yeah I do I actually did a uh like I just did a story looking at a lot of the names um that they could pursue last week and I’m trying to pull it up now but there are like a lot of like midrange free agents you know veteran guys who could come in immediately and I think help this team out um I cannot find my story right now though but this is a good like this isn’t a good fre agency if you want to make a big swing it’s a good fre agency if you just want to find some guys who are going to make between you know I think uh eight and like 16 17 million a year and just really full a row like Naji Marshall does he get more than 13 14 like you know I I’m assuming not uh so some other names uh Gary Trent junior is a name kentavius calwell Pope is out there potentially depending on what is with his player option um Gary Harris uh Patrick Williams Obi toppins DeAnthony Melton is an interesting name to me I know a lot yeah I know hartenstein is listen Tobias Harris I know is very polarizing but on the right deal as like a plan B Kelly UB just come off a really interesting year uh Tobias Harris could come in and do some of the things they would be asking for that we’re talking about here um not a long-term answer I said what Patrick million oh I was GNA bring up hartenstein I think that one gets interesting now with what the Knicks did because based on the mechanism of the trade right now they are going to be hard capped at the first apron which really hurts their money situation now I think they saved some cap last night with all the trades they made but the between that and what they gave OG Jaylen Smith there’s a good name that’s an interesting name there I’ve seen that a couple times hartenstein isn’t that stretch big and so that’s why I go back a back and forth a little bit with him because he doesn’t do that even though I love his game Jaylen Smith is a great name there from Big Dog Pistons he is that’s a player option um with him so you know if he doesn’t take that uh Derrik Jones Jr we talked about you know he’s an unrestricted free agent as well so there there are some names out there I I like the idea of just kind of winning on the margins with these Jonas valent chunis I see as a name that people are bringing up in the chat as well Malik Beasley Malik Beasley so these are the names this Goa baz like if you want a room protector like I think he’s great Gary Harris buddy Hill drik Jones he mention him na mentioned him Doug mcdermont DeAnthony Belton mentioned him UB uh tyan Prince Gary Trent Jr like those are all guys who I think feel those Rose to some extent yeah no so there’s to your point none of these guys are needle movers right Omari none of these guys are second star but the pick of Holland and what he could potentially be makes it even more sense to just go with these type of role players that fit into these three and D archetypes so I I think this is going to be the path I was going to see if I could just look through some potential trade candidates um do we have another what what other questions we have here uh here here’s one that maybe you would have Amari I don’t know yeah no updates right now like I haven’t heard anything you might read the question just for the podcast listeners my bad any update on thear S is he practice 100% or is he still rehabing but playing the summer league like I think like I don’t have a summer league answer yet like you know I haven’t heard anything that suggest he hasn’t been rehabbing okay but I think the next three weeks will be pretty telling as far as where he’s at as far as getting back on the floor so that’s a little bit of a TBD but you know I don’t think there’s any reason to worry about that right now um you know you mentioned Kade Cunningham’s extension earlier I think what I actually reached out to Keith Smith I said hey is this um Scotty Barnes extension what we should probably expect for Kate Cunningham and His short answer was yes so if you guys kind of want to get an idea of what the Cade contract and extension would look like that is something that maybe you know you can go check out what Scotty got and that might be something that we could be looking at for Cade’s numbers I’m just scrolling spot track here I said it right this time so everybody that yelled at me and Wes on Twitter about saying incorrectly spot track thank you Keith for correcting me there so I’m just scrolling that and looking at you know contracts by size and seeing guys who maybe teams would want to get off of and there’s no names that stand out I I mean like is Cam Johnson another name that would be brought up now with Brooklyn wanting to sell off in tank it would be uh I mean it would be brought up I think the issue was that the Pistons aren’t necessarily buyers in the sense that they have draft picks that they can invest in the prospects so you know you’re probably looking more at at like salary dumps than like players you actually have to sacrifice assets same thing with kuzma there yeah um yeah like there’s not I mean Tim Hardway Jr is the name right yeah I did a trade story too like I looked at a guy like a Robert Williams III like uh he’s had injury issues you know Portland just drafted klling in like I know everybody’s looking at well you know they’re going to have to trade um you know they’re going to have to trade Aon but I’m curious to see what happens with Robert Williams he has two years off on this deal uh they just keep him as a backup like he’s only making like 12 million a year just with his injury issues and the fact that they’re goingon to have a roster Crunch and the fact that they have to save money like I just wonder if that’s a guy that could be a potential salary dump type of Target if it comes down to it yeah so there’s some names out there the Tim Hardway Jr one was interesting um he’s very inconsistent uh back to cber too on that roster fit pretty well somebody was like I think what I saw was like thj for Quinton Grimes I’m like no why why am I why am I including Quinton Grimes in that I never just keep Grimes you know yeah I’ll just keep Quinton Grimes in that situation I’m good so I don’t know what like the picks and stuff would be there so um yeah this is interesting with Portland getting Denny as Jeremy Grant a trade candidate and for the record there Wes said he thought the Denny trade was on the high end of fair and you know obviously um you know Wes is a huge D obia fan uh fantastic coverage guys is it harder to develop a good shooter or a high energy Defender it seems tra it seems traan see it seems Tran prefers the ladder like prefers the ladder yeah we could probably close on this one I questions I think it’s harder to develop a high energy Defender because I think shooting like both of those aspects are mental but I think shooting is a lot more mechanical and Reps whereas energy can’t really be taught like I think that’s just something you innately have or you don’t that’s why after you see guys with motor issues like just become High motored guys out of nowhere like I do think there’s just some stuff that’s just inherent to you as like an athlete you know motor is like one of those things that’s really tough to fix once you’re in the NBA or even like defensive effort like you could like you see guys who get into like very set teams that are contending in a very specific Road in very specific schemes who can like do that but if you come in as like a weak Defender like I would expect conect to come into Detroit and like become like you know this lock down like high energy guy when he wasn’t that in college I think that’s a lot more than Nate like I’m curious to see if you feel differently Bryce like you’ve played and Coast far more basketball than I have but it’s just like you see guys like become good Shooters in the back half of their career it’s not as often you see guys that came in with like reputation as a poor Defenders so just become like lock down guy yeah has that duties like you know we’re we’re over the clock now uh no we’re good us usually he doesn’t just storm in like that he’s Taking Liberties today it’s his birthday so he thinks he can do whatever he wants his day we’re gonna we’re gonna have to have a little talk about this after the the podcast is over no um I think the the fun comparison here is does Dalton connect become better defensively or does Ron Holland figure out his jump shot if you’re just asking me those two I think it’s probably Ron Holland with the jumper I will say like my view of this is a little different because as a coach I have way more confidence in developing give me the shooters and I will teach them to play defense here’s the difference though Amari I’ve coached at a high school level and college and worked with those like that’s different than the NBA there’s a lot of athletic ability that comes into the defensive thing as well so Ron has those things the motor the energy the athleticism the length all of that stuff and so for him yeah like I would I would bet more on Ron developing the jumper I think then connect becoming a even neutral Defender probably is is what I would say um that’s a really really good questioning thinking you can teach defenses nuts yeah like it’s just like you know it’s like we asked trasan about that last Friday uh why can I not teach defense interesting you know and trasan was just like it’s just wanting to do it like he was just very clear like defense is a want to you know type thing and again I just think those habits when you get to the NBA level like those habits are established when you get in or you establish them immediately like you do see guys come in and just be locked down but to me it just seems like long term you’re probably better off with a prospect that can really get after it in every way except the shooting if you think that that shooting can be fixed a bit I think the easier thing to develop defensively and show is the team defense I think that’s where you can teach Defenders and make real growth some guys are just going to be limited on the ball right based on athletic ability yeah right okay yeah I I don’t know um you can teach scheme and technique but you can’t teach defensive awareness I I I agree with if you’re not like like if you’re not a a point of attack guy coming then like what are the ass that you’re just G yeah I agree with that 100% right like if dton connect can’t bend at you know on the ball in against SEC like is he gonna be able to bend and stay in front of guys in the NBA I think that’s real yeah listen I think you can sit down with guys watch film and teach them scheme and where to be and things to recognize and you can show them hey this is where you’re missing things this is what you need to look out for that’s my opinion on the scheme and and the tech and those type of things and I think you can you can teach Matthew says technique there’s some technique things things that will help people um as well be a little bit better in some of those situations like if you’re a Boston Celtics I’m like you probably take connect like I trust that connect will be a solid Team Defender with the Celtics but I trust that Holland will be a good shooter with the Pistons so I think a lot of that kind of comes down to like what infrastructure you have in place as well like a bad defensive team drafting a bad Defender and saying we need you to become a good Defender probably is not a good plan I think you need some sort of uh like infrastructure in place to kind of help them make that transition easier yep all right let’s cut it off here we will be back I mean it’s Thursday right now we’ll be back either Sunday or Monday and you know we we’ll have a second round pick to well no we’re not gonna be back Sunday or Monday what did we decide we’ll be back depends on how free agency plays out we’ll figure it out like free agency opens Sunday so it’s going to be very much kind of play by ear next week I’m might even make sense to hop back on Sunday and just talk free agency like even but we’ll figure that out we’ll keep you guys posted on you know YouTube Twitter and whatnot yep we will let you guys know thank you for everybody that tuned in um hit the like button hit subscribe if you want to continue to listen to what we’re bringing it’s an exciting few weeks here between a second round pick today hopefully at least one maybe more who knows summer league coming up free agency all of that and then we’ll get into the dog days of my fun food takes and Lawn Care absolutely this was a good day I feel like for our listeners we got on at 9:30 or like 9:40 and we are taking people from when it get into the office to their lunch break like I want to know how many people were at work listening to us cuz this is sneakily this is one of my like things that I would love to know that people are legit at work in their office hiding from their boss watching the Pistons puls that would be that would be the ultimate compliment to us being a good podcast is people kind of skipping work to listen to us uh there we go outwork I love it thank you yeah I like it too like the idea of people not working L thing to us just like makes me so happy like keep your jobs by all means don’t don’t let us get you fired but I like that I really like that I mean you might get get fired it’s okay but no and if you’re listening while you mow your lawn today I respect you and appreciate you for taking care of your lawn and making it look nice team lawn care for all of those people yeah we got a few people at work you guys made my day love you guys so much home office um Bryce I should get the law care uh takes off today like I did I got way more support to that than I expected so you always get more support I don’t know what it is people just have it out against me I have the the like I feel like I’m the people’s takes like I speak for the people in some way boss boss makes a dollar I make a dime that’s why I listen on company time that’s right that’s right I love it let’s close it out with that Omari yeah what did sh say I got hurt on coupley time I he a coupy time all right uh big thanks to our audio producer Robin Chan our editor-in chief the co Avery Nichols and then shout out to West Davenport as always and we’ll talk to you all next week

The Pistons Pulse is your go-to Detroit Pistons podcast for all the best news, analysis, insights and opinions on the team.

Hosted by Omari Sankofa of the Detroit Free Press and Bryce Simon of Motor City Hoops. Omari brings insider insights and analysis as a Pistons beat writer and Detroit native combined with Bryce’s in-depth on-court analysis as a former D1 player and current high school coach of 12 years.

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